Microsoft Upgrading Xbox 360 To Widen Its Appeal (First official pictures!)

It's finally been confirmed.

The new Xbox 360 Elite will sell for $479.99. Consumers who already own the $399.99 20-gigabyte model will be able to buy a snap-on 120-gigabyte hard drive for $179.99. HDMI output is also confirmed.

Full press release after the jump.

[MoonDust]

479 is a good deal.

[Bill Nye]

Perhaps, but $179.99 for the 120 GB HDD isn't.

[highps3]

Well glad microsoft finally has a real console mabe ill pick up this one...

Makes the white console officially xbox 2.5!!!

[Bill Nye]

No, they didn't.

[RelloC]

" Makes the white console officially xbox 2.5!!! "

Wouldn't this be a compliment??? You moron.

[ElementX]

I hope tomorrow isn't Halo 3 news. *Yawn* I'd rather have a new exclusive game. We already know Halo 3 is coming.

[Bill Nye]

It's nice that it comes with an HDMI cable (as well as component and composite). Sony, take note.

[Kyur4ThePain]

MS has been taking notes recently.

[DJ]

PS3 had HDMI from Day one; I think Microsoft took pretty good note of that. Too bad it not only costs 180 dollars for the bigger hard drive, but the HDMI isn't even an upgrade option. And all of this within a year of launch. Way to win consumers' trust.

[Bill Nye]

I said HDMI CABLE which is something the PS3 does NOT come with.

[Optimus Prime]

looking good, if only i had a tv that would support hdmi, i would pick one of these up for sure, but i dont, ill have to wait a bit. still looking cool though

[MEGANE]

I wonder if the RING OF DEATH is gona be RED in thisone??

[SEAN1617]

hey thats a nice deal i need that hdmi will pick one up for sure.

[SEAN1617]

that would be very nice

[Optimus Prime]

i dont think so, but that would have been nice. i just read the box in the pictures, hard to read, but i couldnt see a recharge kit.

[MEGANE]

Does it come with a RED RING OF DEATH?

[The BS Police]

Gimme the 120 HDD, lol.

[Nickels]

What the F*** am I to do with this daum white console, and thats what I been waiting all night for? F-microsoft.... They should up grade my white and charge me the difference. Now thats how you do business

[Theo1130]

is you play your games on it, and not whine about stupid things

[THAMMER1]

Yu know it is the same 360. The only difference is the larger HDD & HDMI. There nothin so diffent there that you will miss out if you do not upgrade.

[The great Me]

what they should do is let me return my 20 gig HD and charge me 60 dollars or so for the 120, because nearly 200 is a major rip off.

[Bigmac573]

Congrats on screwing over 7 million 360 owners, MS!

[Optimus Prime]

how????

[MEGANE]

How?...the answer is...
with another RING OF DEATH!

[BIadestarX]

Honesly I like the specs, but I will wait until they make it on white. I like white instead of black.

"Congrats on screwing over 7 million 360 owners, MS! " Not for nothing but, I'm sure that the next 40-50 Million consoles owners that may buy the console will definelly apreciated. I was going to buy myself a PS3, instead I will buy this SKU (when is available in white) and give the one I own to my brother. He is does not even know what HDMI is for nor have an HDTV.

[gogators]

HDMI it will have? I would hope that it's HDMI version 1.3. I like those black controllers. At least MS is including an HDMI cable and I believe they said the play and charge kits will be sold separately.

[SEAN1617]

but if you buy the whole thing alone it's a good price, also a very evil idea would be, to replace the shell of your 20gb hdd with the 120 hdd and then return it saying that it was defective lol yes i know you would go to hell, but think of the capacity, lol

[kewlkat007]

that they did not add an HD-DVD drive to it. I mean they could of, but I'm sure there are good reasons why. With IP-Netflix-TV coming soon its a good choice to upgrade to the 120GB drive, but a bit too much for that sire.

I do like the black box which I knew would eventually come. For $79 more dollars you get HDMI and 120GB drive. HD-DVD is not important right now so it was not added.(I'm sure they will support the format that wins).

[i rule]

this is great news.. gonna reserve it tomorrow. WOW BIG MAC IS THE ONLY TROLL IN HERE. I THOUGHT DJ WOULD BE ALL OVER THIS

[Hunnington Bear]

does anyone else think this just sucks? sure, it's a great deal if you don't already own one, but what about everyone that already owns a 360. they already have 7mil users and now decide to upgrade and charge us another 480? i believe previous users should get an extreme discount microsofts mistake of not adding this in the first place. i'll be avoiding this for sure. and the $180 hdd, come on. that's 580 total, and still not as good as the elite.

p.s. couldn't they have added wireless internet. ofcourse not that's rediculous. +$100...

[SKUD]

As a current X360 owner im disappointed. At $179.99+tax for the 120GB HDD this could have been a great opportunity to drop the price of the current 20GB HDD ($99.99+tax). So basically its going to be another $200 dollars to upgrade my X360's hard drive. TOTAL RIP OFF. This is in no way shape or form a good deal for current owners who cant look for other alternatives to get more hard drive space.

[StrongerCypher]

Now I am a big fan of xbox but I feel really screwed. Not for nothing I have never liked the other console but loved the xbox to the 360. I have two 360's and two 1080p tvs that these xboxes can't take advantage of. where does that leave the customer that wanted these features all along? will there be some type of cable that will come out for these boxes or has MS lied about it being very upgradeable. Now I can go out and buy this new box if I wanted to but I will definitely feel like I am getting the shaft from MS.

If these premiums already out are not upgradeable you can bet a lot of ppl will be pissed at MS. If this was about choice, MS from the get go could have had two out . One four 299w 20g hd and the 479 version about to come out. They would have made a killing. PPl will not for get this and will be very leary of MS the next time around. I am not a person to throw money away just because I have it. I feel like I have been played.

[Ps3007]

LMAO, I think all 7 million of you officially just got OWNED by Bill Gates!

Too funny, never been happier.. :)

See you online! :)

[bootsielon]

I have a PS3 and a 360, but I wish I had the Elite. There is no way Im upgrading the hard drive because its a rip off. For that amount of media I rather upgrade PS3s HDD, which would end up being cheaper.

You should see the reaction though. Many early adopters feel screwed, and rightly so. I feel exactly like them. If you are a current Xbox 360 owner, yet you want the HDMI and the storage, just buy a PS3. For 20 bucks extra, you get a blu=ray player and you can put any HDD size you want. Besides, youll be able to enjoy the PS3 exclusives too, and youll save yourself being ripped off in this way, and even more by avoiding trading your current 360.

