Killzone 2 has no CGI-Animation, everything is real time

Back in 2005, Sony showed the world 'that Killzone 2 video', everyone was stunned, many people doubted the video as being 'fake'.

Killzone 2 has come a very long way but one question is still remaining… are all the cutscenes CGI-Animated?

The short answer is no. Guerilla Games recently confirmed on the US Official Playstation forums that there will not be any CGI based cutscene's in the game. Everything you see will be rendered in real time.

[Capt CHAOS]

when they do a 360 port. <jest>

[sit down droid]

hhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm.....yes ok / sarcasm

[GiantEnemyLobster]

After the flop of a game that was MGS4 with its 10 hour long cutscenes, they finally became smart. Leave the cutscenes to a REAL company, like MS or Nintendo.

[liquidsnake]

Yeah, a REAL sh1t company that is MS.

[cryymoar]

Crabs, you haven't played a PS3. If you did, it was probably on a 4 inch TV the size of your wang. Try not to say anything stupid again please. MGS4 is better than Gears 2 and everybody knows that.

[Ilikegames76]

You sound like a ten year old trying to be an adolescent. Quit talking nonsense.

[solidjun5]

mesh1 was saying that all the animations was pre-recorded. I was like "HAHAHA, wow. That has to be the funniest I heard all year and the year is short."

Regardless, I'm giddy in anticipation for this game. I can't wait to pop this in and play it in HD. tee hee.

[Aaron Greenterd]

My company better just pack it in and head home....

To our virtual apartments of course! The 360 may not succeed but we will sure try to make money off of Sony with our own Microsoft Videogame Archive space in Sony Home.

We will be selling virtual 360's so users can decorate their gaming spaces with outdated tech. These come with no warranty and no refunds, of course.

[xwabbit]

ROFL Aaron

[FantasyStar]

Sure it's real-time, but pre-rendered cut-scenes is just as bad as CGI because it allows the fanboys to nitpick certain aspects and that sparks turns into something messy: like this.

"OMG! Intro Video is pre-rendered. PS3 CAN'T HANDLE IT! 360 FTW!"

I don't believe for one second that the intro-video shown as CES '09 was rendering all of that in real-time on the PS3. I do believe that the video is using the KZ2 engine though on a supercomputer due to limitations of the PS3 itself to render all those things at once.

Meh, what high-profile game hasn't pulled that trick yet? MGS4, Gears 1, Gears 2 for starters have used the in-game's engine to pre-render intense cut-scenes that would be impossible for the PS3 to render in real-time at an acceptable rate.

[Crazywhitie]

A rendered in real time Movie is the Same as CGI to me... If you want to use the word Real Time then rendered shouldn't go with it, It will be a pre-recorded video that has been tweaked here and there... same with are other games... The Cut scenes will look far better then the Game therefore Real time is out the window

[FantasyStar]

People should realize that even movies use supercomputers to achieve high visual fidelity all the time. Whether it's sound effects, modeling, down to high-class graphical simulators that developers pay by the hour to use.

I don't blame Guerrilla for choosing to go this route one bit. In fact, by doing this: they can significantly shorten their development time and get the game out sooner to make some money because instead of trying fiddle with resources to pick out the right ones that can be time consuming; Guerrilla simply takes all the code and feeds it in and the supercomputer spits out pure gold.

The only time I have a problem with this method is when the developers themselves try to mask the word "pre-rendered" under the word "rendered real-time" because that's purposely misleading people and that's awful. It gets the fanboys riled up and we end up in a PS3 recession because someone decided to try and play "PR man" -twisting words to make some sound better than others. FUD is created, and flame wars are inevitable when you see that one thread "KZ2 cutscene pre-rendered = PS3 FAIL".

If the developer just came out and said "hey, we used our in-house PS3s to pre-render this cutscene" -I'd be like "wow, cool!". But the fact that they're purposely misleading people is what irritates me. Who here actually likes being lied to?

[Ju]

MGS4 had pre-rendered CGI ? Do I have Alzheimer or ... I just can remember...

