Huzaifah from eXputer: "With Larian Studios washing their hands of the IP, what is the ultimate fate of the legendary Baldur's Gate series?"
Cultured Vultures: Where would the PS1 be without RPGs? It’d no doubt still be a massive seller thanks to bandicoots, clones, and halfpipes, but half the cultural institution it is today? We’re not so sure.
While most of these games are great to amazing, most are not actual RPGs. Faux RPGs if anything. Turn Based Adventure Games for a more apt description, with Diablo, Brave Fence Musashi and Star Ocean as Action Adventure games.
Again, all great games without a doubt.
Microsoft has closed a number of Bethesda studios, including Redfall maker Arkane Austin, Hi-Fi Rush developer Tango Gameworks, and more in devastating cuts at Bethesda, IGN can confirm.
Hi-Fi Rush studio??? Seriously?? Goes to show quality matters lil to MS.
Worst gen ever. All big 3 battling are for who sucks the most. They just keep one upping one another.
This does feel like a “quick Sony is getting shit on for Helldivers, let’s announce it now to minimise impact”
That is silly. Let's say there is some weird conspiracy. This announcement would effectively take ALL the attention away from the HD2 situation, especially since there is no longer an HD2 situation. I don't think anything will minimize this impact.
... so they announce it on a Tuesday? 36 hours after Sony cleared up everything?
You people care more about the next conspiracy than anything else.
Nevermind that Sony followed the golden rule of minimizing impact by announcing horrible news on a Friday.
The constant weekly weird Sony drama is part of the industry's problem. Everyone else feels they can get away with murder. Also, what is the point of spending all that money if you just start shutting studios down. And... Redfall wasn't Arkane's fought. Microsoft new the shape the game was in but needed something for GamePass after a whole year of no releases into the service. Them taking it out on Arkane seems really disingenuous and distasteful. And WTF did Tango do? Didn't Todd just release a statement saying how he would never retire. Fire his ass.
Yes it does. Arkane Austin I can understand but Tango Gameworks made an excellent game in Hi Fi Rush.
On review, it want really all on Austin for Redfall and its failure, they were forced to make a multiplayer games when their expertise was always single player driven first person games.
"I don't think anything will minimize this impact."
It already has. Notice your comment(or lack there of) vs HD2.
On another note, I would like to see Microsoft buy more studios and do more shadows drops on subscription services like they did Hi-Fi Rush. It's great for the industry I was told by people on here.
I'm pretty sure that's exactly how it works. Same thing with layoffs. All of a sudden everyone has layoffs around the same time
MS will always make it to amaze me by showing the worse version of themselves every single time..
MS proving to the world that ttheir leadership cannot drive success from these new acquisitions. They have ran the numbers and they have realized that long term, without a clear direction from the motehrship, these are a loss for the company hence they need to be cut. I might be wrong but I am absolutelly sure that if these developers would have not been purchased by Microsoft they would be still on business. A shame ...
10/10 deflection, the ol' Sony too deflect...
Let's not discuss the fact that PlayStations struggles have largely been caused by the fact that game pass has reshaped how consumers spend causing them to spend less as they play what is on subscriptions and don't buy games as much because they either have become subscription gamers or they fear the game will come to a subscription so they don't buy things.
And it's not just PlayStation, the whole industry has been effected, many big studios are struggling across the board to match sales targets from pre-game pass releases which is especially apparent in things like sequels.
Heck the best example was Microsoft's own Starfield which should have easily blasted past 10m sales by the end of 2023 going by sales of similar Bethesda games yet was only able to achieve 3m which of course was almost entirely on Steam.
Or maybe it's because Sony hasn't released multiple worthwhile SP games like they normally do each gen and the ones they did released actually sold well.
Layoffs aren't because studios are struggling, but because major publishers want to maximise profit gains.
Absolutely it's a service that's changed the way we view and consume games overall for the worse games have little value when they are part of a sub and become disposable doubly so if they are a day 1 freebie often it's the kiss of death for a game to be day 1 on gamepass as PlayStation players look at it like why do I have to pay 60 dollars for back 4 blood, payday 3 or outriders it'll be on PS plus soon enough and funny enough those games always fail to meet expectations sales are poor and longevity is poor.