×Edit

below:

If you want the Elite version yet you have a 360 already, you have not business in RE-BUYING a 360. You-re better off with a PS3, no need to have two 360s. If you want the ELITE, you probably have an HDTV and want to exploit it as much as you can. So, for 20 bucks, you get a Blu=ray player. OK, 40 bucks if you include the HDMI cable.

In my case, I have the WiFi adaptor for 360 because I need it, so the 60 Gig PS3 plus 20 dollar HDMI cable became my ideal choice.

Also, adding another hard drive shouldn-t be seen as expensive, since you can use the old hard drive ANYWHERE, unlike 360s hdd.

[JOLLY1]

for 20 more you can get blu-ray and UPGRADE to any size drive you want. So I can get the 20 gig model then buy the hdmi cable then get the upgraded 120 gig drive. Wow, that's starting to sound even more expensive, and that isn't even the expensive ps3 model.

cute someone disagrees with facts....good job. Ha!

Why would I get a ps3? I would rather have a Premium and an Elite 360. Actually I have 2 360's now, and a 3rd one with one more hdtv would be absolutely great for Forza. You may not know this, but I can hook all the 360's together and have one killer racing co(kpit view. Now that I think about it, that's a great idea! Thanks for the help in my decision!!! You've been a great inspiration!!!....wow. you can't put the word co(kpit

[Hymons]

I dunno about you, but I see that as a pretty good deal. Considering if you were going to buy the PS3 60GB, $635.98 US (tax included), you'd be saving about $84.17, with the Elite and the HD-DVD Drive that, together bring the price to.. I don't believe it $720.15 US (tax inculded).

LOL, 720.. hehe I find that funny. XBOX360 = 720.. lol thats great.

Anyway, I do see a good deal in buying a PS3. Why miss out on other great games that are to come?

Edit:

@ Jolly, well I would have to tell you that, one game (Forza).. or another library of games (PS3) hmm... couldn't tell you. Quit being a fanboy about it and give it up already. I'm giving you a logical reason to buy a PS3... being able to play Forza with another screen, is a fanboyish excuse not to get a PS3. Who wouldn't want a whole other library of games to play?

@ bootsielon, I forgot about the wifi.. lol so technically it's $826.13 US (tax included)+XBOXLive which is lets say only $52.98 US (tax included) for one year to get the Elite with all the features of the PS3. Which in a grand total comes to $879.11 US (tax included), without adding the extra years..

Now tell me how $635.98 is not a good deal compared to $879.11..(assuming you wanted to have it all)

lol, I could go on forever about this.. I'm going to stop here though.

[bootsielon]

Elite has no WiFi, so you-d need another 100 bucks.

480
100 WiFi
200 HD DVD, infrared controller included

780

60 Gig PS3 600
HDMI Cable 20
Blue tooth Controller 20

640

What can you do with the extra 140? Get a 200 HDD.

If you don-t need the WiFi, you simply subtract 100 to both AND you still get the same.

By the way, this doesnt include LIVE fees, which could end up being 250 for the consoles life span, when you have a HOME for free. Those 250 bucks could be used, coupled with the former 140 bucks, and get you a 500 HDD. Or, if you are not interested in storage, but you still want HD stuff, and HDMI, you get the pocket change, or tons of games.

PS3 is a pretty neat deal for HD enthusiasts and hardcore gamers, and it-s the ideal platform for developers (HDD out of the box, Blu=ray built in, revolutionary CPU)

Jolly:

So, you rather have repeated consoles than two different consoles? Im smelling fanboy. Nothing you said are facts, just opinion, so yeah, I disagree with it.

Why not get the Elite AND a PS3 with those two 360s you have anyway? After all, you-re planning on spending the cash. You should hurry before they turn into toasters ;) That way your warranty is renewed too, and you get a more reliable 65nm processor.

[JOLLY1]

actually I didn't put an opinion at all. I said true numbers and you didn't like them (I'm sorry). I guess I am a fanboy. I love racing games. I love the co(kpit view in PGR3. I can't wait for the 3 screen co(kpit in Forza 2. What racing game is there for the ps3? why are trying to cram a ps3 down my throat? I like 360 games, sorry that offends you. I don't enjoy final fantasy, gthd is a tech demo. I don't think driving one car around a track is fun. I don't like playing bumper car..on a wall. I admit it I am a fanboy...Now can you admit it?

I guess you didn't like my answer, it's ok.. I understand.

See here is the thing. No games=no sell. It's really as simple as that. There aren't any games that are even close to compelling for me. I don't know which games would be compelling for anyone on the ps3. THat's me though. As for money I see that $480<$600. Where is your math taking me? Even after I get the 60 gig ps3 I have to buy a hdmi cable and (if I wanted to match the 360) a 120 gig hd. Now, you tell me which is cheaper.

*Last edit for the night* Man, that was fun. This bubble sitsuation is crazy. I'm glad for all you sony people that like your console. That's great for you. I just don't get why you are all in here freaking out about this price, for the 360. Oh well, I'll leave it at that. *GOODNIGHT KIDS*

[Hymons]

just going to comment here... @ jolly, sorry you can't comment back.. lol

Anyway, no one is trying to shove a PS3 down your throat. I'm just trying to tell you, that I BELIEVE, you'd get a better deal out of a PS3 than you would a 3RD XBOX.

I understand that you like and prefer XBOX, but I enjoy a variety. To me, getting the PS3 would be the benefit. (My bro has 360, I have PS3.. I get to play the whole spectrum.. excluding the Wii of course)

To you, another 360 may be the best case. To each his own. I was just stating above, the advantages, but the only disadvantage is money issues. If you have the money, then go for it, have at your 3 screen forza gaming.

I'm all for gaming in general, I don't really care one way or another. Yet, when money is involved I look for an efficient route to take.

I was just offereing my opinion.
If you don't like it, thats fine, I respect that. If you do like it, thats also fine, I still respect that.

Edit: @ jolly
With all due respect, if I add wifi and a Hd-Dvd drive to the cost of the Elite and, $50 for online play.. it would go to about $876 (tax included) for the Elite to be fully optimised (saying that 120Gig Hard Drive is the limit w/ wifi & next gen dvd player + online play) If I took a HDMI cord about $33, and another hard drive(120GB) for about $157, then you would come to about $827 (tax included for PS3).
(You could probably find a HDMI cord and 120Gb drive for PS3 cheaper, but this is a quick estimate..)

Saying that both sytems have online capability for atleast a year, both have next gen dvd players, wifi capabilities and, a 120GB hard drive, not to mention the HDMI cord for PS3.. the PS3 still comes as the cheaper route.

