L4D Sequel Met with Much More than Indifference

Kotaku:

"Whatever your view is of internet boycotts, Left 4 Dead might be the first critically acclaimed franchise whose announcement of a sequel was answered by nearly 10,000 fans pledging not to buy it.

Since the game was unveiled June 1 at E3, a Steam group called L4D Boycott (NO-L4D2) has assembled 9,742 members as of Saturday, and seems to be growing. Far from being enthused about a new game, they have nine complaints, most of which concern L4D2 obviating the need for, and undermining the value of, L4D1 - and just a year after the fact:"

[SaberEdge]

When the first game sold over 6 million copies, 10,000 people isn't much.

Eh, who cares? I'm buying it. Let those people deprive themselves of a good game.

[gamesmaster]

i think the issue is that valves games usually have a large mod community following which valve themselves usually support well, since l4d provided an amazing platform for which mod makers could build upon, i think people are feeling like that community is being dumped now, but i'm sure l4d 2 will use that same source engine so there's no need to fret. (i hope)

[Anon1974]

I had no idea it was doing that well on the PC. I know it hit 2 million on the 360, but 6 million even between the 2 platforms is quite a remarkable feat.

Personally, I missed out. I don't use XBL anymore, and my PC is woefully underpowered. As I do most of my gaming on the consoles now (I simply gave up constantly upgrading my PC to keep up) I do my online gaming via the PS3. It's fast, lagfree and free, just what I used to have on my PC. If Left 4 Dead ever came to the PS3 I'd buy it in a heartbeat. Valve's loss, I guess. It's not like there's a shortage of games to play.

[SuperM]

If you buy the game you basically tell valve that its ok to milk their franchises. Its ridiculus that they had Left4Dead in development for like 3 years or more and then 1 year later they are releasing Left4Dead2 even though the first one was lacking in content. Chances are Valve held back content from the first game to finish it off and then decided to put it in a sequel potentially doubling their revenue.

[Sarcasm]

So they sold 4 million copies on Steam?

Where in the world did you get 6 million from?

[SaberEdge]

I apologize guys. I should have checked that number. I knew it had sold several million and in the other thread I heard some people mention 6 million so I assumed that was what it must be. Not a good idea to assume anything. Sorry.

Anyway, I don't think it changes the point much. Like a lot of boycotts many of the people involved in the boycott will end up buying the game anyway, once they see how much fun it is going to be.

[snipermk0]

L4D sold six million copies and santa clause killed JFK. We all know that..

[xabmol]

Santa is a bildaburger?

I new something about that guy just didn't seem right.

[braane]

When I buy a game, I buy it for face value. No matter what has been promised I don't buy it for what may happen, if the original game isn't enough then it isn't worth it. So instead of everyone whining, why don't they man up for their mistakes. A lot of titles have had promised content that never showed up. Take it with a grain of salt when it's promised, and buy your games carefully knowing that what you get is all that you should expect.

So to all of the people complaining about L4D2... grow up you babies.

[SuperM]

So they are babies because they actually complain when Valve tries to rip of their customers? Better let Valve know when they f'ck up then just sitting there watching as Valve goes from a quality developer into a milking cow.

People waited for years for Left4Dead to finally come out. When it did it was a great game, but it was very low on features. So now valve has suddenly made enough content for another game even though its less then a year since the first one came out. The gameplay is exactly the same so how in hell they can call it Left4Dead2 and keep a straight face is beyond me. Its content held back from the original game, total ripoff.

[snipermk0]

cos you're a stupid console gamer. Its the PC gamers that feel cheated. Valve has NEVER let down their customers. And this is the first sign of them actually milking us. So, stop being ignorant if you don't know the other half of the story.

The reason the game even got a good score was because most reviews mention something along the lines of, "the game is lacking in content but knowing valve as we do, we're sure they'll bring much more to the table".

[evrfighter]

Just because you spread your cheeks willingly doesn't mean pc gamers will.

PC gamers unlike console gamers will remember what's promised to them. If that promise is broken, pc gamers unlike console gamers aren't afraid to speak up and attempt to do something about it.

[Traveler]

I tend to agree. I think they are making a mountain out of a molehill.

[Revvin]

I'm buying it too and I only bought the first game a few months ago and I've had my money's worth out of it.

[TheBand1t]

Whatever, man. Valve had at least better be putting that money together to make HL2: Episode 3 one of the most memorable games ever.

[TheBand1t]

So you disagree guys don't want Valve to put their money into making HL2: Episode 3 into one of the most memorable games ever?

.....That doesn't make sense. At all. :/

[Foxgod]

Dont like ? dont buy, simple enuff.

[leftbehindxp]

I agree. Can't believe people are going overboard with this. If you don't like it then don't buy it, plus you'll be boycotting it at the same time, very simple.

[ZombieNinjaPanda]

I do agree with their point of the "brightness" or atmosphere of the game.

When you say Zombies, I think dark abandoned areas. Not bright and sunny with a beach near by.