When I see a game get a day 1 tag outside of first party my first thought is always something is wrong with it and it can't stand on its own feet so the publisher has made a deal to recoup development cost.
Even first party games have dropped in quality noticeably so since gamepass with gears 5 being the only good release I can think of since gamepass started
Wasn't aware that Gamepass is available on PlayStation.
Or are you telling us that a service from a console lacking in sales is so great that it affects the morale and buying habits of ppl lacking access to the service?
Also pretty sure that saying all of them competing for who sucks means the whole industry and not just Sony and MS.
This is what people online want. They just don't know or understand it. So many have warned about consolidation, and exactly what they have fear has been happening
This isn't the end, expect more bought out studios to be closed in the next few years
Spot on. All in the name "growth" to appease investors and shareholders. Can't sustain the lie though...it will always implode as illustrated by these closures. Applies to MS and Embracer.
This. ^
Publishers are slowly mitigating all development risk since every new big/medium budget game has become too big to fail. Games are too expensive to make and the profitability for titles rests on a hair’s edge. When you need to sell 5 million copies of a game to be profitable, you know that we’ve turned a new page in gaming. The real victims here are the smaller studios/games that bring so much character and variety to the industry, like with Hi-Fi Rush.
It looks to me that Hi-Fi Rush did not fulfill financial expectations for moving the GamePass needle, and the sales from the PlayStation port experiment did not measure up either. So it gets the boot.
Sad day and era for gaming.
I just don’t know how the hell a company that can spend $67b to purchase a publisher decided that it’s okay to close the studio that produces their best game last year.
Whoever the higher up there that decides this is completely out of touch of how the game industry works, the damn xbox division as a whole would’ve been closed already if they weren’t sustained by other MS divisions.
I got in an argument with someone on reddit and they weren't haven't that Xbox isn't propped up by other divisions argument. They swore up and down that Xbox was pulling its own weight. I just stopped after a couple back and forths
Didn’t move the GamePass needle and the PlayStation port couldn’t save the return on investment….
So this is what happens when you're pleased with the sales and investing in the studio? Good guy Phil at it again.
From Aaron Greenburg:
"Hi-Fi RUSH was a break out hit for us and our players in all key measurements and expectations. We couldn’t be happier with what the team at Tango Gameworks delivered with this surprise release."
😂😂😂 🤥🤥
Once again MS creates their own problems and they create their own animosity. Idc about their shitty excuse and "reasons" they're a incompetent company, plus all their Xbox fanboy influencers are dwindling I noticed. How many excuses can you make for a company like MS? Consoles are down and they're losing their own fanboy influencers also. That's all they had to cheer lead them now they're leaving them. Pretty nobody will be on MS dude no matter if they (if they ever but I doubt it) get their act together.
Trashy ass ppl and company....
If they go under eventual it's because of their own doing nobody else's.
Yeah overall this gen is pretty shit. Everyone is making horrible decisions, great devs are getting either gutted or entirely shut down regardless of quality or success, very little in the way of innovative games, etc. This industry needs to see some drastic changes.
where are all the cheerleaders for MS acquisitions amid all these?? you guys happy now? this will not be the end of it, maybe just the beginning!
Prey was fantastic. Red fall was shit because they were forced to do shit they didn't want to make.
Atkane Lyon did death loop I believe....I hated that one.
@shinoff2183
Because Prey was creative and different
Other than the live service Redfall, all other single-player Arkane projects have been creative and interesting
@Crows90
So just because people don't want to do something in life...bad quality is excused? Look what happened over that bad quality? no more studio
Will be more soon, I've said it before I can't see MS keeping Bethesda. I think they'll strip it's IPs and slowly close everything, it's what they do.
No one wants to admit it, but yeah MS has a long history of pillaging other smaller corporations for IP and dispensing with everything else.
That doesn't make any sense lol. How would they make money from these IP'S with no developers?
@Zeref
"That doesn't make any sense lol. How would they make money from these IP'S with no developers?"
MS don't care about the studios, they want the IP's. They'll keep the big ones in house, the game engines they run on and licence the rest. Stacks of cash to be made from licensing IP's ...or just sit on them so no one else can use them.
