Sega thinks Nintendo should help with mature content on Wii

According to SEGA France & Spain CEO James Rebours, Nintendo should provide more mature games to the Wii to help third publishers making good sells with their games. But he also confirms that MadWorld has a rather positive sells sheet and that the success is enough therefore.

And Sega still have mature games to come to Wii even what was said before.

[N4g_null]

I think this guy should be fired. I mean why the hell was he hired to promote these games and get them to sell. Nintendo actualy went to malls to let people play their games. Doesn't sound expensive word of mouth never is.

Wii gamers are not sheep they are lasped hardcore gamers and adults. when you get that then you will have checks to cash.

[Gr81]

I mean 3 years in and third parties are still complaining? The thing I love about the Wii audience is they are not blinded by hype, like you say they/we aren't sheep.

I love how the Wii exposes the talented devs from the talentless devs. Capcom is going to find out real quick that they are a console developer, lol. The newest casualty will be Dark Void.

[PirateThom]

Wii audience not blinded by hype?

Top selling Wii games, not including Wii Sport or Wii Play (since people bought that for the controller):

Wii Fit
Mario Kart Wii
New Super Mario Bros. Wii
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Super Mario Galaxy
Wii Sports Resort
Mario Party 8
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
Link's Crossbow Training
Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games

So, there's 6 Mario games, 2 Zelda games and 2 hyped casual games.

Way to go Wii owners, keep living the dream.

[asdr3wsfas]

"So, there's 6 Mario games, 2 Zelda games and 2 hyped casual games."

Nintendo franchises are hyped? Nintendo has made some of the highest quality games for decades and that's why we buy them. If there's any hype it's because nintendo has been making and reinventing these franchises before most of those other companies existed (bungie did but as a pc/mac game dev back then). Mario signifies quality because the core mario titles have been good games SINCE THE MID 1980s.

Oh yeah, link's crossbow training is a rail shooter bundled with the wii zapper, real good example. Have you even played these games?

6 mario games...like those aren't all fundamentally different game play. I can't believe you counted SSBB as a mario game. Hilarious, there's like 10 characters on the cover and IIRC zelda is bigger than mario so it should be 5 mario games, 3 zelda games...

"Way to go Wii owners, keep living the dream."

Seeing as you named several of the highest rated games this generation I think I will. SMG is what, the highest ranked game ever? You forgot metroid prime trilogy though.

The difference is when I want some change of pace I'll play mass effect and irkuga on 360 or maybe LBP on ps3. Enjoy missing some of the best franchises out there. Is that what gamers do now? Years ago we used to buy them all. Need more allowance?

Wii sports resort is fun but there's no convincing you I guess. A sword fighting game where you swing the controller like a sword is hyped for a reason.

"Man, I just hit X, O, O, X and I did like this wicked sword slice."

"I swing the controller like an actual sword."

Which is cooler?

PS, you have wii fit, wii sports resort, and mario party on your list yet you count 2 casual games and 6 mario titles. Casual is a bullsh!t phrase but you can't even apply it consistently because you don't know nintendo games that well. Hilarious.

[mastiffchild]

There's some truth to what I suspect he means though, isn't there? Nintendo could look at doing a lot more for third party developers as well as third party devs could learn a lot from seeing the work Ninty themselves put into their games and marketing techniques on the Wii.

It's all well and good moaning at Capcom who've insulted Wii gamers with some truly awful games of late(seriously, MH3 aside what have they done? Zack and Wiki is their best actuallly made FOR Wii title and they didn't market it at all, that apart there's the two great ports and what else? Nothing but reheats, rail shooters noone wanted and dross like CTYD! Crap that wouldn't be tolerated on PS360 so they CAN shut the hell up!)but I think Sega should at least be listened to even if this guy isn't the best example of it. Sega have supported more mature Wii games then anyone except mayube SE outside of Ninty themselves and if they feel the other console makers support them better than Ninty SHOULD listen as a strong third party library is essential to them holding onto their new market in the long term.

Historically, too, Ninty have been weak at recognising the needs of other devs on their platforms and it would be silly to let it happen again when they're in such a good position. Fact is, yes, a l;ot of third party games have failed because they've been weak but the better ones that have sold lesser numbers than you might expect even on the smaller install bases of PS360 could have been helped more by Nintendo by things as simple as demos on the Nintendo channel perhaps-things like that and more trailers would be a start and I'm pleased to see steps being taken in that direction with Wiiware games.

