Sony Passed on Natal Tech, Explains Why

PSLS writes:

It's a little known fact that during the early days of the PlayStation Move, Sony had the opportunity to work with 3DV Systems. The Israeli based company, now owned by Microsoft, that specializes in digital imaging technology and the masterminds behind Natal. Ultimately, Sony chose to utilize a combination of light, a camera, and instruments used to measure the action of acceleration and magnetic fields instead of implementing the many patents undoubtedly held my 3DV. Recently, Dr. Richard Marks explained why.

[Gradient]

You have now experienced Project Natal.

[NJShadow]

Or go to Toys "R" Us and pull out the support bungee cord on the vinyl ball "jail cell", causing a wave of red balls to come flying at you.

At least you can feel awesome for 10 seconds before being escorted out by a man-sized giraffe. =)

[whateva]

>>>>>>

[Microsoft Xbox 360]

Sony has been using 3DV camera's in R&D for a while now. If you watched the Engadget show about the PSMove, Richard Marks explains how it may be robust using 3DV cams but the current PSEye can essentially deliver the same experience to the end user. That's why they decided to bring in the Move controller. Physical buttons and pure 1:1 tracking is the only way motion control gaming can capture both the casual and the hardcore gamers.

[sikbeta]

PS3 + PS-Move = Minority Report = EPIC

That's All I care... well, and Real Games like SOCCOM4 too...

[Bigpappy]

point #1: PSeye or Eye toy are not #D camera's because they can not sense depth (back and forth motion.

Point #2: the 3DV-Zcam is not the same design as Natal. They are both 3D cameras, but Natal for one, uses to lenses and has different software.

Point #3: Natal will not and can not be used with older 360 games with out having to re-optimize them (who would want to do that?).

Point #4: We will see if M$ knows what they are doing at E3 this year.

Off topic: Nice touch with The Red Ring on the 360. Shows this is a PS3 site for PS3 fanboys. Lets see what happens after E3. Maybe Sony is right and M$ is wasting their time with a glorified Eyetoy.

[lowcarb]

After seeing that video no wonder Sony's hot in there commercials. Seems MS has pretty much taken an old idea and improved it for 360. MS has said there will be peripherals (you can scan in)which is where I think it leaves Move behind. Allowing you to use your legs, voice,finger, arms, facials, controller or no controller is going to be what separates the two. At E3 we will see which one looks more fun and serious. One confusion that keeps floating around is the talk of no controller for Natal when in fact they have stated time and time again some games will use them. Move relies on a controller while Natal relies on whats best for different games.

[HolyOrangeCows]

So you don't think depth perception can be simulated by software threw lighting and motion and you don't think that PS EYE will ever have software to allow body tracking?

Mama Bear and Cold Porridge fail again.

[jden28]

Why does everyone say that Sony or Nindendo were the first to do motion controlls, its not true ! Before the eyetoy or the Wii were even a glimmer of a thought in thier minds Microsoft had already release a PC motion controller and were well on their way to the next step force feedback before any of the other products ever existed. The tech was similar to the six-axis which is why Microsoft refused to adopt it in the x360 the already have and own that tech and knew it's limitations. But It's important to remember that just because 1 or even 2 company's pass on something it doesn't mean that the tech can't be adopted and work well... For instane the only resone that sony got into the console business is because Nintendo passed on its CD tech all the years ago. And the Sega Saturn (showing my age here) wouldn't have been such a mess if they hadn't passed on the tech that later became the N64.

[Microsoft Xbox 360]

Who cares who did what first. 1st generation of anything sucks.

[mikeslemonade]

This guy has a PHD so he must be right about how MOVE is just better than Natal.

[3XP]

I'm sure there are people holding PHDs that would say Natal is better. This guys works for Sony, what do you expect him to say.

@Bigpappy (Above)

You made a lot of great points, it's really sad to see so many people disagreeing with you, not because that actually don't agree but because they don't want to hear it.

Bubbles up.

[beardpapa]

I noticed a lot in the article the mentioning of the word "costs"

If those rumors of a $99 360 are to be true, Microsoft could easily create a $199-249 sku with included Natal. Consumers will be faced with the dilemma of going home with a $99 360 which... is inexpensive but lacking, or go home with a reasonably priced sku with the extras.

Effectively it would be like the dilemma we all faced when thinking of getting a Premium or Core bundle, or Elite vs Arcade. Of course, this is all just me saying 'if' it were to happen, this could also mean Natal could efficiently be in lots of households.

Now the Move ... I wonder how Sony will convince consumers to grab this accessory to extend the PS3 experience, and I wonder if they will include a reasonably affordable solution for new owners wanting the PS experience. And I only say this given Sony's track record when it comes to effectively marketing their products and getting consumers to notice it.

@Jden: I don't really poke at people but the typos in your spiel indicate your age well.

[ChozenWoan]

To Bigpappy
point #1: PSeye or Eye toy are not #D camera's because they can not sense depth (back and forth motion.

Answer #1: Correct. However, they can detect X and Y axis motion as well as the size of the PSMoves glowing sphere which allows them to extrapolate the distance of the PSMove to within 1 centimeter at up to 10 feet. 1 centimeter is the width of an adult finger, which is only discernible by Natal when your around 3 feet away from the cam.

---
Point #2: the 3DV-Zcam is not the same design as Natal. They are both 3D cameras, but Natal for one, uses to lenses and has different software.

Answer #2: The 3DV-Zcam has always used two lenses, they where just mounted horizontally instead of vertically. As for the software, it is only able to compensate for the hardware so much. Ohh and here is a pic of the orginal 3DV-Zcam:
http://www.engadget.com/pho...

---
Point #3: Natal will not and can not be used with older 360 games with out having to re-optimize them (who would want to do that?).

Answer #3: Well it was MS that promised that Natal would work with the entire library of games. Sony didn't make this promise, but it looks like it might be possible... I said Might so don't miss quote me.

---
Point #4: We will see if M$ knows what they are doing at E3 this year.

Answer #4: Correct again.

.

To jden28
While it is true that Sony got into consoles thanks to Nintendo, Sega's tech was actually better than the N64. The problem was they didn't support it long enough for the platform to catch on.

Ohh and it was Sega who helped get MS into the console business. They worked with them while building the Dreamcast, and XBoxLive was originally intended to be used as the online hub for that console. When the press got wind of the fact that MS was working on a project for a console, they assumed it was for a MS console. MS's eye's lighted up and they saw an opportunity to enter the console market strong. Sega, shortly after MS's announcement of the Xbox, decided to pull the plug on the Dreamcast.

[Syronicus]

Because it's lame. Plain and simple. After seeing the two techs in action, Move trumps Natal. I want to see my current games with motion control tech and Move will do that. The tech demos for Move are simply amazing and as for Natal, hitting big red balls is not my cup of tea and shooting the screen with my fingers is just plain dumb.... Pew, Pew, Pew!