[callahan09]

@Fantasy Star (and anybody that read his ridiculous post):

That post up there has got to be filled with more "wrong" than anything I've ever read on this site. Are you joking or what? I can't tell. MGS4 had absolutely no pre-rendered cutscenes, it was all rendered in real-time. 100% of them.

What about the above quote don't you understand? NO pre-rendered cutscenes, everything is real-time. The PS3 can handle it. Period.

[FantasyStar]

MGS4 didn't have pre-rendered CGI. It's simply pre-rendered. It's basically using your in-game engine in an outside environment like a supercomputer/SDKs to render the rest of your work: then that footage is recorded and used as a cut-scene so that the PS3 isn't doing the work, but just streaming the footage. Although just to clear things up. MGS4 used 1-2 pre-rendered cutscenes out of the entire pack: so I'd still consider it acceptable. The same goes with Gears 1/2: 1-2 out of the 20 real-time rendered cutscenes is still acceptable.

@callahan

Perhaps I might've read it wrong, but we will see when KZ2 drops in February. I learned not to trust developers as much anymore. For example, if Beyond3D forum members didn't expose Haze as being rendered at sub-HD resolutions of 1024x576, would the PR really have told us in the first place? The fact of the matter is that if developers have something to hide. They'll do what they can to cover the truth until they get called out. When they have no where to run: that's when they'll admit it they were misleading people.

[Skerj]

Yup MGS4 used prerendered cutscenes, it wasn't like I could you know INTERACT with them as if they were realtime. Oh I could you say? I could shake the controller and clear Snake's Octocam and sometimes alter the view? Why. ..that's just something you'd be able to do in a realtime cutscene, not some prerecordered video playing back. *Gasp* This revelation blows my mind!!

On a less sarcasm filled note, GG has met and exceeded expectations for this game. They delivered and that's all that matters. You can all sit on the sidelines and b*tch and whine about minute details even though you've enjoyed "lesser" games in the past (graphically speaking), or you can let go and play the damn game and have fun.

[staub91]

Everyone was criticizing GG for their 2005 trailer, because it was CGI and had no real-time.

3 and half years later...

GG has all real time and no CGI, plus it looks and runs better than the original CGI.

Guerrilla Games has outdone themselves, they stepped up to the challenge and delivered big time. They amaze me.

Congrats GG!

[gambare]

Do you have the slight idea of what PRE RENDER means? no? ok I'll leave you a simple wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Sony has been doing pre renders since the PSX era, one of the most famous pre render movies was in the game FFVII, but the in game movies in KZ2 are not PRE RENDER, those are RTR or real time render

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

sorry to burst your bubble but the PS3 is an awesome RTR machine and guerrilla knows it and proves it

[thewhoopimen]

Skerj made an excellent point FantasyStar, how do you explain that every Snake CGI screen is interactive where you can actually shake the controller and change Snake's camo at ANY given point? Is it still rendered with the a farm of servers?

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

Now this would be awesome! However, the source of the article points to a forum and not even the actual post they are reffering to. I don't feel like wading through 68 pages of messages to confirm. Until I see real proof, I call shenanigans.

It would be awesome if true, because this would set the standard for the next PS3 games!!! Bout time they unlock the promised power of my PS3!

[badz149]

dude...wtf are you babbling about? are you even understand the meaning of pre-rendered? meh...what ever make you sleep better at night. once KZ2 released, please make sure that you don't forget to swallow your own words!

[SSCOOLCHEA]

There wouldn't be enough hospital beds for burn victims

[sit down droid]

pretty sad comment but i lold

[morganfell]

With Robbie Bach stating this morning that due to the financial situation this generation will last longer than the last, the PS3's heretofore unseen ability should make gamers sit up and take notice.

The PS3 is capable of things that most people will not believe until they see it. Epic is now officially old hat and the Unreal 3 engine yesterday's news.

Bach also downplayed the idea of a 10 year life cycle stating Sony made a mistake. Right Mr "4 years kill the Xbox" hang your fans out to dry.

[dragunrising]

Killzone 2 doesn't need CGI. Aside from being resource intensive, it is plain to see the engine has almost reached parity. In other words: Killzone 2 looks too good to use resource hogging CGI because it already looks just as good.