But I watched some of the gameplay, and I think I may convince my bud with a 360 to get it. Does it have Split screen co-op?

[Ravage27]

there's another game that featured zombies in sunny atmosphere, i'm sure you've heard of it.Starts with a R

[Gun_Senshi]

I wish it to be released at budget price, after all its just expansion of L4D1.

As Above, I love the atmosphere of L4D, its dark and goes with the game, not sunny like L4D2 shows so.
Before you call me fanboy.

[OtherWhiteMeat]

Doesn't EA sports do the same thing. Stop your cry'n

[mrv321]

Valves doing something stupid, isn't L4D bassed of a mod? Why not wait two year and add the PC mods to one disk/game add in L4D2 and call it what ever you want. Nobody will moan, trust me. Mods are great they are made by the community and are designed around what the community wants. Also don't use source, it's outdated L4D looks older than it should, just try and add something really specially, because this year we'll see Uncharted 2 and honestly the two looks generations appart. Heck I'm willing to bet Uncharted will look better, and will be scarier.

Uncharted 1 looks better than L4D and is scarier... strange ins't it from a newer game about zombies.

[Gun_Senshi]

yes its a gloryfied mod of CS called Zombie Panic.

check above before you call me PS3 fanboy. right now i'm playing l4d with an M4 with LASER SIGHT on it t('.'t)

[N2NOther]

Considering the first one cleared 2 million, 10,000 isn't really that many.

[SaberEdge]

Back in March Valve reported having sold over 2.5 million copies.

I got it wrong in the first post because I listened to what somebody else said. I should have checked. But now I have, and that is what I found.

2.5 million is still a lot and of course it can make an impact, but it won't be much. Especially since a lot of those people, when they don't get their way, will just end up buying the game anyway. Not to mention some of those people were probably not going to buy the game in the first place and are just doing it to make a scene...because they hate Valve or they don't want to see the 360 get a good game.

All I know is that I am getting Left 4 Dead 2 and I don't feel like I got ripped off on the first one at all.

[cmrbe]

is setting a dangerous precedence that gamers should be worry about.

L4D lacked content to begin with. L4D and L4D2 should have been 1 game. Not two.

I don't see why they are complaining. They bought it and they supported it.

[Reibooi]

The real issue here isn't really that much that the game is coming out as soon as it is or that people are feeling that Valve is trying to cash in.

The issue here is that all this is is a expansion and all this content is content that was promised as DLC for Left for Dead 1 not as a stand alone game sequel. Simply put they lied and are now trying to make people pony up more money. People expected support for left for dead to be like Team Fortress 2 was all the DLC was great and it was all free and Valve talked about it as if that's what we could expect and then they turned around and do this. Not only that they do it this quickly. It's really a stab in the back. The simple fact is that anyone who buys the sequel who bought the first is gonna feel ripped off because it's a expansion plain and simple.

[N2NOther]

Wow, you've read all the same things we have and yet you already know what the complete game is going to be?

They completely revamped the game play based on not only a better AI Director but one that will change the lay out of the map based on how well you're doing. Melee weapons, new ammo, new special infected (I'd be willing to bet that there will be more than just the Charger). All in all, it's more than most sequels. The ONLY reason people are complaining about this package is because the first one came out less than a year ago. If this same package dropped 16 months later instead of 12, people would have far less to say.

Not to mention that Valve has gone ON RECORD saying that they'll continue to support the first game.

[evrfighter]

I agree there is grounds to worry a little if you think about it some.

You can bet other developers will be watching to see how successful this game is. If they find that they too can go the sports game route in other genres. The next couple of years is going to be very boring -_-

[shiro]

i personally waited a few months to try ou left for dead 1 an i was blow away the extra maps wer sweet but a new game with new characters an 5 more campaigns is way better than waitin two years for them to send it all to us in dlc im willin to pay 40 euro for a game tat has everytin but lik the first one i will wait an see if everytin comes wit it if it doesnt il prob get it off my mate who loves horror/zombie genre games :D

[II Necroplasm II]

Left $ Dead 2 should be pretty good. Oops sorry I held the shift button by accident...

[Death]

Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty 11/13/01
Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance 11/05/02

Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater 11/17/04
Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence 03/14/06

Anyone wnat to bet that these fine games were announced within 1 year of the originals release? These aren't even actual sequels, they are the same games that were tweaked and re-released as full releases the following year. Why is an actual sequel to Left 4 Dead the exception instead of following the rule? L4D has been a fun game, but for people that have owned it since release, 1 year is more than enough time until the next one releases. The perecentage of people that play this daily and wait for updates is very small compared to the average gamers that probably played it for the first week or two and would be interested in a sequel. Could L4D be extended via DLC to make it last longer? Sure, but couldn't pretty much any game?

-Death

[ButterToast]

MGS2 was originally only released on the PS2. they re-released the game on the Xbox and PC with subsistence. the PS2 version was probably just for PS2 owners who either hadn't bought the game or wanted the content that the xbox version had.