[andron]

I mean it can't be healthy going around seeing dildos everywhere, it's bound to get you into some kind of trouble. lol

The Natal tech will have limited use in gaming, so I'm glad Sony went went the better option. If your going to have hardcore gaming with motion tech, you need buttons...

[ShinRyuHadoken]

So in other words. Sony says Natal will fail. correct me if I am wrong.

[Syronicus]

No, actually Sony would be the first to boast of Natal's success. Isn't that what we have come to expect from competing companies PR groups?

/Sarcasm

[Inside_out]

Pretty bad article...Project Natal WILL sell out this holiday season...EVERY kid will want to talk to Milo...plain and simple...This PS3 Fanboy article won't change a thing...The rumored price cut with Natal will cost as much as a stand alone PS3 with no game included...What's Sony gonna do then...Glorified Wii ports are NOT gonna cut it...

Listen, I have a PS3...Sony needs to pick up the pace here...Nobody like's a one horse race...STILL...I own a 360 and a wii...What motivation do I have to buy Move ( terrible name BTW )...EA has said they will port their wii games over...REALLY...they suck to begin with...Sony's been reactive this whole gen...They are losing a fortune just to keep up and now this....Could be a blood bath for PS3 this holiday....

Sony has a huge back log of games that would look great in HD with the Move controller...They need to embrace third party developers and fast...This " only on PS3 " crap is not going to cut it...KZ3 is not enough...How many things can they give away for FREE...this gen practically over.......moving on....

[Ju]

^^^ reading through that comment above, I am missing the /s. Where is it ?

[Boody-Bandit]

I am assuming the /s would = sanity since s/ = sarcasm would mean they are joking and unfortunately that isn't the case.

[King_of _the_Casuals]

Nintendo once passed on CD technology made by Sony. (That technology eventually became the PlayStation.) How did that decision turn out for Nintendo?????

[FrankenLife]

Sony passed on Natal because they were interested in gaming. MS is doing Natal because of their PC market. Natal will have a much greater influence on the non-game market than it will on games.

[Anon1974]

...I didn't realize that Sony had passed on Natal as well.

[barom]

@BigPappy
@Point #2: the 3DV-Zcam is not the same design as Natal. They are both 3D cameras, but Natal for one, uses to lenses and has different software.

Just going on the fact that Microsoft bought 3DV Systems and announced Natal only a few months later. I have to say you are terribly wrong.

[rbrtchng]

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

@5:10 to 5:16

The PS Eye does track depth (back and forth). Notice the box getting bigger and smaller as he moves his head forward and back.

[Dee_91]

so the difference between natal and PSeye is it can tell how close up or how far back you are ? I thought PSeye could do that .. well it seems like it when i played creature feature

@ jden28
was that before or after duck hunt for nintendo?

[edwineverready]

It explains a lot i did not know about move and natal. It also shows that move has more hardcore game potential and is backward compatibility which is going to be a problem with natal. also because they took out the chip in natal latency is going to be a problem. Move has a light on the controller eliminating the room lighting problems natal will have.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

"also because they took out the chip in natal latency is going to be a problem."

Actually, that couldn't be further from the truth and is a huge misconception that taking out the chip is a bad thing.

Using a chip, your computation power is pretty much limited to whatever the chip can put out.

By using the 360's they can throw a lot more horsepower at the problem by taxing the CPU/GPU on the 360 to reduce the lag in instances where it is needed more. It is a much more flexible system at the cost of reduced graphics. Also updating the software on the 360 is probably much easier than some proprietary chip.

I think it is a great design, reduced manufacturing cost and potentially increased accuracy whenever needed.

[Biggest]

So you're saying taking processor power from the games and using it for the camera is a good thing? That doesn't make a lot of sense.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

Gameplay trumps graphics any time, so yes! I want them to take away from graphics to give the controllers better accuracy because I care about game play, not digital art.

With poor controls, it doesn't matter how great the game is every other aspect is so I would say that makes a lot of sense.

Just my opinion as a real gamer....

[Heisenberg]

to make excuses for them? So it's good that they had to take from column A to make column B work sufficiently? Just because you prioritize gameplay over graphics, doesn't mean it's a good thing that one has to be sacrificed to accommodate the other.

Personally, I like my games to have fun gameplay, AND look great...

Just my opinion as an apparently fake gamer.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

I'm glad you enjoy poor game play mechanics as long as it has great graphics. Perhaps you would enjoy a game where the whole purpose is to look at pretty pictures by pressing a button....

Perhaps you should stop playing games and watch more movies. The "graphics" there are great and beat any game on the market.

You are sacrificing graphics for better controls. Good controls is a requirement for a good let alone a great game. Graphics is NOT!

[Heisenberg]

you shouldn't have to have one or the other. read the post before you respond.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

That would be in an ideal world where computing resources doesn't cost money. You have to balance the cost of the product with what you are able to offer.

Of course, I would love to have an affordable gazillion core CPU inside Natal, but that isn't very cost effective is it?

So what is your point?

[Heisenberg]

It causes more problems than it solves IMO. I would rather pay more for a better product than pay a little less at the cost of the products potential.

[IdleLeeSiuLung]

I understand, but consumers don't see it that way.

They want an affordable product and by removing the chip the products become affordable while making it not only easier to support the product with software updates, but also potentially give the developer the flexibility to decide how much processing power to dedicate to the controllers. You need more, you get it. You need less, free it up for graphics.

An affordable product means it is more likely adopted by consumers and without adoption it doesn't matter how much potential the product has. Besides people greatly enjoyed the Wii despite its last generation graphics.

[whateva]

so did Nintendo!

the price wasn't right at the time and it didn't add enough to what they could already do with Eyetoy for the price. but soon it will be cheap enough for the gaming world and that's when sony will add it to the PS4's Eyetoy

[ChozenWoan]

They will just need to upgrade the cam to be 720p at 120fps and it will drastically increase the accuracy and will keep the lag to roughly < 1 frame. I would say it will reduce lag to 0.5 frames, but I expect gen 8 consoles to do 1080p at 120fps native.

[ThatCanadianGuy]

Pew! Pew! P-(flashing red lights)

[Zero 007]

Sony first let him explain him self with stupid Dild** motion controller
copy pest from wii nothing special at all

BTW Sony also Microsoft can support 3D glass only on one update for xbox 360 will can be support 3D glass ** only one update ** lool

[ThatCanadianGuy]

I honestly didn't understand a damn thing you wrote.

[cool cole]

Canada FTW

[awesomeperson]

Umm 007, whats 3d glass, is it like a sliding glass door thats 3d?

[The Killer]

so basically if u buy Natal then u r directly supporting a terrorist state and the zionist!!!

how so like MS doing such things!! now u believe me why i say MS is a zionist tool??

free your mind from the prison the zionist put almost on half of the humanity: http://www.youtube.com/watc...

MS is evil, zionist, money vampire, greedy and have crap products!! thats why i will never ever buy 360!!!