@Zeref silly fool, buy them for the IP have there other studios make the games using the IP names to sell them. We all know having a popular franchise name can sell
Well xbox fans you got what you asked for... and honestly deserved...
It was so easily predictable that game pass was never going to be able to support all these studios.
If Microsoft can't win they are going to burn it all to the ground...
Countdown to Phil Spencer telling us "it's better for the gamers this way" yet again.
@Barlos They indirectly did. Every person who made a wish list of who Microsoft should buy next and were sending tweets to Phil Spencer and Xbox with proposed studios, played a part.
The saddest part is the studios were closed because of the underperformance of their last games, and if they had been given a chance then their next games could’ve been great and succeeded. But it is the same old Phil Spencer Microsoft problem which is not giving them a chance, and that’s why he is not able to manage game studios.
Yeah they did. Just because they refused to see what everyone with a brain was telling them doesn't mean they didn't know. They were told, they should've put up a fight and they didn't. This is the result. But who knows even if MS' fans weren't such boot-lickers, MS could've carried this out against their fans wishes anyway. Unfortunately, we have the hardcore MS defense bots running to deflect from any bad news and maybe, just maybe, MS felt empowered to do more damage as a result of their fans cheering this all on.
They sold themselves out. Once people buy you they can do what they want. None of this should have been a surprise. When companies get bought out, they eventually get dismantled.
Xbox fans were to busy daydreaming of Ms curbstopping Sony they didn't look at the big picture.
Not disagreeing at all.
I want to add that from the day Microsoft announced game pass, before they even started buying up studios it was obvious that game pass wasn't going to be able to support itself.
It was so dumb that they doubled down on it by spending 100B on a service they knew only existed through subsidization.
They should have realized there was no way that adding massively more costs on a subscription they were subsidizing was certain to fail. Especially after seeing how it had devastated sales across the platform as a whole.
Heck by the time this generation started during covid when the console sales were similar PlayStation was already outselling xbox on multiplatform games 8:1 yet they still doubled down on it.
This is beyond wrong. Like wtf!? Especially Tango Gameworks with Hi-Fi Rush. I've heard nothing but good things about that game. Just because Arkane Austin screwed up one game release doesn't mean you need to close them. It sounds like they were forced to do a multiplayer game when they're a single player studio. They could have made a Prey 2 or some other game next.
Just wow awful news.
"Xbox says Hi-Fi Rush was a success "in all key measurements" amid rumors of poor sales. Following rumors that Tango Gameworks' Hi-Fish Rush didn't meet sales expectations, Xbox marketing VP Aaron Greenburg is defending the "break out hit" as a success by all metrics."
According to Aaron Greenburg it was a success so they shouldn't have even needed PlayStation owners to buy it. That being said, I bought it and really enjoyed it, it's a great game. Shame MS closed them down.
@Romulus23
All lies by the Green Bug, that just means that a lot of people fired bullets or whatever in the game, that's the key measurements they care to share.
Tango did NOT deserve to be closed down, they have not released a single bad game.
That's usually what happens when you don't release it at the same time as other platforms....same thing happened with tomb raider reboot sequel. MS got exclusivity for a year and then when it came to PlayStation it barely sold. Nobody cared anymore.
Well... I did my part. Hi-Fi Rush is a good game, but I don't think its MS' style. We don't really know how well it did or didn't perform by the numbers or whether it broke even. This could just be another MS blunder.
Exactly. MS purchasing a 3rd party studio & keeping games off of other platforms probably hurt them in the long run, then finally putting Hi Fi Rush on PS which in turn PS fans probably didn't care to buy & support Hi Fi Rush after a year later of release. Hi Fi Rush was released on Gamepass so it probably never really made any money selling solely.
@romulus23
Let's hope it didn't sell well because that would make this worse. Also I could have sworn I read an article about their next game in the works.
I was wondering if that played any part considering the timing, though, XB claimed the game to be a success last year only on XB & PC. Regardless MS f'd up there too. They shadow dropped HiFi on XB/PC last year at the perfect time. This year when they released on PS not only had the hype died, but there were so many solid games available the first 3 months of this year to play.
