510°

Storytelling in MGS; Why Kojima Just Got Carried Away

Gamer Limit writes "The Metal Gear Solid series, an epic of almost perfect game design stretched over 4 absolutely fantastic games on 3 systems, is undoubtably (and rightly) one of the most heralded chronicles in gaming history.

From graphics to sound, tactics to weapons, characters to level design and pacing – it's unlikely that many other titles come close to demonstrating the power of the Playstation."
Fullish - contributor
Published: 80 days 4 hours ago | Article | PlayStation 2
 
 

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StartWars - 80 days 4 hours ago
1 -
I suspect if there was some quality control at Konami the storyline would be cut down considerably.
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Saaking - 80 days 4 hours ago
1.1 -
Quality Control? MGS is one of the finest series ever, and MGS4 is technically flawless. No bugs whatsoever. If anyone needs quality control it surely isn't Kojima. We don't understand the Zelda Timeline yet it's one of the greatest series around. Same thing with MGS.
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Winter47th - 80 days 4 hours ago
1.2 -
He can get carried away all he wants, that's why I support him every chance I get, for the people complaining "tis like ah movee not veedyo game!1" got a lot of other sub par alternatives they can buy instead, no need to criticize a man that's spent 3 decades in the videogames business, if anybody knows what he's doing, it's Kojima. And he's doing it right.
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deadreckoning666 - 80 days 3 hours ago
1.3 -
He got extremely carried away with MGS4 IMO, it woulda been better if he cut it down a little. I found it funny that it still went on even after the credits lol. Technically the game was flawless, but I found myself skipping alotta cutscenes during Big Mama's introduction.
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jjohan35 - 80 days 3 hours ago
1.4 -
MGS4 was what made the entire franchise epic. It told the story of an entire universe, not just one episode. It outshined MGS 1, 2, and 3 combined (no easy task). What I also like about Hideo's style is that he's willing to be at the bleeding edge of technology to create that fantastic universe. So many loose ends were tied together in MGS4. If the plot was any simpler, it would have been boring and predictable.
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badz149 - 80 days 3 hours ago
1.5 - @start
what quality control are you talking about? in term of quality, not even a handful of games come close to what he has done with MGS4! it's quality at its finest! I agree that the MGS universe is somewhat very complicated but who really does that for a video game?? that's why I respect him and love what he has done with MGS! MGS4 is still among the top picks for the best game this gen IMO!
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gamejediben - 80 days 3 hours ago
1.6 -
This reminds me a lot of how J.R.R. Tolkein got tons of complaints about how his Lord of the Rings novels were too long and had "WAY TOO MUCH BACKSTORY!!!" LOL

People were like "We just wanted a sequel to the Hobbit and now you just royally screwed up your series with too much boring narrative" But as it would turn out, Lord of the Rings got made into the most successful film trilogy of all time and we are STILL waiting to see the Hobbit adapted into a film. And Tolkein is now considered the greatest literary mind of the 20th century with more prints of TLotR in circulation than any book ever made except the Bible.

My point: Geniuses think alike. Whiners need to STFU because in a few years you are going to eat your words... with interest.
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meepmoopmeep - 80 days 3 hours ago
1.7 -
there's great medication for sufferer's of A.D.D

unless you're into Scientology
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shadow2797 - 80 days ago
1.8 -
I wish more developers would get carried away. The story is part of the entertainment. Is it complicated? Yes, but it's completely unpredictable. And regardless of medium, you can't say that about many stories. I'd rather have a story I'm actually interested in instead of whatever the hell Gears of War was about.

The MGS games are some of the most memorable for me BECAUSE of the convoluted story. I can't even count the number of times my mind's been blown because of all the twists and turns.

Btw, it seems the author completely forgot about Ocelot's conversation with the President at the end of MGS1. Kojima didn't think he'd get a sequel? BS. Metal Gear. Metal Gear 2. By the time Kojima got to MGS1, he knew he could continue the series if he wished. I understand his point, but if you step back and look at it, the story makes sense. It's not like it's full of contradictions. It's just complicated. This entire article almost seems like it's been edited from being an article on George Lucas and Star Wars. "Storytelling in Star Wars. Why Lucas Got Carried Away".
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Headshot81 - 79 days 23 hours ago
1.9 - I still dont think the story is "that" complicated
Sh!t, my roomate played through MGS4, and he understood what was going on and a little of the history from the story(he hasn't even played the past MG's!). The game achieved perfection. Kojima was able to give core information to the gamers who haven't touch a mgs game, yet he also added alot of details for the die hard fans to analyze. I still dont see how "cutscenes interupted the flow of the game", considering that they were amazing and always had me at the edge of my seat. You dont pick up a MG game thinking that it should have quick 10sec cut scenes, the franchise is known for its gameplay and its ability to tell a cinematic story. MGS4 is the final chapter for christ sakes! it needs to be as long as it has to to end the story right!
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randomwiz - 79 days 16 hours ago
1.10 -
there's nothing wrong with the story.