[TheXgamerLive]

First off DOUCHE, you call yourself "THE KILLER" so your never one to give advise on what's good or bad and you use the avatar of a pedo, second Israel is not what you say, they are a nation trying to protect itself only, it's the other nations that surround it that are like you "The Killers" so please shut it, because you know not what you speak.

[Foliage]

First off, MJ wasn't a Pedo. It was all a ploy to tarnish his reputation and image. The same intentions were behind portraying him as if he was losing his mind. Do some basic research and stop going off of what CNN tells you. Watch any of the interviews before he mysteriously died because a doctor "screwed up" and killed him. You will find that he is perfectly of mind, and his words make a lot of sense. The man had a huge following and didn't share the same interests and beliefs as the government. That always equals a bad result. See Tu Pac and his ending of the Blood and Cripz feud, and not following every other rapper and preaching hate, drugs, and killing... which is how the government wants these common rappers "from the street" to preach to the common people and suppress any other voice but their own.

As for Israel only defending themselves... you must be a Jew, an America, or a simpleton. Palestine had no choice but to attack because Israel was preventing them from having any basic living standard. They cut off food, medical care and water and left millions of Palestinians on the brink of death. Palestine attacked to open the borders and provide their people a chance at life. Israel attacked to kill and steal, not defend.

Israel is the tail that wags the American dog. The whole world except these two nations see it clearly as it is. You are nothing but a mindless sheep, which is exactly what they want and expect of you.

[weazel]

Before you start lecturing everyone on global politics, I suggest you try and get a fuc*ing clue as to just what you're babbling about. Israel is caught in a catch 22, whereby they are provoking neighbouring states/countries, but then feel aggrieved when there's an inevitable response. This then prompts Israel to provoke neighbouring states/countries, etc, etc, ad infinitum.
All participants in that whole clusterf*ck can legitimately be seen as both victims and aggressors.

[Comet]

Guys, take it easy on Zero 007, he's only a kid...
He still hasn't grown up like the other 90% of 14 year olds on Xbox Live who still go "Pyoo-Pyoo" on little aliens (Halo).

[mirroredderorrim]

When Natal launches, Sony should do the same thing Microsoft did, during a PS3 launch in the EU territories(crapping on the parade)... Have a giant screen rolled up right next to the "launch party", playing the video that Whateva just linked, edited for quality. E.g: picture and sound.

At the end of the video it would read "We passed on this, but try this!"
Insert Kevin Butler and some of his well written jokes, show unfinished games that are in the pipline. :P

Kevin Butler: Are we worried about the competition?
I'll just say... Natatall! XD

[beardpapa]

It's funny you mention this because I remember that EU launch very well with the boat in the river and the massive banner.

[GrandDragon]

Did you even pay attention? it's not only the cost but the limitations of the hardware itself. What's funny is that both Nintendo and Sony turned down 3DV due to their hardwares limitations.

MS knowing that the hardware is weak bought the entire company out and sacrificed quite a chunk of the 360's processing power in order to make it work, this only means one thing...

MS were desperate.

[AutoCad]

So, you are saying tht the Wii is stronger thn the 360.?
I dont understand your statement.

[ViciousBoston]

he isn't saying that. What I believe he is saying is that Nintendo and Sony weren't willing to vastly sacrifice their systems capablities for an add-on.

[jden28]

What Sony and Nintendo saw back in 2006 and 2007 is not what natal is today. Microsoft saw and was impressed by the tech the same way sony and Nintendo were. The difference was that microsoft was already developing a similar tech inhouse, that is why the can make that claim. Natal is a combination of Microsofts inhouse tech and what Sony and Nitendo were shown. And it is that combination such as infared sensor that tracks you in darkness and software from Microsoft that alows Natal to learn and predict your movements, even seeing your hands behind your back that diffrenciate this interation of the Natal tech and what Sony and Nintendo saw 3 and 4 years ago. Oh yeah as far as latency Peter Molonuex is chomping at the bit to tel the world about the latest interation but has been hushed until E3. But while we're on the subject of latency I can't imagine it being worse than the Wii latency. And if you watch the video's of Playstation Move carfully you can see that while when using only the Move controller thing are true 1.1 when they add in the Playsyation Eye to the mix You can see noticable lag.

[Ju]

We'll see how that ends.

What Sony (and maybe Nintendo) saw, is, that without additional controls an optical input system is usele.., err, very limited. No tech in the world can change that. Gesture control can only go that far.

MS might be smart. Throw the camera at people - just to sell them additional add-ons (e.g. controllers!) to make it usable. For a premium price, as always.

A camera alone does not work. Simple. That is what other companies in years of research - and actual products on the market - learned. Sure, M$ money can revert that conclusion in 10% of the time. And as always, M$ is smarter./s

[Ninji]

It was called the Eyetoy.

[GrandDragon]

So let me get this straight, MicroSh!t bought out a company in desperation knowing that the hardware they just acquired from this company is a piece of sh!t sacrificing the 360's processing power in the process to get the dam thing to work just so they could beat Sony's PS-Move?

LOOOOOOOOOL!!

[Zero 007]

Natal support full body 3D games with voice required
eyetoy for kids support only hands moves and play with 2D colours and 2D games buahahah

hey lion***ik RROD >> YOLD
I have 2 PS3 already dead bcuz YOLD and i can't fixed buahahah
My xbox 360 RRLOD already fixed in 20$
rrod >> YLOD conformed

edit : CPU problem or controller i don't care
rrod >> YLOD buahahah
come fixed my Crapstation 3 YLOD if u can ...?? buahahah
thanx to Microsoft give as 3 years warranty for xbox 360
**sorry for my bad english **

[Lionhead]

Please tell me English isn't your first language, because you are just embarrassing yourself.

Edit: Shows how "smart" *cough* you are. YLOD is just as easy to fix as the RROD, I repair RROD's all the time, and the problem with that is how cheaply made the motherboard was compiled. The hardware has little to NO breathing room in the little white box, and the clamps on the motherboard do not provide sufficient pressure against the CPU and GPU. Funny how you can go out and buy a few screws and some new thermal paste and fix the 360 in a heartbeat, yet Microsoft couldn't.

So tell me how it is that Microsoft messed up that bad?

Edit 2: Looks like you couldn't even provide a rebuttal, what a terrible terrible troll. I knew you had no knowledge in the garbage you preach.

LOL Controller problem? I bet you don't even know what the acronym CPU stands for, go look it up on Google though. As you would say buahahah

[PLASTICA-MAN]

Jump suits? What an euphemism, better say Jail suits!
So you must go to jail and keep your suit to play Natal?

[thereapersson]

What the hell is a "YOLD"?

[awesomeperson]

"rrod >> YLOD conformed"

So RROD is over YLOD yet similar in character? Thats what conformed means.

But you do realize that having a 4 year+ old tech even being able to compare well to a 2010 piece of tech means its pretty good.... The PS3 eye can have voice recongition and nearly everything Natal has, without the lag.