I almost bought it on PC last year, but now that it dropped on PS I just have far too many games to play to bother...
If MS needs PS and even Switch sales they need a better strategy. At the very least a release date where players are more inticed to buy said game. The problem is always going to be that if they want exclusives the hype for these games will be dead a year later. The exceptions might be some of their heavy hitters.... 2 cents
I can only imagine the little amount of revenue both games generated, sent straight to gamepass and excluded from the largest current gen console userbase. Not to say both games would have done well if they were on PS5 too, but you heavily damage to a games revenue when you put it on a stagnating sub service for a poorly selling console, can't really see people going out in droves to sub to GP to play this.
Gamepass subs(most of Xbox players) don't buy games all like that so it's not sustainable. It's reality.
Yea Austin made one of the most creative game of last gen with Prey and were forced to take risk with Redfall and now the whole studio is being closed.
Yes, that Tango gameworks/ Hi-Fi closure was an eye opener for me as well. Neither played it nor was interested in it myself but all I heard was everyone acting like it was the second coming of guitar hero or something.
I don't know what else to say other than modern gaming is an overwhelming sea of mediocrity and there's not enough voices of reason speaking up and saying that most games made these days are just not very good.
Your playing the wrong games then. There's always been shovelware type games. Going back to wii, snes, nes, ps1 Xbox og. That's a bs blanket statement. As an older gamer since atari days I'd personally say this is a great time. If you can't find anything to play. That's on you
With all that said in no way or form am I speaking of multi-player games, gacha, or whatever. I'm strictly speaking on single player games.
you are hilarious. trying to validate your comment by excluding over half of the games out there today. Pathetic man.
Wait I was told Xbox had great engagement numbers?! Some Xbox fans said they bought games when I told them Xbox customers don't buy games?
So Xbox bought studios to keep games off other platforms and forgot they conditioned Xbox customers to not buy games. Whoops.
So anyone else think Outer World's 2 dies 🤔? I'm thinking a small game losing out on Nintendo and Playstation gamers buying will kill this IP. But it's okay Xbox fans can get more COD! Halo, Gears and Forza! Woot that's a 'win'. Yay Gamepass FTW
Can't wait to see the usual try spin and play this down. So much for the heroic MS and Phil saving these studios eh.
By the end of the day IGN will be talking about how this is right for the industry. Don't worry, Microsoft's PR is making the call now.
Tango did NOT deserve to be closed down, they have not released a single bad game, and I'm sure Arkhane failed just because they were both rushed and pressured into making a GaaS game they had no experience in doing and no support to get it completed out of the gate.
Not a big deal only hi fi rush was good
Sony has closed
Manchester studio
Japan studio
Pixel opus
London studio
Ready At Dawn ...
The difference being Sony has a large group of other studios that have done something positive. Microsoft just closed the studio to the only good game they released in the past year (Hi-Fi Rush).
They all suck as well of course. But MS spent 10s of billions on these publishers for mass consolidation, every made a song and dance about how MS would save them, using their endless Windows, 365 and Azure money to keep them open forever and how Phil was some hero.
Nothing is safe unless it makes money, even for MS.
It is a big deal.
Microsoft has closed
Fasa Studios
Digital Anvil
Ensemble
Lionhead Studios
Press Play
Arkane Austin
Tango Gameworks
Wow how far back do you want to go back.
Lionhead Studios
Aces Game Studio
BigPark
Carbonated Game
Digital Anvil
Ensemble Studios
FASA Studio
Good Science Studio
Hired Gun
Microsoft Studios Japan
Microsoft Studios Victoria
Team Dakota
Xbox Entertainment Studios
Xbox Live Productions
Lift London
Access Software
Salt Lake Games Studio
Twisted Pixel Games
WingNut Interactive
And more before this, this was just their cuts during xbone era that Phil cut while he was at the head.
And some of those PlayStation studios were merged not closed, most of the UK studios were folded into each other.
Japan Studio was renamed to Asobi not closed, aAsobi was an internal team of Japan Studio the "closure" the press misinformed people about was more or less a name change, the studio is in the same building and when the change happened less than 5 people mostly leadership positions chose to leave the studio to form Bokeh Studio, which still works closely with Sony.