So, to me, there may be long standing paranoia on both sides here and I think it's fair to say Ninty could do more for other developers and publishers wishing to support their console-even if I also fdeel there's a lot of unfair moaning too as many devs just haven't tried like they have on other platforms to make the best of what Wii offers. It's a two way street and if Ninty did make the first move it would only do them, and us gamers, untold good. IDK why they always have this issue with third party devs but it's time to bury the problem if they wish to stay ahead of the game, imo. Maybe Capcom wouuld have made better games iof they felt more at ease with niontendo and, certainly, Sega have been one of the better supporters of so called "core" gamers on the Wii and deserve, at least, to be heard out by Nintendo.

[asdr3wsfas]

Look at the comparison of sega M rated game sales from vgchartz here and consider wii games cost 1/4th or 1/3rd as much to make as HD games.

"The House of the Dead 2 &3 Return (Wii) 1,100,000
The House of the Dead Overkill (Wii) 470,000
Condemned 2: Bloodshot (360) 470,000
Condemned: Criminal Origins (360) 460,000
Viking: Battle for Asgard (360) 410,000
MadWorld (Wii) 370,000
Condemned 2: Bloodshot (PS3) 310,000
Viking: Battle for Asgard (PS3) 280,000
The Club (360) 240,000
The Club (PS3) 150,000
Golden Axe: Beast Rider (360) 120,000
Golden Axe: Beast Rider (PS3) 80,000
Stormrise (360) 50,000
Stormrise (PS3) 50,000

Average sales per console...

Wii: 647,000
360: 292,000
PS3: 174,000"

http://www.vgchartz.com/for...

They have video demos of the conduit and other M rated games on the nintendo channel. Also, see above, the games did not fail.

"Maybe Capcom wouuld have made better games iof they felt more at ease with niontendo"

Yeah, they had no problem on Gamecube.

[PirateThom]

Listen, kid, I grew up playing Nintendo games. I know the quality, and it doesn't exist outside Mario main series games, Zelda main series and Metroid (which they're outsourcing).

Nintendo, reguardless of the one or two good games they put out a year, are a shell and Wii owners, as shown considering this is a top sales, not highest ranked charts, are buying nothing of note, apart from the same Mario/Zelda team they've bought since the NES, and then complain when third parties don't put real games on the system.

[asdr3wsfas]

"Listen, kid, I grew up playing Nintendo games. I know the quality, and it doesn't exist outside Mario main series games, Zelda main series and Metroid (which they're outsourcing)."

You mean your Mario and Zelda examples of hyped nintendo games are quality? So you just destroyed your own point?

They outsource games...that are still produced by Iwata and Miaymoto. And Miaymoto still upends development when the game isn't meshing right and completely restarts. Real arm's length development there.

Punchout, Paper Mario, SSB, wario, wii sports resort, sin and punishment 2, excite bike, and fire emblem all tend to disprove your argument that only mario, zelda, and metroid are good. Oh...you don't follow wii games.

Third party wii AAA titles that sell over a million are years old ports. COD, RE4, and HOTD 2 and 3. The ones that are unique to the wii get no ads and/or are rail shooters. NMH is suda's best selling game ever and it's on the wii. How'd killer7 do on ps2? How about when okami sold more on the wii than on the ps2 when the latter had more marketshare?

Call me kid all you want, I'm still smarter and better looking than you.

[mastiffchild]

"They had no problem on GC"-well, maybe they didn't, but are you saying that there's any real reason other than them feeling they get more support from MS/Sony for their odd choices this gen? You'd think they'd try harder to appease and sell to the larger Wii market than to the PS360 markets wouldn't you seeing, esp, as it only involves makimng one version and without the added cost of HD-but they don't do that do they?

No RE for the Wii(new and purpose built that is-and we all know the story behind those godawful rail shooters they try to cash in with)and no SF? Why not? You believe Capcom that all the gamers who'd like titles like that(and that bought Wii edition Re4) have now moved onto PS360? Unless you do then isn't it apparent that,somewhere and even if it's as simple as the lack of demos(which I doubt it is-and wasn;'t there some fall out from the protracted development of the then Gamecube exclusive RE4?)shouldn't Ninty help them out if it helps them-and it surely would, no?

