Addicted to Too Human: Gaming Crack & Rabbit Holes (XboxOZ360)

The author takes a detailed look at the depth of Too Human's RPG and loot systems, comparing them favourably to PC staples such as Diablo & World of Warcraft along with more recent console titles such as Mass Effect and Oblivion.

But he also has some things to say about those who've been less than friendly towards the title:

"It's an incredibly sad day in this industry when people who call themselves gamers decide to attack a game simply for being different and outside the box of mainstream conventions. I may have been a cynic of this title in the past but I've never advocated nor endorsed the disgraceful behaviour of many anonymous gamers who have openly wished for this or any other game's failure.

Any gamer who genuinely wishes developers to continue to innovate, push the medium and invent new IP should be wishing this game all the best, whether they personally like Too Human or not. Otherwise we may well find a day with an uninspired industry producing one homogeneous product simply because some people's misguided wishes came true."

Continued after the jump...

[Chandresh Patel]

No,that's not why people attacked the game:They attacked it(At least,those who own Xboxs),they attacked it because it truly is a love it or hate it experience.They hated it.Nothing wrong with someone not liking a game,people have different tastes and opinions.

My experience with Too Human:Not good.I won't go on forums screaming Too Human 'sucks',seeing as how the game doesn't 'suck'.It's just not a very high quality game imo.

[Superfragilistic]

I know what you're getting at.

But I think he's talking more about haters with no specific cause... Particularly when he says "gamers who have openly wished for this or any other game's failure"

And I agree with his sentiments, but call me crazy but I swear he paraphrased a discussion I was havin with some others in another Too Human article a couple of days back! Sneaky bugger. lol

[Chandresh Patel]

It's only their blind fanboyism that's doing all the talking,they need to actually play the games before labeling them 'failures'.

And even labeling the games as 'failures',is just a personal opinion.One mans 'gold' is another mans trash...

[Superfragilistic]

Bubbles for that last post Patel. I couldn't agree more. :)

EDIT: @facepalm. Yeah I think the Molyneux-effect is pretty apt, although for me Too Human has only been on my serious interest radar since all the GAF stuff, so my perception of hype may be much lowers than others who've been waiting for years. :)

[facepalm]

Hmmm.... That quote that posted reminded me of another game that was released this year that was "different and outside of the box" in terms of gameplay...

::cough Alone in the Dark cough::

But just like Chandresh Patel said it's either you "Hate" the controls or you "Love" it. I personally didn't enjoy my time with the "Too Human" demo, but I'm pretty sure that there are people out there who love it as much as I hate it.

But the main reason for me criticizing this game goes beyond just the controls. For the hype that this game is getting in these past years, and past history of the "Too Human" franchise, I expected a game that would be more polished and epic... (And then there's the voice acting, which is "meh" in my opinion.)

The game is not "bad", but it's suffering from the "Molyneux-effect". Hyped but did not live up to it.

^-^ I guess the hype machine made me become more jaded.

@Superfragilistic: Totally agree... Some people have kept an eye on this project since the good ole' PS1 days... ::looks in the mirror:: And to see where it's at right now it's pretty disappointing. But it's good to know that people still love the game despite it's flaws and are not effected by the "Molyneux-effect" as much as the people who do remember the showing at E3 1999...

Most "true" gamers don't want any game to fail, but we do want to voice our opinions and point out flaws, so that the developers can fix them in their next game.

[StephanieBBB]

People either hate it or love it (as you said). But those who love it are kinda making an crusade against those who dosn't like it saying "we'll you haven't played it enough" or "you can't rate it like any other game". Guess what, I've played the demo, but as I've seen here saying what you think about Too human on this site will get you banned so ill keep my opinion to myself.

[xm15e2s]

We can't forget that there are a lot of very bitter PS3 owners who take comfort in seeing Xbox 360 exclusives fail. It is my belief that these people jumped on the "Too Human sucks" bandwagon that was first launched by (equally) bitter journalists.