And even if your deflection stood on it's own, Microsoft spent 3 Billion 3 years ago almost to the date to buy Zenimax and has already closed 2 of it's biggest studios and decimated Zenimax's support studio structure.
It's no wonder Todd Howard was talking about "more frequent releases" and letting other studios make their IP's games. The days of big budget huge Bethesda games is over...
In fact sadly Microsoft has ushered in the end of big budget gaming as we know it with their obviously unsustainable subscription industry change.
And I feel fully confident that this isn't the end of studio closures from these recently purchased studios.
Ready At Dawn was never a Sony owned studio, and only made a few smaller God of War games and a Jax and Daxter spin off, and of course The Order1866.
They are currently owned by OcUlus Studios.
How many times has MS fired Bethesda staff since they purchased it? I think it's been three rounds so far
London studio what have they made recently. Really the worst one was Japan studio. That sucked.
In reality though your deflecting. The fact of the matter is Ms just closed the studio that made their highest rated game in years. That's insane.
Ready At Dawn was never a PS first party studio.
Manchester was closed and it was proposed that London should be closed, but their website is still up with no news about it being closed on their official site anywhere. So it's possible that the proposed closure just did not happen to get fufilled. Meaning London Studio *MIGHT* still be open running lean.
Edit: Japan Studio was closed with some staff making up the new Asobi Team Studio who's first title was the PS5 pack-in game "Astro's Playroom." Pixel Opus was closed and not replaced or spun-off their only games were Entwined and Concrete Genie they also helped publish Journey according to Wikipedia.
Man you got crap info
Sony never owned Ready at Dawn. It's now owned by Oculus.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...
Phil needs to step down. What kind of usual spin do you want?
More and more people lose jobs but the people at the top stay the same. Hardware sales tank despite billions and billions spent. The math is plain and simple.
I'm still trying to figure out what was the real reason to acquire Bethesda for millions or Billions of dollars if you're closing down studios 🤔 What were their true intentions 🤔 I mean do Microsoft really want to be a third-party publisher? It sounds like they're confused.with their future in gaming
@Sonic1881
To rape each studio for their sweet succulent ultra-valuable IP. This is Microsoft's favorite past-time.
Diablo IV is now available to play via PlayStation Cloud Gaming! Still not available to Play on Xbox Cloud Gaming.
We ran our script again and found 15 other PS5 games (a lot of popular ones!) that got PS5 Cloud Gaming support within the last month as well.
I hate that I have to keep calling this out, but your physical disks mean nothing if the game code attempts to connect to a server prior to playing.
And that happens when? I'm playing completely offline here, stellar Blade to be more precise.
I'm sorry but I've never run into that imaginary problem you're talking about, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it has never happened to me.
You not running into the problem yet has no bearing on my argument. You’re acting like the medium is the shield for you being able to always play your games when it effectively is not. The game code itself can try to connect to a server or the console you’re playing on may receive an update that requires that game to connect to a server. Just because you haven’t ran into it doesn’t mean anything lol you don’t own your games no matter how you try.
So I have never run into the problem you're talking about and your answer is an hypothetical? Look I can play any game of my library offline right now without issue.
That issue is in your mouth and alone.
Actually...there's an easy way...don't connect. If it doesn't require a connection and you don't connect...the code can't update...obviously....confused why you don't get what he's saying.
Hold on..lets say i dnt have an online connection, can i atleast play the game offline though. Was thinking of getting this
None of you use your brains.
OK, let’s explore this playing offline. not talking about Diablo specifically just gaming in general.
Are you going to buy two PlayStations? One offline one online? If not, moment you want to play something that requires a connection you’re cooked.
Does game experience you love so much stay the same offline?
Is the game even playable offline?
The whole point of my argument is that we don’t hold the keys anymore. The gatekeepers are the developers and console makers regardless of whether it’s digital or physical. You altering your play style for a lesser experience is not a workaround, it doesn’t solve the overall problem.
None of this matters since the move to the cloud is inevitable.
So you have to buy the game and can only stream to the PS5 devices using PS plus premium? What is the point of that. Much more useful when you can stream to other devices.