Whatever, it's certainly not the first generation where ninty have been accused of a lack of understanding by third party developers, is it? Nintendo have domne loads right this generation and I'm by no means hating on them at all as i like my wii and just wish more was made of it by devs right now as I've still to play anything worthwhile that uses M+from a third party. however, I have to feel there's something in what this guy's said and also have to assume that it's something missing that these devs and pubs find they have with MS and Sony-otherwise making Wii games just makes more financial sense wouldn't it? It's a bigger base and it's cheaper to make games for.

If you think that there's enough tailers and demos on Wii to do the job that gets done with MANY more on both PSN and Live then fair enough-i can't argue with logic like that BUT you know there's more they could do and that they don't have as much available online to support games on their system. I just know 6this has happened before(or similar) and there's got to be an easy answer when you look at it calmly as to why thrid party games aren't selling as well as they maybe should on the wii even when the quality is there. We have to ask why Extraction and Zack and Wiki(and a host of others) weren't pushed inmarketing terms like they would have been on other platforms-why would EA and Capcom hamstring their products when they usually know what they're doing? There has to be something there when it's not one dev saying they think Ninty could do more but several-and esp when they aren't saying it about the othet manufacturers.

Ignore it and think Nintendo are doing everything perfectly if that's what you wish but, and i don't pretend to know what the issues all are-if any, I don't see how this all adds up and don't believe nintendo have nearly enough first party studios to fill the gap that would be left if support from 3rds ran down further and so I think ?ninty have some sorting out to do if they want to mantain their current market and current position. If it means more and better games that sell really well then why wouldn't Nintendo want to talk this out and see what can be done anyway?

Seriously, you can't ever say ytou imagine the world is less than perfect for any of the console makers without people getting way too defensive. I only want nintendo to listen because I want a healthy industry AND think it would help them keep what they've gained this generation if they did listen more to the other developers on their system. Sheesh! I wasn't digging anyone or anything otu and wasn't looking for pointless arguments-I was hoping to learn, maybe, why these developers feel how thye do and what might be able to be done as a solution.

[PirateThom]

My argument isn't about quality though, I know there's still quality games Nintendo are putting out. My argument is that no one is buying them unless it's Mario and Zelda and my original argument is that Wii owners are as just as likely to fall for hype as anyone else. The Conduit, for example.

[Gr81]

If Wii owners fell for the Hype as you say for Conduit why haven't sales been spectacular? Your points are non existent and full of holes. Nintendo doesn't need to do anything, I've lost sympathy for third parties who want to treat Wii and its customers like second rate gamers and then complain when Wii owners treat their games like second rate games. I like Conduit but its a flawed mediocre game which sold better than say Wet or Wanted on the HD consoles and which do you think cost more?

See the funny thing about you guys is that on one hand you want to call a game garbage or mediocre on Wii and when the sales prove this you are quick to point out how this game doesn't sell. Why would it if its mediocre? How many rail shooters burn up the charts on HD consoles?How many 5 hr beat em ups sell on HD consoles? Bionic Commando had major marketing and bombed HARD so hard the studio had to close down. Strangley enough Wii flops get sequels (NMH, Boom Blox)

Third Parties wouldn't have any problem selling any sort of content on Wii if there was actual quality content made. MH3 in Japan is proof of that. Red Steel 2 looks very much like quality (its obstacle will be to sell to those who felt burned by the first game though)

This idea that games sell just because Mario is in it or Wii is in the title is hilarious. They sell due to the content. Wii Music flopped and that had Wii in the title so there goes that theory.

[ZoidsRaven]

Here is the thing about those kind of people.

*Wii owner spots chocolate cake*
*Wii basher yells at wii owner*
"DON'T EAT THAT, IT'S SH*T! "

*Wii owner replies with*
"Really? Thanks, man."
*Wii owner walks away from cake*

*Wii basher says right after*
"See, wii owners don't want this delicious cake." (The Conduit)
----------------------------- -

*What would have happen had the wii owner eaten the cake"

*Wii basher says*
"SEE! WII OWNERS EAT SH*!" (the double ported RE4)

Point? If wii owner don't buy a "hardcore" game, it is used against them. If they do buy a "hardcore" game, it's genre/franchise is no longer valid when talk about sales comes up. 7_7

BTW, what is said on N4G when this happens on the HD consoles? Nothing? Bias proven.