Natal is failing before its even coming out, laggy, having a limited scope of activities (how many genres of games will you be able to play without buttons, tell me), not picking up colour black, limited voice recognition library and general bugginess.

Sony only accepts quality hardware unlike M$ who will settle for the things which they can sell for the most ammount of money and which they have to do the least work with.

[Def Warrant]

LOL i think i found the most delusional troll here yet. This guy actually admitted RROD is better than the YLOD lol. Yes i'll take a 54% chance of failure over a 10% chance lol.

[blitz0623]

he is right.
RROD >> YLOD since 36% >> 3%

[Lionhead]

Is that 360 RROD'd? lol

[GrandDragon]

I just noticed that lol.

[GrandDragon]

Dude I never said the Wii's more stronger than the 360, I said 3DV's camera technology is weak not the 360.

Think about it why would MS buy technology knowing how weak it is and then sacrifice their own consoles processing power to get the camera to work?

That just seems like a stupid move, because it also gives MS's first party developers a pain in the ass due to the processing power they have now lost because of Natal.

EDIT: For those that don't know Richard Marks has had years of research in 3D camera technology, so he definitely knew what he was doing when he turned 3DV down and went for a better camer+controller option.

[cheetah]

Natal is gonna flop like a fish out of water.

[dktxx2]

Oh no natal will sell unbelievably. But not because of what it does, but because of what Microsoft will say it does. And people will believe every word they say. Especially Americans. They love their bullSh*t.

[zekks2k9]

hope u say the same thing when e3 comes and also when it releases

[JeffGUNZ]

Stop generalizing. You don't even know what Natal's final product is capable of. Why can't people keep their mouths shut and just wait for E3 to see if Natal is really going to be something special of just an average attachment for a 360. People talk about it like they have played it and experience the final product. A lot of the people on this site are the same kind of people who already know what side they are going to vote for before the candidates are even named. It's pathetic. See it and experience it, THEN make up your mind.

[AK46]

@ jeffgunz You should practice what you preach.

[JeffGUNZ]

Really? I am pretty sure I don't do that at all. I am actually not pumped for natal, for I have not seen it's final product, so until then, I hold judgment. Listen little kid, I never trash something I don't know anything about. Sure, i think the PS3 MOVE looks like a complete rip-off of the WII, but until I sit down and try it, I will hold final judgment if it is the same or actually much different. Unless you can bring up some examples of what I have acted upon in the past, then do yourself a favor and shut your pie hole.

[dktxx2]

You never trash what you don't know, yet you called him a little kid.

I know Microsoft is going to hype this to hell. They already have. Take Milo for example. They led people to believe that Natal was so advanced that it actually was capable of having a conversation with you. That's going to be their strategy for this thing. They're going to show off amazing staged demos for it, and let people use their imaginations to decipher what natal is capable of doing. They won't elaborate. The media will buy into it like the suckers they've been, and it will sell because of the silent promises Microsoft makes.

[JeffGUNZ]

I think a lot of people are forgetting that last E3 was a TECH DEMO. I think people assume that a tech demo is the final build or what the product can do at that time. A tech demo showcases what they WANT this technology to do and what it will be able to do in the future. Milo and Kate was a perfect example of personal interaction. It showed real-time scanning of objects and personal connections. Will they be able to program endless replies to any question asked, who knows?! We have to wait and see what they ACTUALLY have gathered and if they met the goals of their tech demo presentation. I don't see Microsoft showcasing ANYTHING this technology can't do this E3. Like I mentioned before, we have to wait and see what they have actually done. Natal really hasn't been THAT hyped by Microsoft. We really don't know the important things to Natal, like WHAT games are created and the limits of tech. I have seen a lot of website hype natal and that is annoying. Almost all of my friends who game but do not go on websites like these, or my friends who are more casual gamers, never even heard of Natal yet!

Your above post is doing it again, your opinion is just that, an opinion, you can't say what it is going to be like it's a fact. I sure hope Natal will be great, but I am not going to hold my breath until Microsoft's E3 presentation.

[chaos-lockheart]

To bad if I wanted to play in the dark i can't hmmm

[Bigpappy]

He said it could not distinguish colors in the dark. Inferred can see in the dark.

[Biggest]

So then you can only play 1 player in a completely empty room in the dark?

[Ju]

"Inferred"...hm, interesting.

[3XP]

He meant infared.

[Halo3 MLG Pro]

It's not the first time Sony made a bad decision. MiniDisc anyone?

[cheetah]

lol, bluray anyone?

[Brklynty1]

And Mini Blu-ray is already developed and waiting for a device to support it, PSP2 anyone?....

[NewYork214]

your a ******* idiot.

[Boody-Bandit]

You are a riot and without shame.

I would list all the mistakes MS had made over the years but I would be up all night compiling it.

But hey thanks for the chuckle before I head off to hit the rack.

[Brklynty1]

Also your Fanboyism for the 360 and hate for PS3 has blinded you so much you forgot to notice the part where it says Nintendo passed up on the tech. What's it for them, a bad move? 70million units worldwide says hello to that...

[HolyOrangeCows]

DVD anyone?

[hac-hunter]

Vista anyone?

[aiphanes]

Windows Me anyone?

XBOX 360 HD-DVD add one anyone?

[beardpapa]

Minidisc was actually quite the popular item in Japan back in the day. It also had its niche here in the US within the music industry. It's just that cassettes were big during the day, and the transition to compact discs was smooth provided there were ample support from the home stereos that played CDs, portable players, and car radios too [even today]. Minidisc on the other hand was popular enough among the niche crowd that some imported Japanese aftermarket radios with minidisc/CD support.

Some people think the Zune music sharing is neat but people had been sharing music between each other in the 90s using their portable minidisc recorders/players. And not to mention the extraordinary battery life those things had.

[HolyOrangeCows]

http://www.engadget.com/200...

16GB available to handheld games...the amount of win could be immeasurable.

[West_Coast_G]

that would be insane, although it would be hard to fit the necessary parts to read and play mini-bd's within a handheld and keep heat down, I think. Im not a mechanical engineer, though, so what do I know?

[The Wood]

is all that has to be said to that fool...take off ur fanboy specs plum

[Absolut_Turkey]

@failo3 mlg pro
Wow. You just make it too easy. There's a reason why YOU own an Xbox 360. You know, the console with over a 50% FAIL rate? Your choices say a lot about you, ya know?

OT: Natal will sell well. Natal will be kinda fun. Natal is and always will be TECHNOLOGICALLY inferior to the Move, period! And before you try to disagree with me READ THE ARTICLE!

[mac4u10]

Windows vista anyone...epic fail

[TotalPS3Fanboy]

I guess I am too late. You guys already owned him. LOL.

[Arnon]

Lol wtf? There's flash drives bigger than 16.5 GB. If there's any "possibilities", they're already accessible.

[HolyOrangeCows]

Except flash technology at those capacities are expensive as heck.

Mini Bluray discs cost between $10-$20.