It is a nasty combination (bitter fanboys and journalists with an agenda) but in the end I think Too Human's Mighty Hammer of Awesomeness will crush them all. lol

[GarandShooter]

'I’ve never advocated nor endorsed the disgraceful behaviour of many anonymous gamers who have openly wished for this or any other game’s failure.'

Now if we can see the logic in this sentiment why can't we apply the same logic to the consoles themselves?

'We can't forget that there are a lot of very bitter PS3 owners who take comfort in seeing Xbox 360 exclusives fail.'

Kind of reminds you of the attitude 360 owners held towards Haze, doesn't it?

[Rock Bottom]

He's talking about me!

[sumfood4u]

RPG consist of indebt storys, mutli quest, an magic spells! this reminds me more of Star Wars over Everquest! Most RPG stand out with dynamic story an gameplay, not just graphics, examples are try playing PSone Suikoden 2, Breath of Fire 3, an GC/N64 Zelda OOT, an experience a world of Uber RPG!

[rhood022]

I think the reason I hated the Too Human demo is because of what it tries to combine.

First, I haaaate World of Warcraft and dungeon-crawling grinders in general. But for a game like that, collecting better gear and spending those XP is a necessity to continue the story and pushing deeper into the world.

With Too Human, I just don't see the significance of this loot grabbing and grinding because it bears no significance in the outcome or playability of the game. Unless adding a status changing piece of gear or power effects the story in anyway your basically collecting for the sake of collecting.

Even Dennis states that the game is only longer if you try to collect all the different loot. That just seems like busy work to me.

[Superfragilistic]

Yeah but in this article/preview he talks about the loot affecting what he calls the "physicality" of gameplay, as in different loot means your control over the character is different. I remember IGN writing something along those lines to.

But it would make a lot more sense if there was PvP. Maybe that's what'll be in DLC or a sequel?

EDIT: They do scale. Both in class, level, variety and power. Apparently that was why 4 player co-op was too hectic for higher difficulties where almost every enemy was a level 50! lol

[rhood022]

Yeah, and I get what he's saying. But for me, I could care less about playing the game x number of times to find a piece of armor that boosts my speed or strength when the enemies probably wouldn't scale to these changes, like they would in WOW.

I can't say for sure on this, however, but it doesn't seem like it would be possible to scale enemies given the significant amount of loot the devs are boasting. I would assume patches but you never know.

I also wouldn't a sword or gun that shoots fire or poisons or whatever for the same reason.

[Superfragilistic]

-

[Superfragilistic]

Or maybe it's just someone impersonating Dyack? lol

[Silogon]

Man they're trying everything in the book to sell this game and it's just not working. Waht next, giving it away in yardsales and then counting those as retail? Please, Too Human sucks monkey F*CK and that is all there is to it.

[bootsielon]

"1 - juuken is so fugly i wouldn't fvck her with nasims c0ck
too human is great !
It just takes time and skill to get the most out of it !
Graphics are ok but after all the setbacks i will let it slide ( like juukens c0ck into nasims but )
I cant wait to see th2 ! "

Another dumb Xbot that has to sink to lowest level. Predictable.

[zapass]

she must've hit a nerve :D

"Any gamer who genuinely wishes developers to continue to innovate, push the medium and invent new IP should be wishing this game all the best, whether they personally like Too Human or not"

Translation:

"The Fuhrer wants you to buy, play and like this game. It is a patriotic duty, the xbox nation is in danger, all xbots must follow so suck it up and love the turd"

It's funny how anytime they try to innovate, it's a pathetic mess.

[DarthTigra]

The damage controll that this game is reciving is crazy. People arent hating on it because it dies something new,there hating on it becasue it isnt half as good as denis dyack would have you to belive.

[thenickel]

And once again that's strictly opinion.

[nice_cuppa]

to its defence aye !
Its ok if you like her (him) bud !
Each to there own !
What game out this month do you like ?