Now with MGS3 it was only released on the PS2 in 2004. they either were porting it over to xbox whose support was basically dead by the time it re-released in 2006 thus only the PS2 re-release, or saw some success in the re-release of MGS2 and tried to recreate it with MGS3. Or it may have been something the fans were asking for. I know i held out on MGS3 expecting a subsistence somewhere down the line since i was upset about the content I missed out on in MGS2 (I never bought MGS2 subsistence BTW).

Nice try with MGS2 and the jury is still out with MGS3.

either way it still doesn't take away from the fact that valve is doing some pretty sh!tty business practices here.

EDIT: also there wasn't any sort of DLC for the PS2 to remedy the situation.

[X]

I can help with MGS3S

The release of MGS3S did a couple of things. First off there was a free moving camera to help address the issues some players had with the camera angles. The second important thing was that it came with another disc. That disc was the debut of metal gear online. Third was that it also came with the MSX versions of metal gear and metatl gear 2 solid snake. So those of us who didn't have emulators could finally see how this series got started. Finally unlike most re-releases, this game was released for 29.99 USD.

[Clap Your Hands]

MGS 2 and 3 were full games, sold at full price. The Substance versions a year after, just added even more for the hardcore fans and collectors. Nobody complained because MGS 2 and 3 from the start were full games with a lot of content.

L4D were basically half a game (4 maps, 2 hour singleplayer campaign etc.) sold at full price, with the promise of more free content to validate the high price... free content that to this date has not come.
People are angry because Valve charged them full price for half a game, and now also want full price for the other half.

[Pandamobile]

Most of you people don't understand...

The standard Valve set for itself with TF2 is the reason PC Gamers are upset with the sequel.

TF2 has been ever-evolving since its release and Valve told us that L4D would get the same treatment. (Doug Lombardi said in a 2008 interview that they'd continually support with more campaigns, boss infected and items.)

Valve is a smart company and has always listened to its fans. 12,000 of Valve's fans is too large of a number for Valve to ignore.

90% of the people upset about this will be A LOT happier if it's priced as an expansion like Crysis Warhead was.

[N2NOther]

TF2 wasn't even a full game when it was released though. It was designed to be added on to from the beginning. If the core dynamics of the game were changing as significantly as L4D to L4D 2 then I'd bet there'd be a whole new game.

What cracks me up is that Valve has a very good reputation that I feel has earned them more than enough slack and the benefit of the doubt.

[Pandamobile]

You're saying TF2 wasn't a full game?

You on crack? Just because it only had 6 maps doesn't mean it wasn't a full game.

[N2NOther]

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. 6 maps and 2 game modes is NOT a full game when you look at the robust amount of modes on many other online shooters. The game was also released as a small part of a larger package initially. Nothing about it screamed, or even whispered "full game" to anyone, except you, apparently.

[Pandamobile]

There were 3 game modes. But the game was so incredibly refined that 6 maps were perfectly fine with me.

[mcgrawgamer]

that l4d was a mod that was sold as a retail game to begin with. The sad fact of the matter is that most pc gamers I know are eagerly awaiting L4D 2. we either wanted L4D2 or more L4D content either way I'll be supporting the game. The only people that have issues with L4D 2 are pc elitist and playstation loyalist. as a combination of both I have no problems with L4D2. L4D was more enjoyable than most other games that are sold at retail and L4D2 will have more content that many other games sold at retail. If you have a problem with it don't support it; but just know that your voice WILL go unheard as many more will support the game.

[Silly Mammo]

To me, this story shows the different mentality between console and PC gamers. Where console gamers have a history of buying new versions for the same game year after year. PC gamers are used to buying a game and nurturing it for many years through community mods and updates from the developer.

The arguement that sports games come out every year or the new MGS versions doesn't hold water, because until this gen of consoles, you couldn't have updates to the said game. So there had to be a new release. PC games can be patched and tweaked and a lot of times are somewhat "incomplete" upon release. PC gamers sort of know this and expect to a get a more polished version down the road.

BTW- I'm not disparging one group of gamers over the other. Just making an observation.

[Agrahim]

Never played the 1st L4D, but I always wanted to (zombies + videogames= awesome ****). Usually I don't understand these online petitions, but I kinda get this one. The main complaint I always heard about L4D1 was about the "severe" lack of content, and I thought I read that Valve was going to be adding a ton of stuff. Now with L4D2 already coming, it does look like L4D1 is gonna get dumped.

[Sheikh Yerbouti]

...need to consider is they are selling an experience, not a disc full of code. They need to deliver the experience that they promising. This goes beyond the disc to any online component, DLC, etc.

The same is true with Rockstar's and Bethesda's exclusive content for Microsoft. The experience expected won't be delivered for a lot of gamers.

10,000 may not seem much. But those are the ones who are actively boycotting the games. Many more won't buy the game either, boycott or no. Publishers and developers need more understanding in how we perceive the value of their games.

[ASSASSYN 36o]

Get a life.