[bjornbear]

Microsoft anyone?

Oh yeah I went there

mini disks sucked @$$, but as far as console tech is concerned, Sony knows its stuff, too bad i can't say the same about.......

[Arnon]

http://cgi.ebay.com/128GB-U...

There's many other, more convenient options to a miniature disc.

[HolyOrangeCows]

Manufacturers don't create products at Ebay prices, however.

[Brklynty1]

Also its safe to say, Natal won't be BC. That's going to be the biggest downfall really. Its gonna be that same lame excuse, "after many adjustments, unfortunately Natal won't support previous titles, but you can look forward to an amazing lineup of titles releasing that will support it" BULL.....SH!T 360 owners don't wanna hear that. I'm sorry, I'm no fanboy, but I see the Move having more potential as its been proven hardcore games will work with it.

[NewYork214]

im lookin forward to move more then natal by a long shot. i need a controller at all times because i dont want to look like a complete fool grabbing nothing. it looks more foolish then the wii/move. im slightly drunk so pardon what ever is wrong with this post. sorrrryyyyyyy

[theunleashed64]

@halo3 mlg pro

lol another fanboy in a sony article (not very surprising)

[Bzone24]

lol. You do realize that Natal is Microsoft don't you? So this isn't just a sony article.

[Throwaway2020]

Holy sh!t, how is this not a bigger vid since it's natal but on ps2. Richard Marks is Awesome! He clearly decided that this wasn't good for proper games and I gotsta agree. How long ago was this?

[theunleashed64]

flashing...lights,lights,light s...(RROD)...flashing...lights, lights,
lights,(RROD).....

[Raoh]

interesting..

sony needed to continue promotion of the eyetoy, not allowing nintendo or microsoft to steal its thunder

[jden28]

Come on people pay attention to what WAS and WAS NOT said. Both Sony, and Nintendo admit to seeing EARLY interations of what we now know is Natal as far back as 2006 & 2007.

First both Sony and Nintendo admit to being impressed by the technology and what could be achieved with a TRUE 3D camera, but their issue was the COST.

Second anything that they saw 3 and 4 years ago has all issues being addressed and improveed. Heck Peter Molonuex admits to seeing over a dozen interations of it in the past year since it was shown at E3.

Third Natal doesn't need glow spheres as it tracks you using infared and can see in the dark now.

Fourth Microsoft has addressed the cost issue competley by removing the co-processor from Natal.(I personally didn't like this Idea as I believe it will later bite them in the arse).

[Ju]

Nothing has changed since 2006. Its not so much the technology, but what you can do with it.

These limits are still in place.

For additional costs you can achieve marginal better results as the eyetoy. Sony decided its just not worth it - for basically the same result.

Without controller it will be a next gen EyeToy. With the same (refined) applications. No Socom4 will ever run on Natal. Not without an extra controller (whatever M$ will call that).

[earbus]

When the new xbox launches natal will have plenty of power to use plus its pc compatible so there will intrest there its alot more advanced then the eyetug as move is more advanced than wii.
Seems like people will argue allways but i think ms will get used to the tech with casual games first and evolve it with a new console bringing it into hardcore games later like sixth axis alot of devs are exited about natal e3 will shed more light for sure , looking forward to some casual games to play it will be a nice change from the hardcore multi all the time. In ozz we have flavored milk drinks called moove so when someone gets me a chocolate moove i hope it aint a brown stained move controller i wanted a drink not pooh on an orb stick lol.

[TheEvilGeneral]

It would be weak tech if they hadn't figured out the lighting problem. But they did and infrared solved that issue pretty quickly.

I'm sorry, but if you're not part of the flame wars, trying to speculate how the Move and Natal are going to be always end up in the same places: the Move looks like Sony's version of the wii (lots of plus's and minus's) and Natal looks like a videogame system from a sci-fi film. And just based on those deferent marketing approaches, Microsfts product looks like the fresh, cool new thing, because we all know by now how a wii-like device works.

So for the Move, it's destiny is pretty much determined- it's going to have games similar to the wii, some better some worse. If I have a wii already, the novelty has worn thin I think by now.

Natal reminds you of an eye toy, though is nothing like the eye toy- because the eye toy was not marketed or developed or even really considered as game system. So to me it's destiny is way more ambiguous- and so much more interesting. Because-

At E3, SONY is not going to impress anyone with the Move. No one. Because they cant- their product has already been broken in by a company they were making fun of all this time. Best thing they can say is they did it a little better, here's the graphics to prove it, sorry we don't have any mario games for you guys. Give or take.

At E3, Microsoft has something no one else has, and believe me they will go out of their way to make sure everyone knows it. Now if it's going to be an amazing new experience- there's a good chance it wont be. But- there is a chance, a small chance, it might be- a chance that Sony forfeited by copying Nintendo to the T.

Thats why EVERYONE from all corners of the console war will be looking very closely to see what they came up with. That's why to me it's way more exciting following Natal than the Move.

[Bigpappy]

Your points are well delivered. These guys are going to be mad at you though. They know what you are saying is true,but MOST of them, here at N4G prefer to turn a blind eye to the truth and cling to console loyalty instead.

The proof is in the pudding. E3 is where M$ get to show what they came up with. But the concept is strong, and if they deliver will give them a lot of attention in areas where you would not expect people to be interested in gaming. Notice how much they hate what I have to say. I call it as it is not to increase bubbles. What is the point of being untrue to yourself to satisfy a few fanboys on N4G?

[cayal]

Sounds like you live in a sci-fi world.

[Biggest]

@ TheEvilGeneral

You say the Move has some plus and some minus of the Wii-mote. Do you care to explain that?

You said the Move will only have games like the Wii. Can you explain why they showed games at the GDC that will not ever be able to happen on the Wii?

You said the Natal is nothing like the EyeToy because it wasn't promoted as a new gaming system. Can you explain how calling two similar things two different things makes them different?

You say the Move won't impress anyone at E3 because of the Wii. Can you explain why there are so many developers that are already excited about the Move?

I do agree that many people will be following the Natal in coming months. But for me it is more the car wreck syndrome than anything. They've already called enough attention to the product while showing some of the most disappointing hardware in recent memory.

[TheEvilGeneral]

"You say the Move has some plus and some minus of the Wii-mote. Do you care to explain that?"

-Plus's and minus's - It looks like the Wii. As a product- when people hold it, use it, whatever. Plus's - it's a proven control scheme. If you like the Wii you'll probably like the Move. Minus's - everybody's gut reaction is it looks like a Wii clone, that's more expensive. That's all, not saying that the minus's are any big deal or for that matter the plus's.

"You said the Move will only have games like the Wii. Can you explain why they showed games at the GDC that will not ever be able to happen on the Wii?"

-Yes, games similar to the wii, more or less. Uhm, not that crazy of statement I think. The more are the Wii-sports, Metroid 3 sort, the less anything with the PSEye camera, as the Wii doesn't have a camera. But the camera games have lag (due to the camera) so the majority of them should be novelty based more than skill based.