[Silogon]

Who Junken? ahhahahaha, yeah we're best buds me and her. Just ask her.

As for your question, this month not much.

Madden sucked
Too human sucked
Soul Caliber sucked; but that was last month

I can go on and on about how much suck games suck right now... Braid and Bionic Commando rearmed are actually my most played at the moment, though. Those are both really good.

Looking forward to next year more than anything. This year doesn't offer me anything aside from what it did 2 years ago.

Gears 2
Resistance 2
Motorstorm 2

See where this is going?

[nice_cuppa]

but i just dont like nasim
So what game out this month are you guys into ?

[Qbanboi]

Well i just got a 360 yesterday, and downloaded the demo with the tale of visperia one. I didn't like Too Human that much; i don't know why, maybe was because of the camera or maybe that i didn't understood sh*t of what i was doing, but i don't think it is a bad game just not my kind of game.

[edhe]

Try it again, it plays much better second time around.

Whilst you're downloading demos - get the crackdown one.

[DA_SHREDDER]

I think its really sad when a game is in development for almost a decade and sucks as bad as this game does. I know im known for being a sony fanboy,, but I do have a 360, and I really was expecting alot more out of this game. Its not like we want games to fail. This game didn't though, not in sales anyways, but really this game should be alot better for as long as they have been working on it.

Dyack is not a bad person, but he is a bad game developer and complete pc nerd. He should stick to making pc games. Only a freakin dork would like Too Human. Ive seen games with more fun factor being made in under a year. Imagine if Kojima had 10 years to work on one game?

[kevnb]

Silicon Knights doesn't make pc games, and it isn't as if the version of Too Human they were making on the ps1 has much to do with the version they made for the 360.

[The Lazy One]

this game wasn't developed for 10 years. A game with the same name and a completely different story and gameplay in a similar universe started development a long time ago. The development on this game has been something like 3-5 years.

[divideby0]

this game was a must buy...now a probable rental
crippling the game to 2 player CoOP is a DISGRACE for this late in this generation of consoles.
anyone who played the demo realizes graphically its OK, but nothing to be blown away by and the gameplay is very repetitive..
looting ho's will get into the game, and the 60 hrs of gameplay I have read is just by maxing out your character and not really 60 hrs of innovative gameplay.
I dont mean to be harsh, but this is just another Haze type exclusive mess up

[DeZimatoR]

This coming from a XBox 360 fansite does sound awfully like damage control.

Its like when people were trying to prove that everyone who trashed Haze was wrong..

If you like the game, you'll enjoy it no matter what ppl say, no need to try and make it look like the game is awesome when others think its not (specially when thats the general thought across the board). Just play the game, period.

[NanoGeekTech]

The demo was Blahhhh...I hoped Too Human would be a killer app but it looks like a rental...it did make me turn on my 360 and downloaded it about two weeks or so ago....

I guess I was expecting too much....form Too Human..MS needs something else besides Halo and GOW they need a Killer app that would make splash in the industry.....I not really too excited about my 360 at all.......

[ApocalypseShadow]

"AVERAGE GAME."

but it's getting a whole lot of defending from certain people to get other people to like it when they obviously ***DON'T LIKE IT***.and i won't call you out super frag,but you seem to be at the forefront of defending this game.but not other games(i wonder why).

BIG HIT GAMES DON'T NEED DEFENDING.dennis has gone out of his way to defend this game,when clearly,it's not top tier in graphics,gameplay,control or camera.there are other devs of bigger and smaller games who aren't trying to change people's minds about their game.either you like it or not.

1)you can watch a video and know if it's an up and coming star or an average game.

2)you can play a demo and know if a game is poor or not.

