Industry outrage at 'brutal' Team Bondi crunch

Brian Robbins, chair of the IGDA Board of Directors, said the association would fully investigate the issue.

“[But] certainly reports of 12-hour a day, lengthy crunch time, if true, are absolutely unacceptable and harmful to the individuals involved, the final product, and the industry as a whole,” Robbins told Develop.

[sukas]

sounds like a bad place to work, thats a bad managements fault.

[I_find_it_funny]

even worse as the game didnt turn out all that great

[MintBerryCrunch]

R* is known for being all about business, that's what the setting is like, i know its Team Bondi, but im sure that R* kept pressuring Bondi to complete the game...you are there to make games and then make a profit...there really is no in between

at least thats what i have heard

[NukaCola]

I remember the divorces and 'letters from wives' during the development of Red Dead Redemption. It seems sometimes R* puts the game before the welbeing of the employees.

[Ocelot525]

A good game requires motivated developers. Those retarded managers there don't understand that game development is about creativity, making it totally different from for example jobs where people have to make for spreadsheets

[dabri5]

This isn't too uncommon. My wife currently works 12 hour days mon-fri 8 hours sat-sun every week for the past few months at Epic. We have friends at RedStorm and other game studios that have similar crunch periods.
The issue has been addressed with the whole EA debacle but when employees across the US started to try to form a Union afterword, studios started firing employees and hiring contract workers instead. This put a stop to that very quickly.

Please note the Team Bondi story definitely has it's differences. I doubt my wife would put up with people yelling at her. The only connection I'm making is with the hours. Other than that, Epic treats their workers like royalty. Free food all the time. Fun events, games, swag are always being given and held for their employees. Makes the long hours way easier to tolerate.

[GrandTheftZamboni]

Insomniac Games seems to be much nicer place to work. I remember reading they had 8 weeks vacation.

[BattleAxe]

When you have millions of dollars on the line, 12 hour days during "crunch time" shouldn't be unexpected. There are lots of industries where 12 hour days are the norm. The thing here is, the workers should have been told about the possible expectations before taking on the job. If they were never told this and they were threatened with their jobs if they didn't work the long hours, then that is a completely different story.

[Rainstorm81]

I agree i work 12 hour shift all the time.....unfortunatly

[gamingisnotacrime]

just because it happens does not mena is acceptable

Human value>money

[Ulf]

12 hours/day, 6 days/week, for a year straight is more accurate.

Lots of people work 12 hours/day. Not many work 72 hours/week for a full year on end. 60 hour crunch weeks, for about 6 months on end, are the accepted limit in the games industry, really.

Developers aren't paid all that much, and there is no overtime pay. They aren't MDs, and they are salaried for 40 hour weeks.

[Jdoki]

In other reports I have read some employees of Bondi were working 80 - 110 hour weeks for weeks at a time.

Also, treating creative people and programmers as disposable resources is not acceptable.

It's not the way to run a business or a project.

Inevitably many jobs require a crunch before a deadline, but a well managed project should be able to keep this to a minimum and acceptable level.

Although LA Noire was pretty good - I don't think it shows McNamara as some sort of gaming auteur - yet that is what he's acting like. As if he was the single most important cog in the wheel, and everyone else was a minion to do his personal bidding.

[Inside_out]

.
If you ask me they should fire that whole team. You take 7 years to make a game that is 90% cut scenes and now your complaining??? While they were fooling around with mo-cap nonsense, Gears of war released 2 games and now are releasing a third game as did Uncharted, Halo, Resistance and a bunch of other devs.

I doubt they worked 100 hrs a week for seven years. Maybe someone finally said this is the deadline and the game has to launch at this time. So there was a crunch period in order to get the game done. Were these guys paid??? Were they told if you don't work 100 hours in a week your fired??? Honestly, what a bunch of nonsense. Were they tied to desks...lol...just leave if it was so bad.

This game has underperformed...IMO...I think it's sold to many as the game is the same thing over and over. Who cares about mo-cap and cut scenes. It seems that the rats are running for the exits now that the game has come under scrutiny. " It wasn't our fault, it's the big bad owners who rushed us and forced us to work hard after 7 years to finish the project...what Baloney.

[sdtarm]

are you dumb? exactly cuz its a lot of cutscenes it takes a lot of time, im not supporting this guy but these guys went through some struggles before being able to get their act together,

dont discredit them

[Jio]

You know nothing about now the industry works. I don't know much either, but you are just ignorant.

[Jack-Dangerously]

stfu.

[RavageX]

You talk like that and then go on to compare the game to shooters and a platformer??? Get outta here with that.

[SageHonor]

Truth is, This happens all the time with triple AAA games...

[Oldsnake007]

no it does not, stop talking out your ass

[Ravens20]

Nobody knows for sure what happens behind the scenes when developing a game. Chances are, if there is a deadline closing in, the developers are going to have to put a ton of hours and effort into finishing the game by the deadline.

Otherwise you end up with an unfinished game.

100+ hour work weeks is just ridiculous and unheard of though.

[SageHonor]

Actually crunch time is common within the industry.. Especially with big mainstream titles...