"You said the Natal is nothing like the EyeToy because it wasn't promoted as a new gaming system. Can you explain how calling two similar things two different things makes them different?"

Back in 2001-02, we had devices that would play mp3 files. Creative, Sans digital, etc. Then Apple introduced the Ipod, and all of a sudden we had real mp3 players. The EyeToy is not a good example of anything- not of a succesfull product, a good gaming system, or even a fully realized idea. Microsoft has the opportunity for an actual product that can set the standard and bring to the mainstream a new way of playing games, similar how Nintendo did with the wii.

"You say the Move won't impress anyone at E3 because of the Wii. Can you explain why there are so many developers that are already excited about the Move?"

I dont think excited is the same as impressed. You're always excited about new things, especially in tech. But if you were around for the last 5-6 years in the gameing business, everything new and novel with motion controls and batton you hold in your hand has been demoed by Nintendo a hundred times over. It's not impresive anymore, especially watching Sony do it all over again in oh so many ways.

[Time_Is_On_My_Side]

Sony my make business decisions that many people question, but in the end they were well thought through and they also take risks. That's why I think MOVE has a better chance because they can potentially steal Nintendo's market and achieve what Natal can do with something I like to call buttons.

Come on, who wants to use their hands as a gun, what is this, third grade?

[A change in the wind]

Why because pew pew pew pew

[theunleashed64]

@bigpappy=fail

@evilgeneration=fail

also bigpappy you're bubbles are excellent good

[theunleashed64]

bu bu bu bu teh lagtal is better pew pew pew pew pew pew

what is third grade? pew pew pew pew

[Meryl]

Yeah natal is so great if people are complaining about a 133ms lag(actually its more like 22ms plus tv delay) then 200ms+ lag for natal will be horrible as it has an even bigger more visible lag, are you all happy now.
You know there are reasons why Nintendo also turned it down as well, but Sony and Nintendo did not bash it to death they was respectful and just said it did not meet their vision of what they wanted to do

[ivant]

The line-of-sight, IR or orb recognition was the safer option to go with if Sony wanted to implement a wii-mote controller, asap

Natal type technology would require a lot more R&D investment and problem solving to get it working perfectly, and is more restricted in its uses.

But voice, hand, head, and body recognition would be useful as an ACCESSORY for many games, incl. shooters and driving sims, as well as controlling xmb functions/programs.

I'm predicting body/voice recognition will come with the Ps4 AND a new motion controller(hopefully magnetic based not line-of-sight).

[Biggest]

Your future is here now! The PS Eye has those functions you're looking for with PS4.

[Ju]

Natal is an improved eye camera, no doubt about it.

But the gyro guarantees you can track motion behind your back. No single camera can ever do that, no matter how sophisticated it is. And if you say "gestures" (which is a guess), tell me how it can "guess" how many fingers it can count behind my back...

Sony can always release a "Move2" with a new camera. Done.

[Major Kanimo]

but it only follows your arm movements basicly natal can render everything it sees in 3d which MAY make it the better controller i guess we will all see at e3 this year

[gamfreak]

SONY = Smart
MicroSh!t = Stupid

[rezzah]

bubbles for the amazing picture. =D

His face really annoys me. That new look for him isnt so bad =p

[zekks2k9]

yo....i love how m$ does their thing....u never know what their doing...they just show u a little bit of something then go underground...and perfect it.....meanwhile the haters and skeptics talk and rant...then bam!!!!!!!!! emerged product for all to c...seems most people dont c that this is how they operate!!!!!!!!

[JonnyBigBoss]

PS Eye was out back on the PS2 platform. It's fun for casual/party/family stuff but it just doesn't work well on the big titles that gamers care about. That's why Natal will be bogus for gamers.

[theunleashed64]

@zekks2k9

yes because we all know they solved the RROD problem,the solved the and dealt with dvd 9 limetations, they also lowered xbox live gold membership price.....oh wait they didn't

[zekks2k9]

i dont hear abour any rrod cases anymore...so thats a thing of the past...they r hardwares and prone develop problems along the way...same as the ps3 with their own rrod caused from ps3 updates!!!!!!

[DelbertGrady]

Desperation sets in.

[theunleashed64]

@soda

who is desperate? the only i see here is you who's sounding desperate
but you are too blind to see that even 360 loyalist such as yourself.

[Cueil]

Natal doesn't use 3DV technology... amazing isn't that

[OSIRUSSS]

The NATAL is NOTHING like the PSEYE. My PSEYE is better tech than NATAL cause it doesn't lag.

[HurstDarkStar]

isnt the whole point of being minority report was to be hands free!!!
doesnt a remote defeats the point?
natal seems a little fresh since MS is trying to go all out with it,its a wait and see type of thing for natal for me.

[OSIRUSSS]

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

This looks hands free to me.
The PSeye did hands free 2 years ago.

Without Lag too.

[PirateThom]

Please watch Minority Report and observe the gloves he wears.

[Chaostar]

...

[bjornbear]

watch it...don't just...sit in front of the screen staring into oblivion BOY! xD

[chewmystink]

There are already games for PS3's eye that don't need a controller.
They are not that crash hot but hey it is what Natal is going to be gaming only using a camera.
I don't believe this hype train about Natal being some new magical camera, rendering in 3D etc
It's looking at you with one perspective, even if it uses IR and regular lens c'mon on man it's not some sci--fi movie scanning you into the game or some crap!

[Cueil]

Natal isn't based on 3DV technology... Microsoft bought 3DV in order to protect their technology... they own most of the copy rights for 3D cams because of this

[Absolut_Turkey]

Ignorance...a delusional fanboy speaking as if everything he asserted were actual fact, yet failing to provide citation from any credible source of news and/or data. Did you even read the article, or did you just dive right in and say the first thing to spring to your mind? Serious question here.

BTW, is that what you look like in RL Cueil? Here's some free advice: It's called "the Sun". Try standing underneath it sometime.

OT: We can now say that BOTH Nintendo and Sony passed on Natal's tech. Again, read the article.

[Meryl]

shut up cueli stop talking bs, you know nothing about technology, now stop talking out of your arse I am so fed up of you trolling both vgchartz and n4g with your so called false opinions

[bjornbear]

buying off tech to monopolize it....

sounds about the same to me

no coincidence MS rhymes with BS

[jkhan]

I think people are passing on judgments without seeing the stuff. I for one dislike the idea of motion gaming because i always prefer a standard controller or keyboard/mouse setup. But if microsoft can pull off what was shown in the early advertisement videos then yes it will be awesome for casual gaming, but I highly doubt Natal for one will be more than a gimick for core gaming. May be if you are playing halo you can throw grenades etc. but again I pretty sure there are alot of talented game designers that know what they are doing. Unfortunately the game designers on Wii have produced 90% of trash games and rest were onrail shooters. We need great innovative games from big bungie, epic, naughty dogs, kojima, sony santa monica studios, insomniac and rockstars.