$827 < $879

(either way we haven't even bought games yet, which is where you would save money getting the Elite, but the stand-alone costs for fully optimising is what is shown above)

But as I mentioned, it may be in your best intrest to have the Elite. I'm not pushing you towards the PS3, it's just that I'm stating it would be cheaper when fully optimized.

All in all I respect your view and I understand what you mean.
It's good to be a gamer, no matter what system(s) you have.

(Just to mention Jolly, I didn't see your last edit before I posted the edit above, lol but this sure is a crazy situation.. lol. Need more bubbles..)

[bootsielon]

You get backwards compatibility, free online, folding, and home. It-s a good deal if you wanted those features and you are already a 360 owner; especially if you never had a PS2 or PS1.

[Marriot VP]

Do you guys really understand why the HDDs cost so much??????

It's because they want consumers to pay for the premium instead of the core. It makes the premium seem like much more of deal with the stand alone pieces are astronomical. The same thing with the Elite, if you an uber tech guy and NEED the 120gb your best bet by far is to buy the Elite. NOT THE 120GB individually.

That's simple business strategies. People who want to complain, but what you don't get is that your really not important when MS is aiming at 50 million consumers, 1 million pro gamers isn't too important. So if you WANT the HDMI or 120gb you'll have to buy an elite. The motive behind this is to get more units out into the public.

Notice how 400 premium + 120gb at 180 = 580

They're just forcing you to buy up. I don't need the elite or the HDD so I'm sittin pretty with 1080p on my CRT. If your going to buy the 120gb HDD separate you are a SUCKER. Just sell your 360 to a friend or brother and buy the new one. You'll be way more happy with that. Also the more used 360's out in ebay and on the market means cheaper prices and a bigger installed base. More will buy at lower prices. Trickle down effect.

You need to diversify your bonds...(chappelles show)

[JOLLY1]

400+180=580. that is not the same number. YOu actually get the 120 gb drive for 100 off. You also get the hdmi cable (roughly $50). In all you actually save $150.

[Hunnington Bear]

"Notice how 400 premium + 120gb at 180 = 480 (an elite)"

actually it'd be $580.. much more than an elite plus no hdmi.. so yeah you're right though

[Marriot VP]

haha, yah guess so. But doesn't disprove my point, it actually reinforces it a lot more.

thanks for the call out

[TheExecutive]

but a little customer loyalty never hurt a company either... i realize that MS is a business but it seems kinda underhanded. They could have at least released all three consoles at once and gave the first consumers choice. Coming out with this console a year and some change later is pretty... well microsoft-ish

[MoonDust]

All they are doing is replacing the $100 HDD to the 179 HDD. 300+179=479. Same console with more to offer, only for the ones that absolutely need HDMI/120Gig and some free goodies.

[Hymons]

I personally think the (present day) 360 owners would be getting ripped off. Unless of course the have the money to dish out for an Elite, but none-the-less making consumers pay approx. $190.78 US (tax included) for the hard drive add-on is a rip off. Considering that the people that buy the Elite get HDMI support (w/ the cord) and the 120GB Hard drive for only approx. $84.80 US (tax included) extra.

My Opinion, I'd try to sell the Xbox 360 premium try to get $300 out of it, and then use the $200 you would have spend on the 120GB hard drive, to get an Elite. It's about $510 if you add tax.

I'm not sure how much a person could get out of a Premium 360, but I'd definitely try to get something out of it, because anyone who purchases the 120GB is being ripped off.

[TheExecutive]

I feel sorry for the already existing 360 owners. I bought my PS3 and am extremely happy with my purchase. I was waiting for MS to come out with this ELITE version so they could finally join the HD revolution... about time. Now I am going to have two black consoles in my cabinet. Sorry for the previous 360 owners that wanted the best version and now have to spend 879 dollars to get it, that is really smart marketing on MS part... no it really is.

[JOLLY1]

You must be misinformed. The hdmi cable has the same output as the component cables. I can still play games in 1080P. I also have the vga cables, for the 1080P movies. I don't know what you think you are getting better in the ps3, I know I have been getting HD for some time now and i love it!

Maybe sony fans don't understand why they want you to go hdmi. hdmi is to protect against pirating movies. It doesn't do anything better than DVI (for video), sound is a different story. Sony loses millions a year by video pirating, that's why it's so important to them. I'm glad you are all worried about pirating also!

[I theCRUSHER I]

So you have a PS3? Are there any games out for that system yet? Ohh yeah I am sorry I forgot how awesome Motorstorm is. SIDE NOTE: I hate you BILL GATES!!! 180 dollars? Do you need another island or something?

[scriptkiddie]

You are correct, HDMI is only for copyright protection, there is no quality difference from component cables. But using digital HDMI cable is the only way that movie companies can protect their movies from being pirated.

My digital cable box has HDMI and i had to replace it with a component cable because the picture was actually worse then with the component cable on channels such as HBO.

[omegaheat]

This can't be good news to the folks over at Sony. That black design just made the Xbox360 even more sexier than before, not to mention that the hard dirve is twice that of the PS3. It has HDMI and the cables are included and yet it still falls way under the price of the PS3, both the 20 and 60 gigabit PS3 model. Ouch. Microsoft you bully :). You guys are always trying to impress the consumer and give us what we really want. Thank you for changing the game.

[Ps3Fanboy777]

Feel bad for you all, your once elite console is now the cheapo version... Better hope your downloads transfer..

For up the doe this will be a yearly thing. Live fee not included...

Enjoy it! Im going to go play my Ps3 and laugh.... A LOT!

[ddcab]

Oh my bad this is real....so much for that theory. Way to go MS the add-on king!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[lilwingman]

I like the black a whole lot more than the white, but this expensive model just justifies the PS3's price even more. I know the whole argument has been about the PS3 being so expensive, but now Microsoft has practically duplicated that pricetag. Until the price falls and they start phasing out the other SKU's than I think this will only appeal to the most tech-savvy gamers.

[SF49er408]

THE NEXT ANNOUNCEMENT WILL BE A PRICE DROP OF THE CORE AND PREMIUM CONSOLE. THE CORE WILL BE 199 AND THE PREMIUM WILL BE 299. THIS WAY A PREMIUM CONSOLE + A 120 GIG DRIVE IS THE SAME PRICE AS AN ELITE. THERE IS NO WAY MICROSOFT WOULD RELEASE AN ELITE AT 475 WHILE THE PREMIUM IS STILL AT 399. THIS WOULD PUT THEIR CONSOLE TOO CLOSE TO PS3. GUARANTEE THE NEXT ANNOUNCEMENT 100 PRICE DROP OF BOTH CONSOLES. THATS WHY HARD DRIVE IS 179

[Hunnington Bear]

i didn't even think of that. that's a good prediction..