[Gr81]

Excellent Analogy my friend. I find myself more and more amused by your posts lol.

Also, If Nintendo did do this and released "M" games then Third Parties next excuse would be "we can't compete with Nintendo's Mature games"

I love it. A game flops on Wii its the Wii's fault a game flops on the HD systems its the games fault..Here's the thing its always the games fault, not that consumer for not buying something that didn't interest them. If a movie flops, a book flops, a game flops its all because it wasn't what the customer wanted. Rail Shooters have been done to death on Wii. If EA made a third person Dead Space on Wii I'd've reserved my copy but a rail shooter? really? Make Dead Space 2 a rail shooter for PS360 and see hat happens lol.

[N4g_null]

First of all conduit was exactly what I wanted I knew HVS capacity they got normal maps and sweet fps aim right without the motion plus. That's not hype it's fact. Did 5 million wii owners buy it like halo nope because this may have been great for me yet not every one else. Every one bought res evil 5 just off hype along lol then every one said they hated it.

You have to have a solid game on the wii even if it is a mini game. Just look at all the shovel ware that DOES not sell on the wii. Yes it's in the stores but you never see it on the charts because nintendos own games decimate them. If Sony or ms makes a better motion game pack than resort I will be buying those systems.

Again we have a list of high priced hd games above and which of those games was promoted by ethier hd console maker? Just because nintendo has been a dumping ground for the industry doesn't make it true.

After looking at the above post I can tell who is hard core and who are sheep. I don't mean that as an insult yet realize when and how you are getting milked. I do nothing but hd zbrush work and hi res modeling like many of my friends. The pay is crazy good, why because that is all that is needed to sell a game to the hd crowd sega and many others rely on this to increase sales.

Take any hd games graphics away and there isn't much to be excited about. Example choose any port to the ps3 from the xbox lol.

The gaming media is playing you all against each other lol other wise you wouldn't have a reason to keep the hype going. Also we have like 10 wii guys that actualy like the system and they totally broke Down all of your arguments.

You all know how lazy devs are example ps3 ports if you let them off the hook with the wii then you will reap what you sow while we keep getting solid games with years of replay value.

The hype king is dead and wii owners are adults which are more likly to want to try a game (the full version) out by renting it or playing it at some ones house. We are relaspe hardcore games and new gamers that don't care about the childish system wars. I've been there done that, it gets you no where like the mw boycot lol.

Message boards do not control gaming money does. If sega likes money then they will have to work for it, same goes for other 3rd parties. Their is little blind faith on the wii, your game better be arcade token ready and addictive.

Another thing is wow do I have alot of wii games snk is not complaining I got all of their collect disk too!

No one bought wii music or animal crossing, I have reason 4.0 and that game on the gc hype was suppose to Dell them.... It did not work. Hint stop using hype and figure out how to make fun games again....

[Gr81]

I think The Conduit needs more respect for what it was able to accoomplish. The customizable controls has revolutionized Wii FPS'. Every game following Conduit has (or better have) this option. That cannot be overlooked. Also To me Conduit felt like a test run for HVS something like Grinder will blow Conduit out the water. They are a good bunch of guys.

RE5 is the death knell for RE lol. Does anyone care about RE6?

[Fierce Musashi]

I certainly don't. After playing the RE5 demo I can never trust for there to another good RE game again. It wasn't even scary, even with the lights off. Which probably explains why they keep rereleasing their old Survival Horror titles every gen.

The only thing scary about that game was aiming with that dual analog.

If I paid full retail price for that game, I would have to kill somebody.

[Fierce Musashi]

It seems Capcom of France thinks that the opportunity for "hardcore" games has dried for the Wii, due to their sale of Darkside Chronicles. Perhaps if they weren't "testing" the Wii audience by giving them the double ported Resident Evil 4 and the rail shooter Umbrella Chronicles (nothing against rail shooters) just to see if it was safe to put Resident Evil 5 (or any RE4 style game) on the Wii and then giving them another on-rails Resident Evil, things might be different. No one wants to be a lab rat, espscially twice. And in result of this act, just made them look like they were taking the Wii audience for a ride, considering they both sold over 1 mil. but ah well, RE5 wasn't that good of a game, imo. And now we are getting more re-makes/rereleases like RE Zero.