In my opnion the only advantage Sony has over Microsoft is the amount of first party studios they have at there disposal & what they can do.

[II Necroplasm II]

@theunleashed64

calm down sir

[clintos59]

The funny thing about 360 fanboys they believe EVERYTHING MS SAYS even when MS hasnt showcased 1 amazing title with natal running it. Name me one game they have demonstrated with the game ACTUALLY BEING PLAYED that is so amazing to u guys? Thats right, u cant name 1 because u all are HOPING MS can come up with something that will blow u away. The only reason I believe Natal will FAIL is because the 2 most IMPORTANT things u need to really TAKE ADVANTAGE of these techs are "VERY TALENTED DEVS" which we all know sony & nintendo has with their FIRST PARTY STUDIOS + 2nd & 3rd party support. MS only has mostly 3rd party support which I dont think is enough to COMPETE with sony & nintendo. Not trying to sound fanboyish, just BEING REALISTIC.

[supakat]

im thinking Nintendo has a 3d type camera or sensor coming out and might be shown at E3....i bet they have been working on this tech since the crappy gamecube days thought it was fallowing the path of sega

[supakat]

@MLG Pro you are right mini disk didn't sell

@Brklynty1 your an idiot

@beardpapa thanks for learning these kids mini disk was a great old tech lol.

Wii FTW!

[Brklynty1]

Its seems we've stumbled yet upon another unfortunate Wii only owner!! XD son, don't kid yourself, old technology? Wii is still considered last gen, the disc size is about the same or less than DVD9, not even HD. The 90's are over, get with the program. Seems your scared that all your little "good" Wii games are headin to PS3. But don't worry, you can still have Mario and the lot of them.

[King81]

you guys quit b*tching that Natal is so great. I bet most of you won't even buy it

[Def Warrant]

Funny how all the former/present industry leaders turned down the Natal tech. They did it for a reason and they knew the tech isn't anything groundbreaking. It is just robust and like Sony said "and it enabled making the things we already did with EyeToy more robust, but it didn’t really enable as many new experiences as what we were hoping it would enable".

Now who's words should i believe? A two consecutive time industry leaders or a company that has been known for hyping and under delivering. I think i'll take Sony and Nintendo's words over M$.

[ironmonkey]

poor old ms lol picking up leftover tech. my pc webcam doesnt even lag as much as natal does and its even older too:)

[TheMART]

So instead of innovating and taking motion control next gen Sony decided to copy the Wiimote and nunchuck 1:1 but they found a way to make it more ugly with a very bright glowing lightbulb on top of a knightmare dildo design?

Damn Sony, sounds like you really made the right choice eh?

Maybe Nintendo and Sony could merge as they both have the same controllers, Nintendo would get its HD console, Sony would gain the only good Wii games for their motion controls (aka 1st party Nintendo games) instead of only crap that'll be ported...

[TheMART]

You have failure reading capabilities:

"In the end, concerns about latency and the costs involved lead to 3DV being dismissed as a solution."

Thats what Nintendo said. First, costs isn't a problem for MS, second, latency have been brought back and that was a decission of like what, 5 years ago? We've gone on in time and on in ways to get the latency to a minimum. Speaking about latency, have you seen how bad it was with the knightmare movedildo from hell? OMG teh latency!

Besides that I see you simply just don't deny the fact that Movedildo + sub is a direct clone from Wiimote + Nunchuck. Pathetic.

[Oner]

"You have failure reading capabilities"

And you don't? The fact is that SONY began this endeavor with Motion Control over 10 years ago. If you watched the Engadget Live show that is mentioned in the PSLS article (here just for you http://www.engadget.com/201... ) you would have LEARNED that Dr. Richard Marks was asked about how he feels about Nintendo and them copying what he STARTED on consoles last gen.

You will not admit that.

You will continue to avoid that.

You are not mature enough to learn that.

I've been through this with you time and time again, shut you down EVERY time and you NEVER change your BS. Seriously ~ STFU with your biased misinformation already.

[TheObserver]

I am still waiting to see a FPS or TPS with natal. Pew pew pew please.

[The Simple Truth]

Wow, M$ really are morons.
M$ just invested in an old used up hooker.

[The Simple Truth]

The 360 is already low spec compared to the awesome might of the PS3 - By losing another 15% it'll only be one step up from the Wii! HA HA HA!

Lagtal will probably cause another massive RROD outbreak later this year.

[Aceluffy]

Investigate all aspects before making an important decision, just like any educated person acts

Your post is waaaaayyy off topic, MOD please ban this fool forever

[Aceluffy]

I actually agree with you completely.
Without Natal, the RROD can be reduced recently by using new chip,
But what if it is burdened with an add-on that takes up 15% of its power plus it has to process the game and who knows what else, I bet it will overheat much faster than usual and in turn cause more RROD

[Dude Dutch]

They will never understand anything. That´s why they are called bots.

Simple and plain

[gamer7804]

Obviously a ps3 fanboy site, but disregarding that, it basically lets us know that Sony was not confident in its software ability to be able to overcome certain programming obstacles regarding using a 3D camera. Microsoft has a strong background in software and has the resources necessary to pull off the complicated programming needed for natal.

Microsoft is said to be showing off Natal at this years E3, with actual games.

[Ju]

I hope that "complicated" SW leads to a not so complicated SDK so studios can actually use it.

[Dance]

They wish

[Hotel_Moscow]

they should keep natal out of games and use it more as an interactive menu

because the type of games is going to be limited

[morkendo]

Natal could very well be destined to be a glorified EyeToy

THATS ALL IT IS...SONY BEAT YOU TO IT MS

[Denethor_II]

Is it wrong of me that I just want to give Bill Gates a hug a say "its gonna be alllllright". Then kiss him on his forehead and put him to bed?

[MexicanAppleThief]

LOL :p

[kraze07]

It's a good thing they passed on the tech. Too bad Microsoft didn't pass on it too. Screw Natal, PS Move, and anything even remotely similar.

[bunfighterii]

i have not one iota of interest in move or natal. i had a wii, sold it because the novelty tanked after it just turned out to be an uncomfortable, clunky way to control games, bought a PS3 and never looked back.

Personally gaming for me is a very static pass time, I don't want to stand up and point my arms around to shoot stuff, or move about to perform actions for more than 5 minutes- when i want physical activity I go outside and play basketball.

Neither of these techs have anything but gimmicky tack ons to offer the core gamer. A 'core gaming experience' in my opinion is something you can sit there and immerse yourself in for a few hours at a time, like a movie, and is more an immersion of the mind and imagination more than the body. I can only see it being a tiring affair to have core gamers standing around or flailing their arms about only to find out after 20-30 minutes your nowhere near as durable as the space marine or super soldier or other hero/villain your meant to be replicating and your only holding either nothing or a wand contraption. On natal remember the burnout demo where they held an imaginary steering wheel in front of them with imaginary pedals? well you try doing that now, for more than 10 minutes and notice how tiring it is.