If you play through the game for the first time without any interruptions every day, you want to watch the cutscenes.

If you want to replay, or play only a small portion of the game, the cutscenes are annoying.
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Kornholic - 79 days 13 hours ago
1.11 -
MGS's are cultural shocks for dumb, fat americans because they're used to games and movies with simpler storylines: kill everyone that moves.

Halo 3...
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cmrbe - 79 days 8 hours ago
1.12 - There shouldn't be any QA
for genius like Kojima. We shouldn't limit them.
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mrnintendo96 - 79 days 7 hours ago
1.13 -
Well, a Democratic of Congo reference makes this a good article /sarcasm.

For some reason I understand the complexity of the story. It's why I never skip the cutscenes. It works for me. But I agree that some stuff seems un-needed (like the FoxDie mutation).
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thedoctor - 80 days 4 hours ago
2 -
You have to consider this from the point of view that Hideo Kojima is considered a "god" by a fair amount of gamers. Since MGS's massive appeal in both gameplay and storytelling, you'd have to be a fool to want to mediate Kojima's writing.

However, by the fourth instalment, if it is still as "odd" as many people claim - I've only played the first two titles - then there definitely needs to be some quality control, if only for the fact that Konami could be losing sales.
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Saaking - 80 days 4 hours ago
2.1 -
Kojima IS god :)
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syvergy - 80 days 4 hours ago
3 -
I agree, I think Kojima was basically given a completely loose rope and as a result his later games weren't as tight, story wise.
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jjohan35 - 80 days 3 hours ago
3.1 -
Would you rather have a generic 3rd person shooter that ends in less than 8 hours? Give me a break. Hideo is pushing the limits of gaming, blurring the boundaries between a video game and a cinematic experience. He doesn't get enough credit.
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GrahameG - 80 days 4 hours ago
4 -
It's different horses for different courses.

Kojima provides self referential, overly in depth games with dialogue that does nothing to further the main story arc. Much like many film directors do.

However it works, the MGS series has carved itself a niche in games that many others would kill to have.

Want subtlety and vagueness of story, go play ICO or Shadow of the Colossus. It's the variety of the gaming landscape that makes it so enjoyable. If everything followed the same template then creativity would be dead.

Remember when psycho mantis got you to put your pad on the floor for the first time? Was that really necessary to get the point across he was telekinetic? No it wasn't, but it f*cking rocked all the same.

"Creativity is allowing yourself to make mistakes. Art is knowing which ones to keep." - Scott Adams
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JQ - 80 days 4 hours ago
5 -
/agree
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theEnemy - 79 days 15 hours ago
5.1 - This
agree.
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cranium - 80 days 4 hours ago
6 -
Where have I seen that picture of Kojima before?

Ah yes: http://www.youtube.com/watc...

This guy's my hero.
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Unicron - 80 days 4 hours ago
7 -
MGS is utterly convoluted and self indulgent. And yet, I love EVERY SINGLE MOMENT. Are the games perfect? Of course not. Are they amazing? Definitely, and my favorite series. I don't think I would allow any other series to get away with what MGS does.
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Enigma_2099 - 80 days 4 hours ago
8 - You don't stifle creativity...
.. you let it thrive.
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Rocket Sauce - 80 days 3 hours ago
8.1 -
Or you just steal from John Carpenter
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Enigma_2099 - 78 days 4 hours ago
8.2 - Kojima STOLE the entire plot from Escape from New York?
Funny... I thought Snake Plisskin was just the inspiration for Solid Snake's appearance... I didn't know he plagarized the whole frickin' movie!!! [/sarcasm]
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HDgamer - 80 days 3 hours ago
9 -
It's call creativity, if he didn't do this well this series would be generic like everything else. And I noticed some fanboy phantom disagrees.
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chrisjc - 80 days 3 hours ago
10 -
Haha I love Kojima with all my heart. I hold him on the same pedestal as Quentin Taraninto in terms of visionaries.
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jFND90 - 80 days 3 hours ago
11 -
Completely disagree with the article. All the ridiculous set pieces Kojima puts in his games is what makes Metal Gear, Metal Gear. Without the crazy characters, convoluted dialogue and layered backstory it just wouldn't be MGS.
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foxtheory - 80 days 3 hours ago
12 - Kojima got carried away...
but it turned out pretty damn good. The entire MGS story is just so amazing, and in the end, everything comes together perfectly. No detail is left behind, despite the crazy complexity. That's why it's my favorite series, because the plot twists and complexity keep me captivated. And it's not only the story. All MGS games have pushed its console to the max graphically, and the gameplay is some of the best out there. Like I said, Kojima got carried away, but he knew what he was doing.
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Redempteur - 80 days 2 hours ago
12.1 - i agree completly
the scope of MGS is huge ..but after finishing the epilogue of MGS4 ... i had no further questions ....every damn character did what he could .. and in the end ...those seeking answers were rewarded ...