Just got Killzone 1 in the mail today :-)

PS: Morgan...I know we have our differences, however its good that we'll both be able to play Killzone 2. Cheers.

[morganfell]

It would not fly on the 360. The team utilized 6 SPUs at times.

[Torch]

You are correct, although having Killzone ported to the 360 would still prove beneficial to it's fanbase by serving as the most outstanding-slideshow screensaver utility ever to be on the console. ;)

[InMyOpinion]

I prefer in-game cutscenes to CGI, except for maybe some of Square's RPGs but that's about it.

[Fishy Fingers]

Me to, especially in this generation when in-game graphics are good enough. But SE do make some fantastic CGI. Shame they wont show any of it...

[hay]

Agreed. Square renders are incredible but I think with today's tech and visuals CGI's are becoming obsolete.
I did love transitions in ff7 and 8 between ingame and CGI. But MGS4 did it(without CGI) in jawdropping manner.

[Jager]

FFX... the transitions from real time to CGI where so flawless... and the CGI scenes were beautiful...

[Oner]

You know I actually agree with you Jenzo. It's not that using CGI is somehow bad or anything, but if used properly it can help make the experience just. that. little. bit. more. "epic"....(sometimes )

Though it is absolutely amazing that titles like MGS4, Uncharted & Killzone 2 (to name a few) have or are showing what can be done when dever's take their jobs seriously (just like Epic did with Gears 2 to an extent over Halo being a first party) and want to make something gamers - REAL gamers (not casuals) can appreciate and enjoy.

Innovation only grows the industry. MS, Sony & Ninty all benefit from that and it trickles down to us, which is the way it should be. They are the ones who are SUPPOSED to cater to us. As WE are their audience, NOT their investors & stock holders. So while it is absolutely understood that it all comes down to business (ultimately), certain priorities need to have EQUAL share or more attention than others in some cases.

That is what I and millions of others demand; and if not then we as a whole can dictate with our choice in who to support or not.

[gambare]

Prerender CGI movies are so last gen....

[Fishy Fingers]

Blood, sweat and tears went into creating that engine. Widely acknowledged as the best looking game out there (console at least), there is no need for CGI, their real time scenes look better than a lot of CGI scenes I've seen.

[eagle21]

You read my mind.

[Doctor Strange]

Agreed about all of the hardwork GG has put into this. They deserve a mountain of credit and I hope come February everybody buys the game, forget this console war just support the developers that seems to have made an awesome game for gamers everywhere.

[d3l33t]

I love the denial associated with this game. This entire article is filled with comments from 'gamers' who don't even understand the fundamental basis of Real Time Ray tracing and CGI. The video presented up to this date are not 'prerecorded' - that means that every polygon is drawn real time. What's so hard to understand about that? Yes it's an amazing feat, but that's why i invested in better technology. This game marks a true benchmark for programmers everywhere and the fact that they are setting the bar this high is a great thing. In the future we will see even more exciting processes used.

Simply amazing, i've waited a long time for this!

[u got owned]

This game is been hyped like sh@t. I hope it delivers. At least visually is delivering.

[princejb134]

i really hope it does deliver my friend
wanna play it badly cause of all the hype
hope it doesnt fail like socom with all the hype it was given
day 1 purchase killzone 2

[Giriath]

Fail article. The intro and ending are both CGI, presumably using "in-game assets". My guess is that what GG means with in-game assets is that they're either A: using the in-game models and polishing them up with CGI or B: making the models CGI from the ground up but of course have them look like their in-engine twins. If it's B, then everyone who assumes it's A are misunderstanding GG. And we've long since known that all other cutscenes are in-engine.

[callahan09]

You're just like Fantasy Star up above in a response to the first comment. NO PRE-RENDERED CUTSCENES, what about that can't you comprehend? Why would you even say that the intro and ending are CGI? It's completely unfounded.

[thewhoopimen]

The only way GG will be able to demonstrate it is real time is if they pull what Konami did with MGS4. Have some useless interactive feature to show the skeptics it ain't smoke and mirrors.