[NanoSplitter]

...Jolly is absolutely correct that HDMI is not, in 99% of cases, THAT much of an upgrade for video. Also, those of you that are pissed about the upgrade cost of the 120GB HDD, why not spend a relatively meager $100-$170 for a 200-300GB external hard drive connected by USB? In addition to the cost savings you would also be gaining double the capacity. Is there something that the MS HDD drive can do that an external cannot (other than attach nice and snug to the console, rather than have a single small cord connecting, of course)? {NOTE: this is a genuine question, not one of the ever popular rhetorical variety!}

[Douglasp]

WOW the new xbox has more things SOOOO I NEEED IT AND THUS I NEED TO BUY IT AGAIN?"? WOW LOL NO one NEEDS anything. IF it was like that then ask the millions of car buyers whose cars get upgrades every 2-3 years. You guys sound like this.. I bough a 2003 (any car you want). But In 2005 they started to have standard xm or sirius, + better lights in the back + 15 more HP + a better spoiler and better suspension. Since now I feel CHEATED and I Must rebuy a New Car. Call me crazy but thats exactly how you guys sound. MS is looking to get New sales. Look at how camry and accords change things every 2 years.
This is a business not a me love you love type of thing. Just like Capcom had to pu DMC4 multiplatform. In the business world there aint no love just money.

[whengeeksgobad]

Jolly1, you're right about the resolutions being the same and the reason for hdmi exising (content protection) however, its a fact, that signals which are converted from digital, to analog, then back to digital take a hit in image quality. It's ideal to get as few of those conversions as possible, and an hdmi cable keeps it purely digital the whole time. That means that ultimately in theory the possibility for a better image quality is there, now whether or not it is or not I couldn't say. Furthermore, there is quite a difference between native and upscaled resolutions. Anything running out your component out on your x360 is upscaled to 1080p, its not native. This not so with the ps3. Again, some would say they see not difference but the potential is there.

This elite looks like a great xbox, I'm just a little bummed that it didn't come out this way to begin with. I also think it's dumb of microsoft to do anything that doesn't further exploit their biggest advantage over the ps3 - price. This new elite should go for what the premium currently goes for, and the core should go away period leaving the old premium at 300 bucks. Microsoft can afford the loss and these things would sell rather quickly at that price point. Anything that forces the reduction in price means we all win. I say screw arguing about who has a better what and we all start being pissed about having to shell out so much dough for stupid video games. Great prediction sf49er, I hope you are right!

[JOLLY1]

I can run virtua tennis at 1080P (no upscaling) when you convert, you only convert from digital to analog once. now.....if you go straight to your tv you have no conversion (in the ps3), so yes that is one less conversion, I totally agree. If you can tell the difference then that is great for you, I wish I could. I have tried!!!! Trust me. I just don't get why everyone is so tanked on this. So many people are just complaining to complain I guess.

*EDIT* To whengeeksgobad, You are almost correct. What the article says is that anygame you play can upscale to 1080p. The thing is virtua tennis is native 1080p (no upscaling required. See that's the good thing. THe 360 can do any format. Upscaled Downscaled...or even native. Virtua tennis is just the first native 1080p forthe 360. It's okay that you didn't know that. I forgive you.

*edit* *edit* I'm all out of bubble's, if anyone wants to give me any I would be glad to have more of this conversation.

*edit* *edit* *edit* It's cool man, I am not here to flame, or anything. I just like giving out facts. Some people don't like them and that's ok. I give as much info as I can, without trying to be a jerk. I love information, so I like helping people out with questions.

[ApocalypseShadow]

before tax of course:

core+120gig+hd-dvd+recharge kit+wifi=$800 dollars(no hdmi)

premium+120gig+hd-dvd+wifi+re charge kit=$900 dollars(no hdmi)

elite+hd-dvd+wifi+recharge kit=$800 dollars

and let's say you can get $150 for your 360 trade in.that will at least bring it down closer to that other system.wait,looky here.....

and then the ps3:

core+wifi=$530 dollars *estimate(switchable hard drive,web browser,free online,built in bluray player,more movie studio support,,better BC for old games,already black,motion control,rechargeable controller)

premium=$600 dollars(switchable hard drive,web browser,free online,card readers,built in bluray player,more movie studio support,better BC for old games,already black,motion control,rechargeable controller,wifi)

i mean the elite sounds cheap,but they must be slowly abandoning hd-dvd in favor of downloads and e distribution.can it be that microsoft will abandon the hd-dvd just like the xbox 1?leaving them out to dry?

will hardcore gamers snap up this latest creation and give microsoft more of their money and it still not equal the ps3's features and price for core or premium?

will they buy a system that adds feature and makes you pay more,when sony added feature to the ps2 and shrunk it and made it cost the same.same with nintendo with the ds lite costing the same as the original ds but had better lcd screens and was lighter?

what is a hardcore fanboy to do?show that sony had a future proof system by buying this new one or stay with the original and get left out in the cold with a "now system" that's not future proof?

decisions, decisions, decisions.

they had better drop the price of core and premium 360s tomorrow night

[Marriot VP]

well, looks like you nailed microsoft on that one

But of course if they did an all in one, force a format, kill their market share move like Sony perhaps they wouldn't call it diverse capitalism.

Tell me how many families can afford a 600 dollar console, or even a 400 dollar one? FOR YOU AND A FEW SELECT OTHERS IN YOUR SMALL DEMOGRAPHIC, the PS3 fits like a glove. Or for some of you, you've had to force it on to fit because you like Sony's exclusives. Either way, lobbing in every peice of hardware isn't going to win the war. How many people can you go up to "in public" and convince them to buy a console at 400 or more. How many even have HDTVs?? Sony jumped the gun technologically and by the time the PS3 is semi-affordable. The next 360 will already be out and smother the graphics and multimedia.

So for you and your band of techies, the PS3 is an incredible deal. I'm happy you've found a great console that fits you, as for the rest of the market they'll decide by the price tag.

[MoonDust]

Like you know, if you don't want wifi and Blueray you don't have to pay for it.
Xbox360 premium = 400
Xbox360 Elite = 475
Xbox360 core = 300
Want a HD-DVD player? No thanks, i can download my movies.

PS3= 500/600
Want a blue-ray player? For what i don't even have a HD TV. Ohh well, you already paid for it.