These techs will breed nothing but casual experiences like the wii did- short bursts of fun that will loose their edge pretty quickly and appeal only to the casual crowd. Make no mistakes that that is the crowd that MS and Sony are trying to pull- they just want to gobble up Wii's market dominance of casual and young gamers, and are only producing some 'hardcore' games for the tech to save face for current core audience.

[xg-ei8ht]

Actually i've got a mini-disc and it records awesome optical wise.

Fking awesome bit of kit to this day,lol.

Of course newer stuff does more, but that will always happen, newer tech, = newer stuff.

[Arnon]

So let me get this straight. Microsoft announces Natal at E3'09, and then Sony follows up by announcing a remote, which is still trying to be determined as to why people would use it over a Dualshock, and suddenly Sony states...

"Pshh yeah... we were gonna do Natal but uhh... we just.. wanted.. to pass on it."

I haven't seen this much denial since Peter thought he wasn't fat..

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[saint_john_paul_ii]

your an idiot...

[Arnon]

I didn't expect you to get it, what with calling someone an idiot and having improper grammar.

[RAM MAGNUMS]

Go Catch Red Balls!

[Lou-Cipher]

Well, at least it's better than catching a case of Blue Balls. Ouch! :)

[Fadetoblack69]

Notice the XBox picture used in the article ... with the Red rings ;)

[X_GAMER_X]

I never saw or heard that minority report used a dildo to move object on screen so don't compare it to PS move. If anything close to Minority report is Natal and you al Know it

[saint_john_paul_ii]

the reason why the PS Move is being compared to Minority report is simple. look at the glove that Tom Cruise uses to move around the computer interface in minority report. What does it have?

It has lights on each fingertip of the glove. that is suppose to track your finger movements when moving around the interface.

Coming back to reality, the PS move controller does the same thing, your movements of the controller are being tracked by light. which is why you can do crazy stuff with it like taking a screen and bending it with two PS move controllers, like that Engadget video.

Natal is close to that concept of Minority report, except that it doesnt track your fingers, which means its not accurate enough to do stuff like that demo presented in that engadget PS move video. but its close. if Natal allowed you to use gloves for this, then its pretty damn possible for Natal to do all this craziness, in fact surpass everything.

when Natal gets released, i expect lots of crazy kids experiment with the thing on their PCs and see what happens if they can get those gloves or something as close as those Minority Report gloves to run with Natal.

[Hard_Gay]

I don't understand why there is so much hate for natal from ps3 fanboys... Its not like theyre going to eliminate the use of a controller for the games that need it. I think its a great new way to play and hardcore gamers should be welcoming the change of pace.

[Jerre138]

I for one don't care for motion control. I won't get Natal or Move, as I firmly believe all games made for them will be crap. And I'm sure Peter Molyneux will make bucketloads of empty promises at E3, as he always does.

[imagicclose]

but i think natal is not too bad

[GamerscoreWhores]

You could have at least got the first paragraph of your article to read correctly.

"many patents undoubtedly held my 3DV. Recently, Dr. Richard Marks explained why."

I think the word you were looking for was 'by'

It looks like you need to hire a proof reader.

[West_Coast_G]

It looks like you should actually read the article. If you did, you would notice that the typo was corrected....24 HOURS AGO.

[bjornbear]

natal tech has been around for years, and im sure all 3 companies considered it and had access to it (one of natal developers worked on wii)

so it was more a choice than a race

its fair, honestly i find move and wii more appealing than NOTHING

then again...none of the 3 appeal to me that much =P

[infekt]

Ownage?!

[Yomiro]

I knew they wore those red jumpsuits for a reason.

[hakis86]

"Since there is no control over light conditions, Microsoft may have to include those red jumpsuits after all. Joking aside, it’s worth noting that prior to being purchased by Microsoft, 3DV also reportedly approached Nintendo, hoping to be adopted into their family. In the end, concerns about latency and the costs involved lead to 3DV being dismissed as a solution."

I think a similar story has been up on N4G before, but I expect the 3DV tech to have improved since EyeToy PS2.
However, I am really rooting for SONY and PS3s solution this round.

[Solotov]

wasn't 3DV was bought by Microsoft last year?

[West_Coast_G]

3DV Systems was purchased early last year for a cool ~$35 million. Considering the kind of money to be made with their tech, pretty cheap if you ask me.

[squallsoft]

interesting...

[s45gr32]

What Microsoft could do is to enhance the game experience using Natal. Ok so as far as a game being run without a controller is not going to work. What could work is Natal being used to open doors climb ladders obstacles, pick up weapons and use voice recognition to say what you want to say and change the outcome of the game.

[Gamefan12]

but the point of natal was not to use controls...

in that case the PS MOVE you are able to the play the game and do what you stated, pick up objects you use the move and the z trigger. The z trigger is sensitive to how hard you press, so the on screen hand will squeeze only as tight as you pull the trigger

[dagreylion]

So why are we all in an uproar over Natal, it's just an upgrade to the eyetoy

[DFresh]

Who gives a f*** about this motion controller B.S.
If I want motion controls I'll just buy a Wii.
I'll stick to my controller pad or my keyboard/mouse thank you very much.

[Lou-Cipher]

That's how I feel also.

Microsoft and Sony are turning their backs on the 30+ Million people that own the 360 & PS3.

The only thing that is going to happen is that Hardcore Game Developers are going to start making casual/party games instead of the games that made them successful in the first place. Motion controls are not good for the hardcore gamer.

Leave the PS3 & 360 alone, let the Wii be for the kids & Casuals.

The biggest Oxymoron's This Generation:

A Hardcore Motion Game
Console Exclusive (that one always cracks me up)
Great DLC

[Subzero200x]

Um because they already stole Nintendo, so there is no need for another.

"Here we go again point #1: PSeye or Eye toy are not #D camera's because they can not sense depth (back and forth motion."

you speak as if you made the thing.

[West_Coast_G]

edit: wrong reply.

[danielle007]

They passed on Natal, which is actually kind of innovative, and decided to go with an exact copy of the WiiMote with a Wii Motion Plus attached... Oh, and a light. Soo much better.

Plus, if the 360 can improve on the 3DTV technology with it's processing power to make it a viable gaming device.. Then just imagine what the PS3 could have done, because my love of the 360 aside, the PS3 is much more powerful. I think they really might have missed out..

I'd rather use neither and just stick with my controller, honestly. If I want exercise, I'll go to the gym. With my experience with the Wii, I don't find it more immersive, I just find it more annoying.

[butterfinger]

to take your opinion seriously when it's clear that you have been awed by Natal, just as MS hoped. When you were busy calling Move an exact copy of the Wiimote, those of us that have been gaming for more than one generation noticed that Natal is an exact copy of the EyeToy (look both up on YouTube if you don't believe me). Sony should definitely be worried that MS is tricking many people like yourself with their "new" technology, that is "only possible on the XBOX360". Lol. What a joke!