EA is also guilty of this with Dead Space: Extraction being a rail-shooter when the original game's core fans known it to be a third-per shooter. Not that it's a bad game, but still.

[Pozzle]

I don't know why third-party devs continue to complain about working with the Wii. If they're that unhappy, then move to another console! Stop complaining and do something about it.

[Zackstorm]

Sega should not bite the hand that feeds them. Their highest selling game ever, in their entire company history, is Mario and Sonic at the Olympics. Second is Sonic 2. In fact three out of their five top selling games have been on Nintendo consoles. From this generation too.

[mastiffchild]

I think the translation made him seem a little more abrupt than he possibly really means to sound. however, it's not a one way street is it? Sonic and Sega also put inot those games with their characters and talents and they've also been a supporter of the console with good, quality games as a developer and publisher-more than most others in fact so some of their issues deserve some listening to by nintendo.

I'm not saying the guy's totally right but there has to be a reason that he's saying it and a lot of devs/puubs share the opinion that nintendo don't help them/understand their needs as well as Sony or MS do-mayube that's why Capcom have been even worse on Wii than they have on the HD twins, y'know? You either have to believe there isn't the market for mature games on the Wii that there is elsewhere or you have to give remarks like this some, but not, again, total, credence-also it isn't as if ninty don't have a bit of history with a lack of support for third party devs on their consoles, is it?

I just think that there's a lot of room for improvement between the two factions on the Wii and it would really help Nintendo, 3rd parties AND, most importantly, Wii gamers if it were to happen and I don't think we should get up in arms just because some guy from Sega France words his statements poorly/gets translated poorly. Can it be a coincidence that so many Wii developers have said similar things? I don't think so and feel there's definitely things to be conceded and/learned on both sides of the debate here. Don't they both want more huge selling and quality games available on the little white box-I know that's all I'#m after at the end of the day and if Nintendo making the first move and being the bigger(morally) company is what's needed to get the ball rolling then they should do it and start talking more about what's to be done to help each other.

[Zackstorm]

I agree with a lot of what you're saying. I would also love to see those types of improvements. However, third parties have got to stop short-changing Wii owners and then grumbling when their attempt at fast cash doesn't pan out.

The Conduit, although I think there's some hope in its sequel, is a bad game. Madworld is extremely niche and shallow. Mature does not equal quality.

My gripe is more with Sega, because their business decisions and reactions to things often confuse me. Things can definitely be improved at Nintendo, but I would love to see Sega give their head a shake.

[N4g_null]

Mas thhere is a problem and it's not nintendo it's greed. Sony paid for the wins in the last few gens and they simply got beat at their own game. Ms bought se's ff13 and they are even getting a metal gear money....

Ms is the best hype machine ever. They perfected it with the os. First you get it to ship on time after you've gotten every one and mello yellow to do promos. Suddently a mediocre fps is the best multiplayer game ever. Yet killzone barely sells more the res evil remake lol. Sony is running low on funds so they can pay off people as well. All they can do is fan the rrod hate flames.

Hype is fun and cool but you guys yes hd gamers really have been suckers this gen. The games have almost no replay value, game play sucks amd you got taxed for blu Ray or live you choose. It's no wonder they are all so mad at the wii. They have a lot to be mad about yet I've never seen gamers expectations used against them so well.

I'll never trust another review again but maybe I get that from the 16 bit days, most hd gamers are actualy new to gaming so eventually they will learn.

[Seferoth75]

" But he also confirms that MadWorld has a rather positive sells sheet and that the success is enough therefore. "That must be why this article isnt burning up. All the Wii hating PS3 guys Don't want to comment and acknowledge how wrong they were.

[Mista T]

Solution = sell mature games on the HD consoles!!!