Some people are treating 4 like a simple movie when in order to master the game you have SO MUCH to do . I know that mgs 4 is not without flaws .. but kojima did great and didNOT go to far ... is a monkey drinking that much a problem ?I guess that a vampire walking on water ( vamp in mgs2 ) is normal then .. I guess psycho mantis in the MGS1 was just a normal character too ....
Drebin had a purpose in the story .. and the way to told the backstory of those i defeated was great , just right , not over the top .. I mean like sniper wolf in mgs 1 , it's not like they are bad people just because they were ennemies ...
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mirroredderorrim - 80 days 3 hours ago
13 -
This is what got me started on the Kojima tip.


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Whitefox789 - 80 days 2 hours ago
13.1 -
Shame it wasn't the MSX version the real definitive version of Metal Gear, heck in Metal Gear for the NES there's no Metal Gear you just blow up a giant super computer.....
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Rhythmattic - 79 days 14 hours ago
13.2 -
Is that a young Robert Redford ?

:-)
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Whitefox789 - 79 days 7 hours ago
13.3 - @13.2
Idk what your talking about but that is definitely Kyle Reese from the Terminator


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Rhythmattic - 77 days 13 hours ago
13.4 -
First thing I thought.

http://www.speakersla.com/2...

There a resemblance......

But you are absolutely right.. F - Me...

Its absolutely / definitely Kyle Reese from the Terminator

Beer is Good.
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SilverDragon1979 - 80 days 3 hours ago
14 -
I love Kojima's style of story telling myself, though he can get a little carried away at times.
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amenomusicista - 80 days 3 hours ago
15 -
I think the heavy amount of detail in MGS is one of the huge things that defines the series as a whole. The high level of care Kojima puts into the storyline is what makes MGS so unique from other games.
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Dead_Cell - 80 days 3 hours ago
16 - I see him as the Tarintino of gaming.
Enjoys his well told dialogue.
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Ravage27 - 80 days 3 hours ago
17 - That what's make MGS4 unique
and that's exactly what i look for in a game
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Redempteur - 80 days 3 hours ago
18 - this part of the article is stupid
"I have a friend who has finished every single MGS title, including the addon editions, multiple times over and he still can’t explain the story to me."

Sorry guy BUT your friend is stupid . it's just an ample contradiction ..

He said himself that kojima is even tellling part of the story snake himself has experienced ( as in order to make things happenning in place for events to happen ..yet you have a friend stupid enough to be able ( achievement ) to NOT understand that ?

i call bullshit ... on this one

EDIT : and again
"Also, asking too many questions, especially unnecessary ones, or explaining entire world orders, makes you forget why you started playing in the first place"

BUt man i played this game for two reasons
- To have fun ( i did have it thanks to the fun boss battles and the amount of humor and eye candy there was in the game )
- To have the answers to the questions i had after finishing all the others Mgs games ..

And guess what ?i'm 99.9% fully satisfied ( the remaining 0.01% is for the lack of trophy support but that's another debate)
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Whitefox789 - 80 days 2 hours ago
18.1 -
same here :D

Even I myself can explain the whole entire story of Metal Gear Solid, my friend didn't get it I explained it to him in about 15 mins and his mind was just instantly blown and he stated "Why haven't I heard of these games? They should get more attention." (Note: this was before MGS 4 came out and where only true gamers have heard of these games)
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debuchan - 79 days 6 hours ago
18.2 - Truth it's not his friend
It's Him that did not understand MGS
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Whitefox789 - 80 days 2 hours ago
19 - Storytelling in MGS; Why Kojima Just Got Carried Away
"Why Kojima Just Got Carried Away"

hmm a question with no response from the person.....