[OldParr]

for my eyes the cgi video back in 05 still looks better!!! there were so much goin on on that video that i havent seen anything like it on the current game and im including graphics. however, kz2 does have the crown for best looking console game.

[princejb134]

drools.....
power of the cell

[Megaton]

I gotta say I'm pretty blown away if the intro that was recently shown at GameTrailers isn't CGI. That's pretty much the best non-CGI graphics I've ever seen.

[M337ING]

That cutscene is CGI... I'm sure they're not counting it. It uses different assets from the game, as is obvious by some increased detail. Plus, it would be impossible to load all of those different environments in that quickly and render them that smoothly for an uninterrupted cutscene. The guy's face at the end also has exponentially more detail than any face I've seen from in-game footage.

That's probably the only CGI-rendered video on the disk, anyway.

The link doesn't even talk about CGI in-game, they're talking about the possibility of a CGI-based Killzone movie.

[Ju]

Non-gameplay cut scenes using the game engine usually can increase the detail level of the rendering. They can disable AI/Physics and do simple script based animation, freeing up these resources to increase the quality of the renderer using in game assets. Loading can be avoided using streaming. It also allows you to seamlessly transition from a cut scene to in game.

Not sure if this is the case, but just because it looks better doesn't mean its CGI (except you would consider "in game computer generated images" CGI).

[M337ING]

The fact remains, Ju, the kind of detail they had in the face of the Helghast leader at the end is unattainable on current games and so far beyond that of what I've seen in PS3 software so far that I doubt that scene was being rendered in real-time, regardless of the disabling of animations and physics.

The scene might be using some in-game assets, but its obvious that its pre-recorded footage.

[Ju]

That face had nothing but...the face. A black background and no additional objects. You can put all the polypower in that one scene to just render that face. Again, not sure if it is, but also does not mean it's not.

BTW: The same goes for the "space scene". Three warships, 2 planets, empty space. Star backdrop (and possibly flat texture).

The opening doesn't really contain much. 4-5 launch pads, in the distance, though. Flat environment, but high level of detail up close. And that's about it.

[callahan09]

It does NOT use different assets. It's just that the cutscenes are more detailed than the gameplay because they don't have to calculate player inputs and lighting/physics/AI responses to player inputs, leaving everything on board open to just render the pre-defined animation. Of course a pre-defined animation with no player input can contain more detail than interactive scenes.

[joevfx]

i just called my friend that is in the game biz and has made games for the PS3 before. he says everythign you see in the non gameplay scenes are indeed being rendered on the fly. it might look slightly better cause the devs have control over the camera and what is being scene and rendered at any givin time. My buddy has been in teh industry for some tiem now and he even says he is extremely impressed what GG got done.

[Ju]

Just to add that M337ING was right, the opening is a CGI. See a ref somewhere below (Seb answered this in the psboard somewhere), rest is ingame, though.

[PPnoPP]

It can be done on Xbox360 give me 50 million and I'll show you.

[morganfell]

You had 50 million already for GTAIV DLC. We're waiting to see it equal Killzone 2.

[Ilikegames76]

You sound just like his older brother trying to be a grown up.

[Ju]

I hope this is true (and I am sure it has been said somewhere before), but as sorry as I am, that link does not confirm this. They refer to this: http://boardsus.playstation...

And nowhere in this whole thread does he refer to "ingame cutscene not CGI". So, while I think it is, this confirms nothing. What he does is, he responds to a "[will you ever do a] action packed CGI KillZone animation movie".

[Fishy Fingers]

Yep, I just spent 10 minutes looking through 20+ pages of the thread and saw nothing other than what you said. Hmmmm...

[PPnoPP]

Also I'll add some colour so it won't just be grey.

[Magic_The_Celt]

And that is how you know you have a strong engine.

[pornflakes]

Kojima Productions = Sony War propaganda and just a poor midget with a touch of Donald Ducks face.

Guerilla Games = victims that worked for sonys cow farm in Japan when grubs where sold in stores as Uncle Bens rice!