[kornbeaner]

A 20 gig 360 + 120gig HDD = $580

60 gigs + wi-fi + memory card reader + Blu-ray player + HDMI port + countless Sonyfan(boys) smiling =priceless *$600* and worth everypenny

[MEGANE]

Dont forget online gaming 4 freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[whengeeksgobad]

Look it up, anything running on 1080p component out on the 360 is upscaled, by that ANA chip they announced as their whole "secret weapon" deal near the launch of ps3. It was activated via a firmware upgrade around the same time. Here's a link:
http://www.2old2play.com/Ne...

there should be quite a few other links supporting this info as well. To be clear, upscaling is not a limitation of the software, thats resolution. Scaling or upscaling is a limitation or function (dependant upon how you view it) of the hardware.

[TheExecutive]

They will drop both the premium and core versions by 100 bucks and soon... but 479 is too much for what they are offering.

[whengeeksgobad]

*edit* Jolly I stand corrected. Ty for the mature conversation :)

[MEGANE]

so there is going to be another ring...n BILL GATES ITS THE LORD OF THE RINGS...lol

[Drew]

This much activity and only 530°? Am I missing something?

[shikwan]

It's very funny to see Sony fanboys TRY to spin this into bad news when:

FAQS:

1. Anyone who never owned an 360 as of yet will get HDMI cables, a headset, capability to stream or d/l HD movies AND a hdd 2x bigger than PS3--for almost $200 cheaper.

2.Anyone who currently owns a 360 can upgrade (not a requirement) to the 120g hdd. (Same as if you bought a Dell last year but this year's model has a bigger hdd-upgrading is a CHOICE-something PS3 owners know nothing about.)

3. If by some, chance you don't have a BRAIN and are compelled to think you NEED to upgrade to the Elite (and you feel screwed for owning a 360 and not a PS3); then by all means go buy a PS3 NOW. Do the math when you get home: $400 (360) + {$600 (PS3) + HDMI + Headset + 120Gb hdd} > $400 (360) + $479 (Elite). Not to mention all the games you've amassed on the 360, that CAN't be played on your shiny new PS3 but could still play on the Elite.

[whengeeksgobad]

You have a section called "FAQ's" where not a single question is asked. No offense, or maybe offense, I dunno, thats just funny to me. Cheers I guess man.

[Hymons]

Can't you upgrade the 60Gig in PS3 for a larger 3rd party Hard Drive?
I mean, I guess I know something, which is a little more than nothing.

Lol..

Edit: @ whengeeksgobad
True.. very true. lol

[BillKills_ Vol_1]

for FF13...thats the only reason i would want a ps3...

[Kyur4ThePain]

MS PS3! LoL

[Ps360420]

http://www.newegg.com/Produ...

PS3 USERS CAN UPGRADE FOR 82.99 IF THEY LIKE.

[whengeeksgobad]

rumors flying all over the place that its not going to be exclusive, I can only hope they are true. I'd buy a ps3 if it were cheaper, for GT, and a few others. I won't pay 600 bucks for any console period. I don't want any console manufacturer to think they they can get away with it either, because that only means the next gen would be 700 bucks. No way. I'm broke, I could barely afford the 360. If exclusives are going to be less frequent this gen, and more things go multiplatform (and I think they will), it will be the cheapest console that wins. Price>*

[Dragonopolis]

Its funny how just a little while ago last year that certain xbox 360 commenters heckled Sony fans when Sony had originally announced that the PS3 20gig would not have HDMI.

It just seems ironic that now Xbox 360 fans are now facing that very scenario with Microsoft's decision to bring out Elite. Funny, I don't see those same hecklers giving Microsoft a hard time.

I, on the other hand, do not change my position on two totally different system setups. This was bad when Sony tried to do it and it is still bad when Microsoft is trying it.

Sony saw the error of their ways....

Microsoft just alienated its user base.

Maybe this is a good Business move as Microsoft might feel confident that they have a overly loyal fan base who will just impulse buy.

Not this xbox 360 user.

I'll save my $479 for something else.

[ApocalypseShadow]

i actually agreed with a previous post of yours.microsoft shouldn't have released 2 skus.and sony shouldn't have released 2 skus.

at least nintendo didn't get in on the party and release 2 skus.

but:

how can a company release a new improved system and charge for more?not even 2 years yet?

how can they even think 179.99 for 120gig is priced right?

why even have a black version?it looks cool,but do they love the ps3 that much?by copying everything about it?just like they did with ps2 and xbox 1?

this is unheard of.drop the core,price the premium at $299 and be done with it.sucks to be an early adopter of microsoft though.cross your fingers that they won't abandon this system for 720 3 years from now.

[NextGen24Gamer]

Core 300

core plus 20 gig hard drive 400

core plus 120 gig hard drive 480

120 gig hard drive 180

360 elite 480

If you bought the premium with the 20 gig hard drive....you still own the 100 dollar 20 gig hard drive. So of course when you buy the 120 gig hard drive, you will spend more. But you still own the 20 gig hard drive.

I don't understand why anyone would complain. If you need a bigger hard drive. Sell your 20 gig drive for 80 dollars then spend 100 to get the 120 gig hard drive. I think many of you think bigger hard drive is better for games. Its not. Its mainly for people who are downloading movies frequently and people who will record tv via their 360.

For 400 dollars you can't possibly feel ripped off....You have a more powerful video game console than the 600 dollar ps3. And hopefully MS will release the hdmi adapter for those of us who have the premium but want hdmi output.

Me personally, I'm excited about the elite 360. It was actually a smart move by MS.

Why are sony fans jumping on this news as if its bad for 360 Gamers? Since when does sony fanboys care about how 360 gamers feel or think? Interesting indeed. I just feel that they feel threatened. An already superior "video" game console has just widened the gap and the "Elite" is still less expensive than the ps3. And it comes with the 60 dollar HDMI cables. WOW.

This is great news for "next gen" gamers. Keep in mind that the exsisting 360 owners bought the premium knowing it didn't come with hdmi. I just think 360 gamers are just spoiled by all the under promising and "OVER" delivering. We are spoiled. But the fact of the matter is...."we all bought the 360 "as is"...and we have all been very happy with it. MS has just up'd the game..."thats all"...Be happy with what you have. It plays the same games folks. And if you got to have the best of the best...."get the Elite".

I guess we'll see what the other big announcement is.

[Drew]

An intelligent person has actually posted in this thread? Is it too good to be true?

[TheExecutive]

I agree... I will be buying a 360 now... I was waiting for this addition to the xbox lineup....
still a 180 dollar 120gig hard drive is a little expensive dont you think?