EDIT: Unpaid overtime, Lots of cash being thrown around all to meet consumer demand and satisfy sharholders and other people in higher management. I know a few people in the industry

[Pandamobile]

Crunch time happens with every game, but not like this. Not 100 hour work weeks.

[BlackTar187]

my uncle used to work for EA and he said the crunch time is very real i remember him telling me how the wives got together at EA to complain and it ended up making barely any change. He told me this 5-6yrs ago so i hope i got most of my facts what little i gave correct ;)

[gamingisnotacrime]

what a load o crap

Uncharted 2, they were happy

GoW series, stressed but pleased

MGS4 same as above

etc etc

[soundslike]

They were happy because they cared about it and had INPUT to the process rather than just being a cog.

I could spend 12 hours working on music productions and not notice the time, but if it was to score a Lifetime movie with strict guidelines I'd shoot myself. It sounds like regardless of the work ethics, not many people felt involved with the project, and ironically they probably needed more man-power hours because of it.

[Deadman_Senji]

It's funny that you said "triple AAA" games...AAA would have sufficed.

[PS360PCROCKS]

lol good catch

[Ravens20]

The game wasn't even good honestly.

[theIMP]

I thought it was great.

[Jack-Dangerously]

rrrrraaaAAAAAAARRRrr!! Jack SMASH!

[Raider69]

Im already waiting for Rockstar pronounce on the subject.

[Raider69]

Another game that was hyped to kingdom come and was just average,repetitive and boring.

[BitbyDeath]

That's nothing, i remember seeing pictures of Polyphony Digitals office during crunch time and they had sleeping bags stored under their desks.

[coolasj]

IIRC Naughty Dog does all nighters. But that's because they want to.

[Apollyn]

That's because they do each others hair and make up. Watch rom coms and eat chocolate all night. And of course talk about boys.

[coolasj]

Woah. Sounds like family right there. I'd love that environment :D

[nilamo]

what is up with the la noire hate, at least it tried to be different.

[Morgue]

A friend of mine works at Treyarch and during the last few months of Black Op's he said they were working crazy hours.

[cochise313]

Why did the game still come out full of gliches and bugs?

[dragon82]

Because shit happens??

[mac_sparrow]

because there isn't enough time in the world to fix that broken crap ;)

[nycrekid]

Because they just aren't very good.

[Morgue]

We give him sh!t all the time for it.

[Ulf]

RockStar San Diego had the same issues with RDR, as I recall. The wives of the people who worked there actually filed a lawsuit.

A recurring RockStar theme?

[Thoreau]

every day, americans are out working 16 hour days...nothing new under the sun.

[Mithan]

The man is a bad manager. In the gin interview he basically excuses his poor performance by saying things like " we all work hard in this industry" and other crap.

No, it doesn't need to be like that. If all your past projects were like that, maybe the issue is that you suck at managing. The fact that you make decent games will bit you on the ass eventually because nobody will risk you or want to work on you after.

[PS360PCROCKS]

While i feel bad for these workers, we all do this. My work tells me "work to the needs of the business" they force us to work 8-9-10-11 hour days as PART TIME workers and we get no benefits, vacation and so on. It's total bullshit, but I need the job til I am done with school.

I wake up at 5AM everyday and drive 40 minutes to school, stay at school til 1:30, drive 40 minutes home and than hang out for an hour and drive another 30 to work and start work at 4 til at least 11 than drive another 30 minutes home to go straight to sleep and do it all over again. Monday-Friday. Life sucks sometimes but it is what it is

[Hufandpuf]

I tend to agree with you a lot, I don't know why but I'm guessing its because you have "A Perfect Ass" as your avatar.

[sprinterboy]

Nothing new really, I have watched the credits go up at the end of a lot of games thanking there familys for there support while they have been away for hrs and days lol, first time I saw this was with Doom 3. Its not acceptable I guess but these guys and gals do sign a contract knowing full well what there signing and its not like most of them earn peanuts, its well paid.

[Crazay]

This is no surprise and I'm suspect as to wether or not this is a standard Team Bondi. From what I've heard its a Rockstar thing. A buddy of mine who was working on Bully was sometimes sleeping at the office to get deadlines complete in time for the crunch they were given.
100hr work weeks were no stranger to him during the development of that game.

[XI_-Minty-_IX]

Well, at least Brendan McNamara was kind enough to let the game's writers go home early...

[TwistedMetal]

it wasnt that bad if none of them went on strike or walked out. Also you are dumb if you signed a contract were you dont get payed for overtime in this industry. If they are makeing 60K a year as developers i dont think they can complain about any of this. I know people who work at grocery stores stocking shelves 12 hours a day 5 days a week and believe me sitting at a computer is a lot easier.

if the devs were better at doing there job this wouldnt happen. looks like they should be trying to make less mistakes.

[DragonKnight]

They don't have a union, so a strike is out of the question, and many did leave, that's why they weren't credited.

