Valve: modern shooters "pander" to players rather than helping you improve

OXM UK: "Attention, fans of recent first-person shooters: you're a bunch of mewling, commitment-averse brats who can't so much as get up in the morning without QTE prompts, a medical pack cache and an online FAQ. But don't worry, Valve intends to knock you into shape."

[iamnsuperman]

"We don't say, 'Well we need iron sights because everyone else has iron sights.' If they could figure out a way for them to make sense, we'd add them, but right now we think iron sights just make people move slower because they'll be afraid to put their gun down".
I think this thinking is a little backward. The whole idea for iron sites it to represent aimed and unaimed shots. So basically counter strike is going to be people running around with amazing aimed shots. Yes it makes people slower to aim but thats the point. In certain circumstances aiming is needed others it isn't not everyone runs around with the sights up otherwise they die. Iron sites was an evolution not a fad

[dirigiblebill]

Agreed, though I think there's still room for games that don't support iron sights. CoughHalocough.

[kwyjibo]

No. You haven't played CS, or not enough of it anyway.

Iron sights are useless. CS awards aim - simple as that. You don't need an iron sights button in order to aim, you need skill.

Your shots are most accurate when still and in controlled bursts. So what's the point in iron sights again?

[iamnsuperman]

So if I shot a rifle in short controls bust from the sholdier but not looking down the sight I maybe more accurate than blatting away but it isn't accurate at all. Looking down the sights is accuracy

Surely there is skill in being able to use sights without being killed and who runs around constantly looking down the sights. I am sorry but what Valve has said is stupid. They are trying to justify using an old gameplay mechanic that has changed since CS came out. For a game to claim to be a "tactical FPS" to not include sights is dumb. If they wanted to make it hard all you have to do is make the rifle sway more when running/kneeling/standing like it is in real life. Surely that is skill.

[kwyjibo]

No, as before, your complete lack of understanding of how CS works wrecks your opinion.

You cannot run and gun effectively. Your gun is less accurate when you are running or jumping.

Yet again, you've failed to justify the need for an iron sights toggle.

"Looking down the sights is accuracy" - no, getting your crosshairs over the enemy half a mile away with your AK is accuracy. At no point do you have to press the "help me aim" button. If you can do that quicker than your enemy, you win. Isn't that novel?

[DtotheRoc]

YES! kwyjibo knows what valve is talking about cuz he's a real player not some cod fanboy. not that i didn't love me some search and destroy on cod 4--not as good as counter-strike BUT very similar. although i understand what superman is complaining about. clearly he's going to trying to play this game without mouse and keyboard and that will make accuracy impossible espcially cuz it will have zero aim-assit. that's what he needs iron sights cuz that's what console kids need unless it's halo BUT halo isn't about aim aside from using a sniper rifle it's put a shit ton of rounds into someone and take off their shield first. in counterstrike it's like playing a game on hardcore mode ALL THE TIME lol.

[NarooN]

You've never played CS then, because it's not people running around hip-firing. You have to actually AIM by managing the recoil and spread of the bullets in real-time, not by holding a button that magically eliminates all recoil and makes the gun an insta-gib railcannon.

And hell, both the CT and T's in CS aim down the sights with all guns in the third-person view models, except for the T's who only hip-fire with the AK.

[Impaler]

While realistically using sights is ideal to make the most accurate shots when you are going against the enemy, in the game world this isn't the case.

1). Gamers' use ADS a lot and camp corners while using ADS, or slowly move around the corners while using ADS.

2). Counter Strike has recoil and bullet spread, different per gun, that you have to balance when firing.

3) Use an AK in COD or BF(although I love BF) and then use an AK in CS. The way you kill the enemy in each game is slightly different, except in CS it is DRASTICALLY different. Very rarely does a panic spray and pray actually work in CS(an usually the enemy has to be right up on your ass for it to work)

When you play CS:GO, you will understand.

[maxmill]

im tired of games being COD, when i want to play COD ILL PLAY COD

[wallis]

I think the removal of death in games has pretty much pissed all over player development. In borderlands there's no drive to improve beyond stats (FYI borderlands is my favourite game). You slam into a combat situation and if you die you just take some cash out of your pocket and go right back in. Bioshock was the exact same. This whole respawn instead of dying takes away the indignity of death. Death used to mean LOSING, now it means waiting a minute and losing a hundred bucks.

Same with dead island. I never felt the urge to pick myself and rethink a difficult situation. I just kept bashing my head against the wall until I made a way through. The removal of quicksave/quickload has also damaged player progression. Quicksave was a feature players could use to improve themselves by replaying minor moments in a game over and over, but now we rely on the developers to hold our hands on what we can and can't replay. Yes it could be abused, and mostly was, but it was part of this whole crazy and insane idea that a player had the intelligence and responsibility to play it as they chose. It could be used to inch progress slowly but it was still constant re-iteration of those few precious moments you just weren't good enough at. By the tenth time you'd gone through that one minute stretch of combat and finally succeeded it wasn't your stats that improved, or your character, or the game that changed, it was you. You improved your skill in the game.

Checkpoints dilute that. Checkpoints are a smack on the wrist and make you replay large parts of the level allowing you to prepare for difficult moments by stocking up on health kits. They've not made games harder, they've made them easier. Before if you locked yourself into a tough situation with 3% health you either shot your way through or replayed the level.

Maybe it's just a matter of taste but it still stands that a) developers should give us the choice, and b)respawning is incredibly stupid, please bring back some form of death besides a childish slap on the wrist.

[Impaler]

This is one reason why I enjoy RAGE. On Nightmare, when I die I always say the word "fuck" because I have to reload my last save and I sometimes don't remember exactly when I saved lol.

And also that is why I loved Ninja Gaiden, if you don't press pause and hit save and die, guess what, you are boned.

[noxeven]

What they need in gameover screen to come back and just for hardcore of hardcore when you die the game deletes your save file. So you truly have to start over. I mean bloody screen so real

[04soldier]

Demons Souls had that... Dark Souls also has it.

"YOU HAVE DIED" in bold caps across the screen surely lets the player know they messed up and need to rethink their next go around..

[MilkMan]

Dude, call me when you decide to make a game rather than buy other designers ideas (counter strike/team fortress) or make retarded puzzle games.

By the way where is your next Half Life? that on rails shooter with such heavy scripted events and AI behavior that I used to count my footsteps to the next trigger and shoot at particular spots knowing the enemy would pop up at the same place at the same time, EVERY TIME. It's pathetic man.

Give it a rest.

Oh and Left 4 Dead doesn't qualify as a game, there aint nothing to do. Part 2 was worse. That should have been a patch, instead you sold it; at $65 bucks. WTF!!

[sonicblastoise]

It's slightly disingenuous for the title to read "VALVE SEZ DIS" when in reality it's the dev of GO that's saying this, who is actually not representative of Valve as a whole, because, as we all know, Valve panders to players too. Also, I agree that iron sights is in no way pandering. It's just a different way of playing a shooting game.

To be fair though, not enough arena type, skill-based, fast-paced team shooters are out there. (Note i'm saying NOT ENOUGH. Not that there are no good ones. Choice is nice.) I hope that the team that Valve has on this title is good enough to pull it off.