[gogators]

a core, a premium, or an elite; any 360 will play 360 games.

New features are added every year in home electronics. I get the feeling that very few people here are AV philes. Denon, Pioneer, Onkyo, Marantz, etc change their stuff every year and that new stuff has more and better features and most of the time it's priced even higher. My Denon AVR 4800 series has been changed and upgraded several times since I bought it and everytime Denon has, my 4802 has kept playing music and managing video transover same as it did when it came out of the box.

If you bought a premium or a core and your pissed that MS has now brought out a newer version of 360, then I feel sorry for you. I really do, but guess what; your premium version plays games the same as the Elite version will. No difference except aesthetics, if black is more your color. Technology changes when you get into high-end electronics, but it doesn't mean that your current set-up has to when it does the basic important stuff, like play games. Which is what these things are suppose to do.

[TheMART]

Sony fanboys

You can cry out all you want

But I am still very happy with my white 360 with 20 GB harddrive and no HDMI. Because I don't need more space and I don't need HDMI

I play games and you aren't. You're folding @ home

Then the 360 Elite.
I can say to all of you

PWNED

For 479 dollar you get the best gaming console, with the best online service, with double the GB's HDD of the 600 dollar freaking expensive PS3 and also a HDMI. In black if you like it.

You can say whatever you want, but that must hurt Sony badly. If Sony doesn't lower it's price it's gonna get killed.

You get more for a lot less there, plus the most games. Now many PS fans will step in, just watch. Some wanted a bigger drive, HDMI so they waited for the PS3. Now that the 360 Elite has the best package, they'll buy an Elite.

@ Figboy (below)

You're calculating wrongly.
Go over here for the right comparison:

http://www.1up.com/do/newsS...

Microsoft's Xbox 360 Elite Includes:
HDMI Output
120 GB Hard Drive (available separately for $179.99)
Wired-to-controller Headset
Wireless Controller
Component Cable
Composite Cable
Price: $479.99

Sony's PlayStation 3 Includes:
Blu-ray Disc player
HDMI output
60 Gig HDD
Composite Cable
Wireless controller (with a five foot cable that charges the controller)
Wireless Online out of the Box
Free online play
Price: $599.99

What Xbox 360 Elite is Missing that PlayStation 3 has: Next-Gen disc format support: HD-DVD Add-on for Xbox 360
Wireless Internet support: Xbox 360 Wireless Adapter -- $99.99
Other Options: D-Link DGL 3420 -- $79.99
WGA54G Wireless G-Gaming Adapter -- $83.15
Charge and Play Kit for Controller -- $19.99
Xbox Live 360 12-month Gold Card -- $49.99
Total: $396.96

What the PlayStation 3 is Missing that the Xbox 360 has:
Headset for online play: Sony Ericsson Bluetooth Headset -- $109.95
(Other options: Logitech Mobile Express Headset $49.99)
Sony Computer Entertainment Component Cables -- $22.99
HDMI Cable for PlayStation 3 -- $59.99
(Other options: HDMI Cable male to male 28AWG - 10ft w/Ferrite Cores -- $7.10)
A 60 Gig Expansion for the HD -- Fujitsu 60 B 2.5" -- $64.88 (you'll also need an enclosure, thanks Eurogamer Forums)
Total: $257.81

Actual Cost of an Xbox 360 Elite with everything offered by the PS3:$849.95

PlayStation 3: Actual Cost of a PlayStation 3 with everything offered by Xbox 360:
Total: $857.80

So there you have it. Almost equally. BUT with the 360 you have the choice to cut the largest parts of the costs. You don't need a next gen videoplayer? Cut the HD-DVD drive and save 200 dollars.

Suddenly it's 650 dollars compared to 850 dollars. WHY? Because everything can be distributed digitally! Video HD marketplace and IPTV!

[Figboy]

there is no need for spin, this is sh*tty news for the loyal X Box fans that purchased 9 million 360's over the course of the past 16 months.

for potential new consumers, the elite isn't too shabby, unless you want to compare it to the PS3:

X Box 360 Elite: $479.99

includes HDMI
included HDMI cable
includes 120gb HD

to play online will cost $50 a year
if you're a movie fan, the HD DVD drive will cost an additional $199.99
if you need a Wi Fi connection (like me and my 3 other roomies do), it'll cost an additional $99.99
don't forget you need to charge your controllers: $20

Total: $849.97

60gig Playstation 3: $599.99
includes 60gig HDD
includes Wi Fi
includes Blu Ray Player
includes memory stick readers

if you have an HDTV, you'll need an HDMI cable: as low as $10 online.
if you need an additional 60gigs (to match the elite), they are as low as $80 online.

and you don't have to play for online.

Total: $689.99

you save: $159.98

this is, of course, only if you want or need things like Wi Fi and movies in HD.

i live with 3 other people. we have 4 computers, 2 Playstation 3s, 2 Playstation 2s, 2 X Boxs, and 1 X Box 360.

the built in Wi Fi for our PS3's is a godsend.

after seeing movies and games in HD, we are sold on the high def movement. we'll be getting HDTVs this summer (my roommate is getting one for him, and i'm getting one for me and my fiancee). having HDMI included in our PS3 is a bonus for that time.

60gigs has proven quite enough for me, and i still have 40gigs free, even after putting my photos, drawings, music, and videos on the hard drive. if i need more, i may pick up an additional hard drive, or i'll just plug in my fiancees external HDD and use that (it's nice being able to use any external HDD i choose, as well as keyboards, internal HDDs, mice, and headsets. and people say Sony doesn't offer choice. they may have made Blu Ray a standard, but you're free to use anything else you like on your PS3).

having played games for over 20 years, i know the basic trends and standards of the industry. each console generation, disc capacity grows, and new game experiences are able to come about due to this.

the SNES was able to create games like Pilot Wings and Mario Kart because of the added disc capicity for data, and the extra power of the console.

the PS1 was able to bring us games like Metal Gear Solid and Final Fantasy VII because of disc capacity and console horsepower.

the PS2 was able to bring us GTA3 because of the move to DVD, and the increased horsepower.

what in god's name makes people think that Blu Ray won't help in the evolution of the gaming industry? because Microsoft and Nintendo say so? the evidence is there for all to see: no matter how good compression has gotten over the last 20 years, developers always find a way to fill that free space. and it usually benefits gaming as a whole. GTA3 would not have been possible on the PS1, or SNES, or NES. fact? fact.

a game like Mass Effect is apparently maxing out a dual layer DVD and it's only a *SECOND GENERATION* 360 title! what's going to happen with games in the 360's 3rd, 4th, and 5th generation? content gets significantly cut in order to visually match PS3 games, since Blu Ray actually has the capacity to hold more game data?