[whosbad]

Worked in the Industry as a 3d artist for the last few years.Crunch happens,fact.Now it comes down to how much crunch.Your contract highlights that you are paid for a 40 hour week and you are given a legal document saying yes/no to working 48+ hour week.
I do sympathise especially as in my expereince its either Bad management,Publisher demands or both.
No noe minds doing extra for what they love but there has to be some reward (Paid OT or time off) once the title is complete.

[Guitardr85]

So I work at a place that is currently having management work 12-14 hour days 5-6 days a week. Everyone is of the mind that "this is what we need to do for the company" but it seemed excessive. I just came across this article and its a little cathartic to see that in other places, people are having to deal with the same problems. Hopefully my place of employment calms down soon and we can start working normal hours. It's 5:40AM and I'm off to work; probably be back around 7-8PM tonight.

[bunfighterii]

I cant imagine they were very productive.

I'm a lawyer and pull probably one or two 12 hour days a month, and I can tell you I'm much more productive on a standard 9-5 or at least 9 to 6 day than I am doing one of those long days.

[Apollyn]

Sweet what do u specialise in.

[nycrekid]

What kind of lawyer are you? I am in NY and I have tons of attorney friends and NONE of them do 9-5 hours!!!

They are routinely still in the office at 9pm sometimes later.

[Apollyn]

Atleast thhey got a job stop bloody whingeing. They have a Rockstar title on there CV that's bloody big.
They still got paid for it. If u get given a deadline u don't play with ur balls for 7 years. I've worked 11 hour shifts 6 days a week and every Sunday do 7 hours. Some Thurs and Fridays I'm on 18 hour shifts.

My last day off was March 17th as my OH was in labor. Before that xmas day.

Business is business at the end of the day. You don't get successful in life by doing 9-5 5 days a week

[tmoss726]

And that's the problem with America. Other countries seem to be pretty successful doing 9-5.

[ironwolf]

Indeed. Countries like Greece, Portugal, Ireland, Spain......

[Apollyn]

Im english. From england and currently in england.
And i run my own company.

[yog-sothot]

That McNamara sounds like a douche...

It's great to have a vision for your game but you have to respect your team. And in that case, him saying "that's my game, I do wathever I want" sounds more like Eric Cartman than like an inspired artist ! You're not working on your little indie game ! And 7 years of production does not sound like an authorial vision, it sounds more like a frickin mess with a manager who has no clue where he's going

Maybe it's time for game developers to create a guild or maybe to unionize... Right, they are working in a creative industry, some might say in a "dream indutry", but this does not justify to be treated like a slave

[ironwolf]

Welcome to the world of software/hardware development. "Crunch" hours (or weeks or months) are the norm even at large multi-nationals like HP or Oce or Xerox, let alone at some little piddly-ass game develpment studio. If workers can't stand the heat then get the hell out of the kitchen, the rest of us have work to do. After all, there's always the unemployment line.

[Darkfiber]

Seriously, why does everyone act like they are slaves? They are free to work where they want. If they don't like it, they can find a new job. No one is forcing them to work those hours. I don't feel sorry for people who CHOOSE to be exploited.

[zero_cool]

You should be able to have some fun making games because better games are produced when the work environment is friendlier!

[ExposingLames]

boo freaking hoo WOW we have to work 12 hour days in "crunch time" WOW what a joke this world is

there are people who do A LOT harder work than game developing and thats their normal shit and everyday schedule...not just "crunch time (including myself) maybe they should go cry for doctors and people who work in power plants and stuff first.....oh wait they arent crying anyways they suck it up, do their job and make their OT money

w/e

[yewles1]

Kharma for ditching Eight Days and Getaway 3.

[omi25p]

so the employees suffer because the management ditched a game. Good plan

[yewles1]

BZZZZT!!! The management that tortured the teams have had their d-baggary revealed to the world, the same management that's accused of faking Getaway 3 and Eight Days footage from the beginning.

[lizard81288]

Foster's, Australian for overworking

[kraze07]

12 hours a day minimum, 7 days a week is normal when you're on deployment or just underway on a ship. Not saying it's right though. There's always a way to better manage time in the workplace.

[NotSoSilentBob]

But the fans all approve of it when they ran out and bought the game.

[clarkdef]

I heard in America you can get fired on the spot, so there's a mega power play there between employee and employer. Pretty sad.

[ironwolf]

If an employer hires a young person who turns out to be a lazy dope smoking slacker, but some bureaucrat won't let the employer fire said bum, what incentive does the employer have to risk hiring young people? Seems I've heard that young folks have a very hard time getting hired in Europe. I wonder if, perhaps, there might be a connection.

[clarkdef]

This is why America is coming in behind countries like Australia who know how to do things right. I wasn't talking about teenagers either anyone could be a slack ass, but a lot of the time good people hang.

[ironwolf]

I was talking about young people as in 20somethings and university grads. And I suppose the fact that Australian worker productivity is 83.4% of the US is a sign of them doing it "right".

[shadowboricua]

Whatever. Most of my friends are MD residents who work an average of 80 hours a week at an average of $5 an hour or less and they aren't complaining. They have to keep patients alive for almost no pay. What are they bitching about?