[Gr81]

Yes Mista T..Do that and watch these companies go belly up. Bionic Commando anyone? Wolfenstein 3-d? Wet? Wanted? BlazBlu? Lair? Haze? Godfather 2? Dead Space for HD was met with disappointing sales (this from EA's own admission)You have to combine sales to cross the million mark and it still wasnt profitable..see that's the thing about HD systems if the games don't have hype the audience don't bite..I pity da fool(s). ;)

[SpoonyRedMage]

I think Nintendo could do a bit more to support games but they're not going to as long as third parties are reluctant to. Konami didn't advertise Silent Hill one bit and Sega provided very little support for their "mature" titles, compare the Madworld campaign to the Bayonetta campaign.

Nintendo shouldn't be holding their hands and the moment a third party takes a Wii release seriously Nintendo do help.(helped advertise CoD: WaW, Crystal Bearers and will help with Monster Hunter Tri)

[mastiffchild]

Well, tha's just it from where i stand Spoons-i think ninty need to be the bigger man(so to speak) and maybe make the first move on a couple of fronts and then, maybe, we'd see more publishers doing similar to Sega and, even if Madworld wasn't pushed like Bayonetta(and I kind of see why they thought it was hard to promote on the Wii given some of the more stupid tabloid headlines about Manhunt2 being a Wii game if I'm honest)it WAS still pushed a lot harder than a lot of Wii games , wasn't it? Sega have, at least committed to more mature Wii games as a publisher AND as a dev(though the Needlemouse choices of platform are plain odd to me)so it's not hand holding they're after is it?

Whatever, there's definitely an issue there somewhere and if Ninty can solve it wWITH 3rd parties we all stand to benefit and if it means Nintendo calling them all in and making the first concession then so be it-games like deadly Creatures(because it's new IP and very different to most games)and Extraction(because even though it a rail shooter it was of a very high filmic standard and Wii gamers didn't hear anything about it)among others would surely have benefitted fromt the exposure of a demo on Wii Connect somewhere. So, even something so small could be a catalyst for change as it's undeniable that devs do feel that nintendo could be offering something more than they are right now and by implication it's obviously something they feel they DO get from Sony and MS so it can't be that hard to talk and sort out, can it?

That said, I'd much rather they all did it behind closed doors rather than these vague and muddled statements we get to see via Google trnslate!

[SpoonyRedMage]

Well I think Nintendo actually has less to gain from third parties than third parties could gain from the Wii, but the third parties aren't trying all that hard.

I'd say that all the games they released were at least profitable considering Headstrong said HotD: Overkill was profitable from 200K onwards and Little King's Story was profitable with over 100K and Dead Rising: CTYD apparently did well at retail with 200K. The third parties expect more but don't want to put the effort in.

Nintendo could do more but I feel with what this guy was saying(I think) about Nintendo really pushing mature games wouldn't work out because Nintendo would have a successful title because they'd push it(even though they don't tend to push niche titles, like Fire Emblem) and the third parties would continue to fail and then there'd be more comments about how you can only sell if you are Nintendo.

Pachters' comments were right about this subject though(yer he was right for once), he said you either go low budget and expect low sales or go high budget and expect big sales.

[Picnic]

Asking Nintendo to provide more mature content themselves for the Wii is like asking Cliff Richard to star in the next Quentin Tarantino movie.

Almost...

Nintendo have got past putting green blood in Mortal Kombat. In fact, ever since Conker's Bad Fur Day on the N64 (made by their 'second party' Rare) and with Killer 7, No more heroes, Manhunt 2, Mad World and the most swearing in any game ever in The House of the Dead: Overkill they tolerate more mature content than even their supposedly more 'mature oriented' competitors.

But they wouldn't do it themselves.

Why? Because Nintendo are clever about being conservative. They wouldn't want to risk the Wii's family image in terms of first party games but they don't want to miss out on some more 'mature' gamers buying a Nintendo console.

But, unlike the Gamecube which had some quirky adverts (at least to start with), the way that they have promoted the Wii has been safe and sanitised. Nothing wrong with that necessarily but it's so squeaky clean and concerned with self improvement that polluting your mind with swearing and ultra-violence seems contrary to the Wii way.

[eagle21]

Wii has an awesome 2010 lineup to add to it's phenomenal success. I think anyone anti-nintendo are simply anti-gamers! Hardcore my a$$. Playing play-a-like FPS's all day? Hardcore retards if you ask me.:)

[SinnedNogara]

And I think Sega should try more with mature content on the Wii.