Gears of War is gorgeous, but it's really short.

Resistance is good-looking, but has way more game content, yet it still fills up 16gigs on a 25gig Blu Ray disc. i wouldn't be surprised if Resistance 2 looked as good as Gears or better, but still managed to keep itself a lengthy gaming experience, thanks to more disc capacity.

don't let MS and Nintendo downplay this oversight. Nintendo may not be in too big of a rut, as their console isn't pushing the envelope, so a 9gig disc will do just fine, but i fear what MS is going to do when GTA5 comes out, and is even more ambitious than i'm sure IV will be, and it may not fit onto a DVD9 (i shudder at the thought of having to switch discs while traveling from city to city). will there solution be to download the stuff that can't fit on a DVD? do you really want to permanently give up a few gigs (probably more than 4 or 5) or your 360's HDD for GTA content, that'd fit snugly on a 25 Blu Ray? do you want to spent the hours it'd take to download that 5 gigs in the first place, while PS3 owners can just pop it in and play?

i honestly like the 360, it has some cool games that i want to play, but the PS3 is more forward thinking, and a better deal in the long run. and considering that they're both getting the same games for the most part, why not pony up the extra dough for a system that is more reliable, and doesn't require a bunch of hardware add-ons to have features the competitor has out of the box (ie, an HD player, and Wi Fi)?

i'd rather cough up the $600 up front, than find out i have to shell out more and more money to keep my 360 up to date with $50 here, and $150 there.

the 360 reminds me of my Sega Genesis each day. i loved my Genesis, but damn Sega for piece-mealing the thing, just to stay competitive.

also, i purchased my PS3 for these simple reasons (in no particular order):

1.) Blu Ray movies: more studio support, higher capacity disc means better quality audio and video can be printed on the disc.

2.) Resistance: Fall of Man

3.) Motorstorm

4.) Heavenly Sword: played it, and it was fun.

5.) Lair

6.) Ninja Gaiden Sigma

7.) White Knight Story

8.) Metal Gear Solid 4

9.) Final Fantasy XIII

10.) LA Noire

11.) Ratchet and Clank Future

12.) Uncharted: Drake's Fortune

13.) God of War 3: we know this is coming

14.) Whatever Sucker Punch is working on: i loved Sly Cooper, so i'm sure whatever they're planning for the PS3 will, at the least, be lots of fun

15.) Whatever Team Ico is working on: Ico and Shadow of the Colossus were two of the most breathtaking and beautiful experiences i've ever had playing a video game. it's already been reported they're working on something for the PS3, can't wait to see what it is.

16.) Rogue Galaxy 2: Level 5 has said that if Rogue Galaxy does well, they'd love to continue the series on the PS3. it's also been reported that White Knight Story isn't the only PS3 game they've been working on.

17.) Home: i'm really curious, and this is a very unique and interesting take on a virtual community. also, if i don't like it, i don't have to use the virtual world, and can access all the pertinent functions (like matchmaking and friends lists), from the PS3's cross media bar.

18.) Little Big Planet: who wasn't impressed at the potential of this game? it's been the talk of the gaming community since it's announcement at GDC. i personally can't wait to get my hands on it and start making levels, and playing other people's. people love to create, even those that are not artists themselves (i happen to be an artist: comics, storyboards, etc, but that's not the point).

19.) Heavy Rain: Quantic Dream surprised me with the awesome Indigo Prophecy, and after seeing what they did last year with the Heavy Rain casting call, with only a small understanding of the Playstation 3's architecture, i can't wait to see the final game next year.

20.) Online gaming is free: in order to play people online on the 360, you have to pay for it. in order to play people online on the PS3, i boot up the game, select "Multiplayer," choose a game, and i'm off. considering that i'm not big on online gaming anyway, why should i have to pay for something that i only utilize for a few hours a year ( literally spend about 10 minutes a week playing games online. i prefer single player games, but i do love co-op).

that's my 20 reasons to plunk down $600 on a PS3 instead of $479 for a 360. i'm dying to play Mass Effect, Bioshock, Fable 2, and Alan Wake as much as the next 360 fan (i don't like Halo, to be honest, so i could care less about Halo "OMFG it's Halo!" 3), but not so much that i'd forsake the 20 reasons (tailored specifically to my own personal tastes, other people won't have the same reasons as me), i got a PS3.

back on topic, this Elite thing doesn't seem like a good idea. if MS had included an HD DVD drive, and kept the price at $479, it would have been brilliant, and Sony would be hard pressed to keep from lowering the price, but as it stands, this just makes it look like Sony has had the right idea all along (including HDMI and Wi Fi, as well as a larger hard drive and a high def disc drive since the beginning, and across all SKUs).

i guess i just feel bad for that first 9 million that just *has* to feel a bit slighted by this move.

now i guess they know how some Sony fans feel when Sony pulls an equally bone-headed maneuver.

my initial reaction is that this isn't a good thing, but it's late, so i'll sleep on it, and maybe have a clearer picture of it tomorrow.

[power of Green]

We can post games and services all day. http://www.1up.com/do/newsS...

[Bullseye]

I think this is a poor option. As a 360 owner i expected a system that wouldn't swap and change within its relatively short lifetime.As a gamer my next purchase will obviously be a PS3, when price drop permits.Why would i incurr extra expense for essentially the same machine and games? Not impressed with MS on this one.

[Toolman]

I guess its good news for some, but damn whats up with the price? The price for the HDD is insane.

[Ravenator529]

This is about having a "choice"! There is a demographic of 360 gamers who have been waiting for a machine like the black 360 to be released.

So in turn, M$ is giving it to them.

But if you would have read their entire statement about the new machine, M$ is suggesting that this is more of an "enthusiasts" XBox.

Sure you have to pay for all of these extras, but if you don't want any of them "like myself", then you don't need to buy them. It's that simple.

People have a much easier time upgrading over a period of time and having a choice to do so rather than being forced to purchase things that they feel that they do not need. That same system worked for the PS2 as well. If you wanted online, then you had to buy a network adapter. If you wanted a HD, then you had to purchase one seperatley. In turn, it kept their costs down and the people who actually wanted one, could get one.

But for some reason Sony decided that this wasn't the way to go with the PS3.

The fact is that you can still play every single game and use every single function of XBox and Xbox live with the original premium 360.

But if you want HDMI and a larger HD, then that option is there for you as well.