3)you can watch your friend play a game in front of you and know if it's a game for you.

but there are individuals who are claiming that if you don't like this game,you are not a gamer.if you want this game to fail,you are not a gamer,if you don't have any intention of buying the game,but post your ***OPINION***,you are not a gamer.

a lot of gamers downloaded the demo.but that DOESN'T mean that gamers are going to buy 1 million copies or more of this game.they wanted to know if they are going to like it for themselves.but we get an article on N4G that tries to push the idea that this game is a hit.and again,as always,microsoft pulls out useless numbers about how many downloaded the demo.

nintendo doen't post how many downloaded a virtual console game.sony didn't post how many bought GT5:P online or how many downloaded the siren demo.but microsoft posts how many downloaded THIS game.but has never posted download amounts of other games.

WHY IS THAT?because it is an average looking game with average combat with a poor camera and what looks like a weak story.it is untold legends,marvel ultimate alliance,and every other average dungeon crawler,rolled up into one game.

10 years of off and on ideas,and this game is the result.when before,the game had more promising ideas.this game is getting defense because of the lack of great first party games coming out of microsoft's group of games for fall 2008.

the game informer review will not be the last bad review for this game.you can't prevent it.let it go.not everyone likes it.even 360 gamers don't like it.and it's not a game a person would buy a 360 for.maybe gear of war.but surely not THIS game.

apocalypse.......

[NanoGeekTech]

:)

[Superfragilistic]

Nice post mate. We have different opinions about the game in question but you argued your point well. Bubbles up! :)

As for me defending other games. You don't need to look back too far for my defense of Little Big Planet a couple of days back ( http://www.n4g.com/NewsCom-... ), and similar efforts for World at War, Banjo Kazooie, Viva Pinata and Resistance 2 can be found if you look back far enough.

I agree that some defend with the hope of turning others, but that's never my own intention. It's rather to stick up for games which may not be perfect but are copping an unfair wrap from those who are either misunderstand a concept, contradict their own logic or simply hate on a title.

As I've said many times before if you don't like something as a gamer, that's fine, because there's plenty of other games for you to move on to the next one, but there's no reason one should hate or wish a title to flop simply because they don't like it. That just robs your gaming colleagues of games they may themselves find enjoyable.

Cheers. :)

Super.

[N00BZSUCKASS]

if by different you mean have a sh1t combat system which feels more like the original tomb raider's garbage "grid" walking system, then yeah.

this game should have tried harder to be like god of war. maybe it wouldn't have sucked.

[pp]

Too Human is going to be a great game and exclusive to xbox360 i can't wait to play it

[Alpha_Gamer]

you always have the most simple-minded comments. lol.

[ApocalypseShadow]

and those who played these games ,know what i'm talking about....

if your next gen game that tries to be a great dungeon crawler/action rpg/level up/etc, can't outdo:

diablo
icewind dale
balder's gate
champions of norrath
etc

then,don't expect gamers to like it.they don't need to play it 10 times to like it.

rent it and move on.if you like it,buy it and move along.

but,..."big games don't need defense."

apocalypse........

EDIT:thanks for accepting my ***OPINION***

i have bought many a game that got low scores on many systems over the years.i liked way of the samurai because the devs were the original makers of tenchu.but it got 6's everywhere.but i loved the multiple endings.i liked superman:shadow of the apocalypse.but it got canned too.but i liked it because i liked the superman cartoons before justice league.from atari all the way to now,

i have never seen a dev defend this much.they just take the criticism and move on to make an even better game.the same devs that made syphon filter at 989 used to make terrible games(my opinion).but syphon was a surprise hit.that shocked me.

but it's either good or bad.even on ps3,there are games that just were a joke.like spiderman 3.how it turned out worse than number 2,i will never know.same with genji 2.loved one.but 2 was weak and had just poor direction.but with those other games,"I HAD FUN."and that's all that mattered.

but thanks.have a bubble.

apocalypse......

[pow3r of t3h c3ll]

man xbots are getting desperate, they are running badly out of games so they have to post these crappy comfort articles!

Why do M$ have no conference at leipzig?