That's streaming off your PS5, not from the cloud. This is specifically referring to cloud gaming.
Sony doesn't yet have a web or app-based solution to stream games off their cloud service, the closest you may be able to get would be Remote Play if they allow cloud streaming during a Remote session.
And yes this applies to the Portal too.
Tacoboto
Please stop talking about PlayStation Streaming, you don't know what you're talking about.
I just explained this to you the other day where you were telling people that remote play was their only cloud solution, because apparently you didn't understand how PlayStation Premium works even though PS Now was a thing since shortly after the launch PS4..
You can stream to PC and Mac, and they had mobile clients for it in the past but probably for the same reason Microsoft is fighting Apple and Google PS Now wasn't allowed on App stores. Which is why it's not on iPhone and Android still.
And to be honest, I am glad they are trying to keep it on the console, all their moves away from the console seem like a step in the wrong direction, which isn't working so great for Microsoft...
Blizzard is shoving this game everywhere. Diablo 4 is going to take an even bigger hit soon. Path of exile 2 is coming out and it looks insane.
I completed it on gamepass. Thanks God I dint pay it full price. It plays like a lazy mobile game. I am not a pro diablo gamer (Diablo 1 was the only one I completed) but D4 has no atmosphere, no creepy feeling and soundtrack like the first one and its so easy, I managed to not buy any weapon and had 4 Million Credits on level 55. I always used the same 4 attacks from the beginning and died maybe 10-15 times. It's so easy, wtf. I remember D1 to be pretty hard.
WTF happened? Is Diablo 3 also that bad?
Considering that the PS cloud steaming is garbage compared to XCloud and is limited to certain devices this isn't something to brag about. Wake me up when Diablo is on PS plus
If anybody's gonna mention BioWare, then look at Archetype Entertainment, they're the new BioWare
or else
Obsidian is still a good choice but not independent anymore.
No, WoTC is pivoting to mobile. They can use Larian's work to justify DnD Go and everyone will accept it.
Short answer, nope. Long answer, f*ck nope.
Honestly, we're talking completely new engine and none of Larian's built-in stuff with regard to environments and the like that they had from their past divinity game. No one is going to have that just ready to go. So, they need to shop for a dev studio that has a past game that shows what they want.
Obsidian doesn't have that, maybe the closest being Dungeon Siege 3 or Pillars of Eternity, but those are very basic, not as open, very little environment related and altering capabilities. So, we're talking a step way back on what Larian delivered. Zero scene experience to line up with what was done in BG3. Okay conversation tree designs, but still needs more complexity.
inXile has Wasteland 3 as a base model engine, and I think that's better than Pillars of Eternity from Obsidian. But, still needs to be more open world, more environmental effects, and a much heavier rules set adaptation. But, not a bad overall engine as a base, but still a ton of work. Zero scene experience to line up with what was done in BG3. Needs a ton of work on that entirely.
Tactical Adventure did the Solasta game. Really good and more accurate as far as 5e rules than BG3. But, again, if the expectation is similar to what made BG3 a big hit, engine isn't designed for moving the camera, is a bit outdated in graphics, doesn't have in-game scene elements, and needs much better writers/voice actors.
Owlcat of pathfinder games is another choice, even though they've recently moved on to WH40k licensed games. Again, though, the engine is the biggest issue here to match up, but it's a much better option overall than Tactical Adventure. Another question is writers/story telling, as much of their overall story telling bits are very limited with a lot of random worldbuilding elements that are just +\- of some attributes.
TBH, no matter who takes over, it's just not going to be like BG3 much like how BG3 isn't at all like BG1/2. And BG3 was so successful because of how much Larian was able to put in with their engine and how focused they were on players having ridiculous control over the story being told. I just don't see the next BG being the same and depending on what it is, it might be good but I'm not as big of a reach as BG3. It's way more likely players are going to go into BG4 (or its spiritual successor if it moves away from Baldur's Gate and into Neverwinter or something like Plansescape) expecting much of what is in BG3 with more options, new and older characters, and the same level of control over what they're doing. If it doesn't have that, regardless of who makes it, it won't be as successful, IMHO.
Probably not, but maybe… just maybe…