Either way it was just a blog with a blow hearts opinion
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LeTHaL-InJeKTiON - 80 days 2 hours ago
20 - *sigh*
i'm seriously getting annoyed with all this MGS talk i'm a gigantic fan of MGS and when i read all these posts and topics on how people talk badly about MGS for first off IMHO any "real" MGS fan would tell you MGS4 was not needed at all. all the other games literally explain any answer you want all you had to do was think about it and revert right back to old games here i'll give you an example i already knew who was the leader of the patriots was because campbell said he has the same code name as null and null meaning nothing,void,empty it gave me a clue to think hey null means zero hence major zero second the controls thats what cracks me up he literally changed his perfect control scheme to please everyone for next gen and still people complained the old control and flawless it didn't feel like a chore using CQC and this new scheme doesn't ether but why change something that was perfect? because the fans wanted it which is why he released mgs4 he really didn't need to make it every question was answered in previous games and for those who say its a movie well you all and when i mean by you all i mean all the so called "fans" you wanted every question answered well he delivered he gave you all the answers you wanted but yet again people still complained so now i'm probably gonna get flamed and called a fanboy but meh who cares LMAO i just wanted to try and explain why mgs4 gets bashed on so much
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Unicron - 80 days 2 hours ago
20.1 -
Periods, in this case, are your friend. And there are plenty of questions that MGS4 tied up -

The fate of Olga's child?
Who are the Patriots?
How did Liquid come to control Ocelot?
What is Snake's ultimate fate?

MGS3 gave some great backstory, but was by no means a tie up for the series.
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LeTHaL-InJeKTiON - 80 days 2 hours ago
21 -
lol idc about periods because its pointless on a forum and the fate of sunny was that she's free now she basically destroyed the patriots she wrote the foxalive program who are the patriots the game tells you who they are sigint,para-medic,big-boss,zer o,eva,adamska aka ocelot and you got the question reversed how did ocelot control liquid well ocelot was the son of the sorrow and sorrow was a medium he has telepathic abilities and snakes fate well it doesn't say but he left it up to your imagination which i think he dies because he's got the foxdie virus and plus he's aging rapidly those two account for you getting dead rather quickly lmao
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limulder - 80 days ago
22 - It's convoluted, but MGS succeeds in storytelling because...
Limulder
I’d agree that the complex web of characters, double crosses, triple crosses, Cold war mythos can be a bit much.

But, maybe it’s just me, but I truly don’t care when I don’t grasp every single minutiae of Kojima’s tangled web: because what he does right, and what I come away from the game with is the characters.

I can hardly remember how Zero fit into the LaLeLuLeLo or whether or not Revolver Ocelot was on big boss’s side or not. What I do remember is a fragile, forgotten Snake trekking through the hollow, decrepit remains of Shadow Moses, a place that evokes the images of a young virile Snake we met 10 years ago. I remember how Meryl pointed at her former lover and with such stinging disdain in her voice, she says, “Stay out of my way, Old Snake.” Or how the once mighty Snake gazes at his withered, dying frame in the mirror.

MGS can be a convoluted mess. I would not disagree. But when it comes to what matters to me, few, if any games, have strove for and succeeded at portraying such mature emotions and complicated characters. It’s for that reason, that Kojima is the best storyteller in videogames today.
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Ninjamonkey - 79 days 20 hours ago
23 -
Yes the story is a little over thought out but then thats part of what I love about the game.

Its not just a main story, you get all these little extra bits, which give you more info than you need yes, but if you can remember it all it gives you a greater understanding oof it all.

Plus why was that guy dissing the monkey??? Yes it was the oddest thing every but lets be honest it was pretty funny =P
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clintagious650 - 79 days 18 hours ago
24 - Here ill keep it simple for everyone..
MGS4 is praised because it delivers in all areas which MOST GAMES this next gen lacks. The problem this gen with most games (not all) is because online gaming is growing on consoles, alot of developers are not putting enough effort to the single player expirience but or more focused on the online portion of the game. Good example are games like halo 3, gears of war 2, call of duty 4 etc etc. These games are great fun to enjoy online but the lack what games like MGS4, FF7, SOTC, Ico, Zelda Ocarina of Time, & many others I didnt mention had to offer. I just wished that more devs would put more effort into their games.

Kojima doesnt get enough credit for his work & I seriously am sad to see MGS4 only sell 5 million copies because I can honestly say this game brings more to the table then any game to come out this gen. I really thought this game would sell 10 million but hey I aint gonna complain, "Its Your Loss". 10 years from now this game will still be rembered as "One of The Greatest Games of All Time".
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