I just don't see what the problem is here? All people want are choices. No one likes being forced into something they don't want. And that is why IMO, the PS3 has received so much hate.

[BIadestarX]

Here is why the XBox 360 hard drive is more expensive. If you guys listen to Major Nelson yesterday's show you would have more understanding of why it's the drive is more expensive and why they just don't allow you to use any hard drive like Sony does with the PS3. First of all it's a laptop hard drive. Those are more expensive than the one that the PS3 uses. The 2nd and most important thing is the security built into the harddrive. This harddrive is designed to work only for the xbox 360 and therefore is a closed environment. This may sound like a bad thing since who wouldnt want to pop any hard drive in there. Well, this is the reason why the movie industry is giving the Live Market place so much love, this is the reason why NetFlix is joining forces to bring all the movies into the market place, and this is why IPTV will be enabled for the 360 without ripping some company's rights. This is why microsoft keep saying that HDMI is not required, since the xbox 360 offers it's own security. You may never see features or most of the movies on the PS3 for the simple fact that the hard drive is openly available; no security, no nothing. So these so call restrictions and "microsoft" is screwing you, will enable the xbox 360 owners to have lots of downloadable content and the trust of the movie industry for this. And as for the PS3 ofcourse the movie industry will trust the security of the HDMI, but lets see how much trust they put in the PS3 when it comes to downloadable content. You see, it's clear microsoft was thinking about downloadable content before they even designed the 360. It's nice to be able to pop any hard drive in there.. but at what cost? IPTV? Movie Market place? I say hell no.

[pkb79]

Sony owns over half of all tv and movies and music made worldwide. I wonder which console that stuff will be available on. I guess i just have to decide if a want to watch a movie on my own or go to a virtual theater in Home with some friends from around the world.

[lilwingman]

Actually, the PS3 uses 2.5" laptop style S-ATA hard drives. Like the 360, those are also the expensive ones :P

And in regards to movie downloads, in a recent interview Phil Harrison stated that Digital Distribution was coming to the PSN, and if all Sony affiliated studios put movies up, I think most people will be satisfied. I'd be buying BDs, but for those who are interested in D.D. at least the option will be there.

[Rasputin2011]

I own the premium Xbox360 and couldn't care less about the Elite...for now....I am a man who is not made of money SO I will wait for the Elite to drop in price then snag one until then I will be playing my Xbox as usual.

[Drew]

Oh, I completely forgot to state my opinion on the whole thing. I think it's great, and if you don't need it, don't buy it. I'll be getting it day one, because I need HDMI and I'm a heavy marketplace user. Seems fair to me. =)

[NanoSplitter]

...since I did not get an answer the first time around. Those of you that are concerned about the upgrade cost of the 120GB HDD, why not spend a relatively meager $100-$170 for a 200-300GB external hard drive connected by USB? In addition to the cost savings you would also be gaining double the capacity. Is there something that the MS HDD drive can do that an external cannot (other than attach nice and snug to the console, rather than have a single small cord connecting, of course)? {NOTE: this is a genuine question, not one of the ever popular rhetorical variety!}

[JIN KAZAMA]

360: "This is MADNESS!!!!"

PS3: "maddness?? ...THIS.....IS PS3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

(Kicks the 360 into a bottomless pit!!).

[Whoooop]

300 on bluray would be NICEEEEE

[Optimus Prime]

why do you guys care so much about the 360 and the elite. since when have sony fanboys cared how 360 fans feel, or how they spend their money? hmm, its pretty odd. sony fans are in alot of fourms about the elite. you guys care way to much about a system that you hate.

[kornbeaner]

In our defense a lot of 360 fans care entirely to much of the $600 price that they refuse to pay, so it evens out.

I for one care because I plan on getting a 360 sometime in the future.
So not being a Microsoft fan to begin with I have to make sure that when I hand my money over for their product I don't get left with the taste of RIP-OFF afterwards.

[neogeo]

If there is no RING OF DEATH I wont buy it.

[Douglasp]

Oh man my g35 now has a new 306HP with builtin bluetooth navigation and better racing suspension for just 1000$ more than my last year 280hpG35.. DAMMM you INFINITY You are making me trade my last year for this year..

Or
Damm you Samsung. Last year I bought a 16mil color, 8 MS, 3000:1 contrast ratio 720p and now you have this better 2 billion color, 5ms, 8000:1 contrast ratio 1080p for just 300$ more. Damm I am going to NEED this new LCD panel and I hate Samsung cause they are making me traded in.

KIDS GROW UP. Thats exactly how you guys sound.

[kornbeaner]

but the 2 things you compare are not the same.

Cars for the most part are not meant to be a luxury item. They are meant to be driven from point A to B, and be realible while doing it. Thats why people still drive around cars from the 80's 90's and even early 2000 models. Because the basic premise of using a car is to get somewhere.

Electronics Devices like the Samsung you mention are a Luxury item. they are bought by people for 2 reasons. Entertainment or to show your status of to your friends or sometimes both. It's been known through out history that Electronic device are gonna change. Going from Vinyl to 8-track to tape to CD. 35mm to beta(didn't last)/VHS to DVD's to now Blu-Ray.

The difference is when it comes to console gaming we gamers expect our investment to last at least 5-6 years. yes consoles have a history of being redesigned, smaller PS2, a Green Xbox, but when these consoles got redesigned they came out with a smaller price then the system did at launch, to appeal to the last minute adopters. Now what Microsoft has done is not entirely unheard of, They redesigned their system and also improved it with items they deemed unnessecary not only at the time of launch but also reaffirmed this statement not more then 5 months ago when their competitors launched. The problem is they are releasing their redesigned system at a higher price then the orignal and selling one of the upgraded parts (120 HDD) for a price to it's current consumers that is not to friendly. And there is also no way to put the second upgrade part on it (HDMI port). So if you were an early adopter of the system who has a TV that support HDMI that you would like to use you have re-buy the system. This is a practice that has only made me further wait to see what else they will add to the console just so I know for sure that when I purchase system am not regretting my purchase.

That my friend is why consumers are complaining. Yes this forum would be a lot better if my fellow PS3 counterparts were not flaming their asses off, but for the most part all complaint found on this page are warranted to some extent.

[Whoooop]

but what the hell, if you have the money and the 360 is your thing!! then buy the elite version it'll make you happy..

I don't get the HDMI fuzz with premium users.. You can use a component converter to have HDMI.. correct me if i'm wrong on this one..

Ohh and another thing for the 360 users.. The crack to play ripped games on the 360 works like a charm.. :P