Its because they have nothing new coming out cus the xbox has no future after gears 2!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

[pp]

Hahahahaha 1 bubble so so sad

[RAF-TECH]

hmmmm...
what should I get...
This or Tales of Vesperia..

click "agree for too human"
"disagree for Tales of Vesperia"

[NewSchoolGamer]

for 10minutes at my freind's house. It was fun and the only bad thing noticed was the bad camera angle, it was just weird.(it was only 15 minutes though)

I asked him if he was going to buy it and he told me that he had to spend money on fallout 3 and gears of war 2 instead abd even if he had more money he would buy a racing game instead.

Too Human seems like a bad game although fun.

[Mao]

The media is jumping all over this one to reverse poor initial thoughts of the title. Why? I don't know, and I don't care. Where was this love affair when Lair came along? Why were no sites praising the sixaxis controls and saying not to hate it cause it does something different?

If the game is garbage, it's garbage. Get over it. It's sad, I was hoping this game would turn out alright.

[power of Green]

The attacks and the need for it to be "garbage" is even more amazing, as if your opinion counts, you troll every single 360 thread with a plain as day anti MSFT agenda.

[GarandShooter]

PoG, who are you to decide whose opinion counts, doesn't everyone's count? You yourself seem to have an anti-Sony agenda, though I will give you credit for not trolling the PS3 threads.

[silverchode]

he has other accounts to troll in ps3 news.

[NextGen Exempt]

"... you troll every single 360 thread with a plain as day anti MSFT agenda."

DO YOU KNOW HOW IRONIC THAT IS COMING FROM YOUR MOUTH? You're such a moron, does it not COMPLETELY slip your mind that you are without a doubt the person with the BIGGEST anti-Sony agenda on this website, and you also happen to troll EVERY article and share your idiotic, illogical agenda with everyone? Are you really that ignorant?

[IQUITN4G]

Some games or in this case demo, obviously do need playing more than the once.I didn't much enjoy Too Human on my first trawl through it and decided i'd be wise to play it some more.Second time was better and by the 4th or 5th go i was very much enjoying it.

Halo 3 was quite a disappointment to me at first also having built it up to enormous levels in my head and i felt a lot of bitterness at what was not my imagined Halo 3.After playing through a second time and then various goes on fave levels or parts, i discovered how in actual fact H3 is the best Halo so far regarding how much fun the combat is.Halo1 is still my preferred as a whole but H3 is staggeringly good, i just needed to play it more than the once to understand this.I could have so easily sold my Halo3 and that would have left me an opinion that in truth i wouldn't have been at all happy if i knew then what i know now.

It's not every game that you can work out if it's good or not but certainly you can decide if you're currently liking it or not - but even then this doesn't necessarily mean it's a good choice on your part considering you may have ended up actually loving the game had you stuck with it

Sometimes i kick myself for judging those first impressions and often i have had to get a game back.

In truth people don't always know what it is they really do want and decisions made mean sometimes never finding this out.A perfect example for me would be when i was on the verge of selling my Halo1 on the strength that it wasn't really doing it for me - it is now my most adored of franchises and i just thank my lucky stars i never did that insanely stupid thing after all.For had i sold this truly magnificent game, i would never have known the joy i have playing this the Halo's over and over again - even more so for H3

I'm not suggesting Too human is the next Halo but had i just given up on the demo like so many bone heads obviously have, i'd be the one missing out, only i wouldn't know it.

And of course people always think they are right so an argument like this is a waste of time

[kenshin22up]

I dont understand why you think it's okay for devs to make games that need to be played more than once in order to be enjoyable. That's like saying, here take this crappy sedan (for the same price as an Acura).. it doesn't run well and may only go at 40km/hr and takes at least 5 tries to start up but after driving it for two months you'll get used to the problem and will not mind them anymore and just put up with it, and you'll learn to appreciate that the car takes you to where you want to go despite its annoyances.