Now Sony shippes the grubs around the world and their "would like to be american" ps3 owners from chinatown NY enjoy it! "This is living"

[ultimolu]

And they laughed at the cell. x3

[bviperz]

It was a nervous laugh, filled with uncertainty. Kind of like laughing at someone and at the same time hoping that someone doesn't kick your arse. I think you missed it.

[ultimolu]

Lol. xP

[Salta_nelas]

"It can be done on Xbox360 give me 50 million and I'll show you."

You had around 100M for Halo3 and 50M for GTA DLC...do any of those come close to KZ2?

Also 360 is out for 3 years and the best its got is still Gears, if it could be done it would be already.

IF...Maybe, It Might, Could be...but it isnt ;)

[PPnoPP]

That's because neither of those games took 5 or 6yrs to make.

[Ichiryoka]

too human

[sit down droid]

you really think halo 3 had a budget of 100,000,000. are you mistaken

[Rampant]

Back then it was "woow"
Back then it was also CG.

NOW, a few years later, the bar has been raised. It is still "wow", but at least one other game can show the graphics that killzone 2 does already, crysis. So, beautiful game, but not the UBERMEGAWOWZERS it was when it was first shown

[itchy18]

I think the cinematic intro was CGI.
http://boardsus.playstation...
Toothfairy04 wrote:
Is the movie CGI or real time just asking ? I guess its CGI right?

You'll have to be more specific. Which movie? The intro movie is cgi.

Seb Downie - QA Manager - Guerrilla Games

[Ju]

Good find. Even though I wanted to believe its in game, I am OK with that, though. Why not.

Is that actually a scene from the game ? I mean, does it play before the games starts or is that just a commercial ? (Somehow that look to me like that) But to answer that you'd probably need the full game, hah ?

Edit: Ah, Seb said its just a (small?) portion of the whole intro.

[HDgamer]

Your lies and fanboyism can't face reality. MGS4 or any MGS game were ever pre-rendered. Killzone 2 is not prerendered; of course you won't be playing neither.

[Nathan Hale]

Let's just pretend for a minute like there was no such thing as the 2005 killzone trailer. How would people react to this game without having anything to compare it to (2005 Trailer)? My point exactly.

This game looks freaking awesome.

[xtreampro_REVENGE]

at GG CES09 presentation they comfirmed that the intro with all those longs space crafts fighting in space was all CGI, its CGI running o the actuale PS3, the first 2005 CGI trailer was made on a PS3 that had 2 Cell Processors and 2 Graphics cards, oh yeah and if any of you r stil wondering if the 2005 TGS footage of MGs4 was realtime,....it was!!, but the reasone why it looked so good is because of the 2x's CELL and Graphics cards, it makes sense to me, cus if you judge how good KZ2 looks and then you add the extra CELL Processor, you'll end up with something far greater then the CGI footage but in real time

[Mc187]

I knew their was a reason I paid extra to have 2 cell processors in my PS3.

[Grahammad]

This is true but the intro cinematic is NOT in game, it is CG. Other than that it is all in game. This is nothing new though, every KZ game has always had their intros done in CG. Here's confirmation from Dev Sebastian Downie (Quality Assurance Manganer at GG).

http://boardsus.playstation...

I just want everyone to know this so we don't end up getting "Guerrilla lied again saying their intro was all real time... blah blah blah", they have never said that the intro is realtime nor does it even look like its in game.

[ambientFLIER]

Sigh... I'm buying Killzone on the day it comes out, yet I'm sick of the 2000 daily articles on the damn game. I don't give a sh]t if it's pre-rendered or not, and I don't give a sh]t about an extra pixel that the character models have received since 4pm last night. I'm almost starting to wish that this game disappoints just to spite everyone...

Here come the disagrees!!!

[joevfx]

we have to stop using the word CGI to talk about the difference between re-time and pre rendered. CGI is (computer generated imagery) EVERYTHING IS CGI, everthing is made on the computer. so stop using it . say pre-rendered or realtime rendered, its way more accurate.

[PS360PCROCKS]

duh. Most games nowadays use the engine to make the cut-scenes.