I mean yeah good for you if you wanna be suckered into it but I would rather buy a car that works 100% for the same price, it's not like Too human is discounted for being such a meh game.. I mean aside from the "loot system" and the maybe the skill tree/character classes, the game is MEH in every way. Meh graphics, horrible camera, meh length, only 2 player coop, and meh combat.

For the record I played the demo and I hated it.

[The Lazy One]

Too human isn't a crappy game you get used to. It's a good game that you need to get used to before it gets good.

it's like a plane vs a helicopter. A plane you can handle reasonably with only the flight stick and the throttle. You try to fly a helicopter after doing that, and you probably will need a little bit more time to get used to working all the extra things before you can even get off the ground safely.

[IQUITN4G]

Who said anything about it being ok for devs to deliberately go this route.

I'm saying that sometimes a game just might not click and you may be doing yourself a favour if you play more to find out.You don't have to do this

Most people can only stomach one play through and that's just fine if that's what they choose.But for a demo like Too Human, they're not 100% going to know by the end of it if this particular game is for them or not.An assumption can be made but in TH's case that obviously isn't enough considering most only see the game as a slasher to start off with.The one playthrough only of Too Human is actually enough to put you off playing it frankly.

Assumptions are made all the time and for most of the time they will be correct of course but Too Human has stuff hidden awkwardly behind a seemingly action only based adventure beat em up - people wont even realize the rpg side of things and will pass it off as merely a slasher, when in actual fact they wanted something a bit deeper.More time spent with this particular demo might for some, discover an element to TH that they like after all - they might be glad they did play for a second time, they may not

Sorry but you obviously don't get my point

[The Lazy One]

-The majority of loot options
-use of all the different weapon types and how they affect gameplay
-weapon blueprints
-challenges and rewards for them
-getting higher up in the skill tree (If you check everything in the demo you can get about 3 levels higher than otherwise)
-intricacies of combat and how to use them affectively
-gameplay of the different classes.

The game plays completely differently depending on how you level up and which class you play. You'll miss a lot of the core concepts of the game if you're only looking at the combat. Just like you'd probably hate any final fantasy if you look at it just for it's combat.

[dkgshiz]

It got a 6/10 give it up already.

[user9422077]

lol at 6/10

[avacadosnorkel]

I got the Game Informer issure today and Too Human didn't get a very good review. I don't think it will matter because 360 owners will eat it up and praise it because it's one of their own. But had it been a 3rd party multiplatform release made by anybody (say EA for example) I seriously doubt anybody would care about it.

[thenickel]

I think 360 gamers that pick it up will be gamers that actually enjoyed the demo. GI's opinion doesn't matter and is worthless simply because I can form my own opinion and have been doing it for the past 30 years in gaming. When i pick up my copy this week I will gladly post my opinion of it and tell you all what I think since none of you are picking it up anyway.

[xm15e2s]

Yup, I really don't care what a reviewer says about Too Human. I loved the demo and can only imagine how cool the full game is going to be.
Who cares if Joe Blow from (insert magazine here) didn't enjoy it? Some of my favorite movies are hated by a lot of movie reviewers. Does that stop me from watching them? Nope.

Different strokes for different folks...

[etownone]

I have to rent it and give it a real chance, but its definitely not a DAY 1 purchase for this year....
those go to:
1. Star Wars
2. Far Cry 2
3. Gears of War 2

[Mr402]

That being said I played the demo and was not impressed. That's why this game is getting so much attention. You have two different camps out there sweating in my opinion a very forgettable game. Those that buy this day one aren't fools they want this kind of game to succeed so they support it. Those like myself who fail to see the greatness will rent this and unless the multiplayer is compelling (Which is what they should have shown in the demo) most will likely beat it once and then ditch it. You watch just like Ninja Gaiden 2 (The game also disappointed) you will see a ton of these in the used section of your local gamestore. That's always a good indication of a game's quality.