Epic CEO responds to claims Sony investment influenced positive PS5 comments

Sweeney insists “serious” talks started after PS5 demo.

[Futureshark]

Epic will probably have a standard Unreal engine 5 that will be used for PC & Xbox SX games, but will have a advanced set of tools specially designed for PS5 and it's SSD / architecture.
As UE5 will be used a lot, we will see those differences coming through on third party games, especially if PS5 is picked as the lead platform for development, which Epic will probably push when they send out the software.

[Cmv38]

so now there are secret tools that are exclusive? Smh. Y'all really don't understand business.

[MoonConquistador]

Yeah, it's just a play on words of the "secret sauce" everyone was laughing at with the XBone.

Don't go there

[boing1]

There are exclusive tools for the controller.

[morganfell]

So you insert the word secret then try to ridicule others for something you brought into the conversation? There would be nothing secret about Sony paying Epic to refine and adjust the U5 PS5 pipeline. Have you never used an engine? This would not be to hold other platforms back hold but instead allow the U5 PS5 pipeline to play to the PS5’s strengths and provide tools so in a very discernible manner it sets PS5 versions apart. Devs have never seen a system with the PS5s IO structure and so they need the tools that move them away from employing it like a standard storage system and allow them to easily change the way they build worlds and make their games. It isn’t rocket surgery levels of comprehension.

[Sunny_D]

Why is everyone (Xbox fanboys) assuming they want to only invest in Epic for video game? As the article states:

“The pair said the arrangement would allow them to broaden their collaboration across all of Sony’s entertainment assets. Epic’s Unreal technology has been leveraged by high profile film and television projects, most recently LucasFilm’s The Mandalorian.”

Some of you people forget (salty) Sony is more than a game company lol.

[morganfell]

@Sunny

Some people haven’t seen how they shot certain scenes in The Mandalorian.

https://youtu.be/gUnxzVOs3r...

[Tech5]

duplicate

[ForwardDude]

PS5 is the only consumer electronic device on the planet with a effective 5.5 Gb/s SSD. Xbox has more than half that. I hope Epic make custom tool for next gen SSD. That will be good for PC too when they catch up. We wouldn't want current gen SSD speed on PS5 like Xbox will ship with.

[Edito]

It's not about secret exclusive tools, it's about investing in engines to take advantage of the best exclusive tools your console can offer...

[SierraGuy]

No doubt.

[Tech5]

Futureshark -
"Epic will probably have a standard Unreal engine 5 that will be used for PC & Xbox SX games, but will have a advanced set of tools specially designed for PS5 and it's SSD / architecture."

that would only lead to confusion. considering Unreal makes regular updates, which would only lead to Epic deciding which version of UE5 to keep on supporting. which would likely be the one commonly used by developers. likely what you'll see for UE5 would be next gen support built into the engine. which they've already stated.

Epic - We spend a considerable portion of each release focusing on improvements to support all platforms so your projects can be experienced by everyone regardless of their chosen form factor. In this release, we have added support for the next generation of gaming consoles, which include Microsoft Xbox Series X and Sony PlayStation 5. In addition, iOS and Android have both seen significant enhancements to rendering and development workflows. https://docs.unrealengine.c...

[bishup25]

UE5 will have built-in next gen support and will likely also have features that will go into the gen after.
also UE4 still has a bunch of features that haven't been used in the current gen that will be seen in the next gen.

[L7CHAPEL]

the amount of probably/ maybe/ if ...
it's just astounding

[morganfell]

@Futureshark

As I posted elsewhere: it’s likely Sony did this to insure that PS5 optimizations for Unreal5 automatically take advantage of the capabilities of Sony’s machine. In this manner even low level independent users will automatically see a discernible difference between the PS5 version and any other platform. It doesn’t hold back other platforms but rather creates built in pipelines that play to the PS5s unique strengths that go beyond the normal raw power equation. Sony is basically making it easy for Unreal 5 users to do things with the engine that automatically set the PS5 versions of games apart on a whole other level. This also explains the report that the U5 demonstration that was shown didn’t require a lot of horsepower because it was using the PlayStation 5’s unique fill rate capability. People making some of these remarks concerning Sweeney being bought should probably be worried instead.

[darthv72]

Why would they do that? MS has just as much, if not more, invested in UE than Sony. You think Epic would still give MS the lower end set of tools to work with? Sony generally uses their own engines and only a few times have their studios worked with UE. You think this little drop in the bucket is going to allot them special treatment?

[morganfell]

No one said lower end set of tools. Feel free to stop misquoting and/or making up things. Developers require different tools to better utilize an I/O and storage system that no one has ever seen before. Sony engineered the PS5 a certain way for a reason and they want to make sure developers can get the very best out of it. Raw horsepower isn't enough these days. Not any more.

But now I will say it. If Sony says we want more refined tools, spend more man hours refining the PS5 pipeline and we will pay for it with an investment, that isn't giving other companies worse tools as a way to harm those companies any more than game companies sell higher priced special editions or collectors editions of titles. Want more? Pay more. Its still giving them (MS, Nintendo, etc) the best tools they could in the U5 Dev kit without hiring additional people or paying even more man hours to specialize the tool suite for them. Other companies are still getting the same suite they would have if Sony hadn't invested in Epic. Is it that hard to comprehend? Or are you just attempting to cloud what is a very uncomfortable issue. I am so glad you have given up the objectivity claims and really let it fly in this thread. Thank you.

[carlosjrix]

What? Lol

[ocelot07]

I find it funny that certain people seem to think Sony need to pay the likes of Epic to say nice things about the PS5 lol.

If that was the case surely they would of asked epic to say how great fortnite is going to run on the ps5. You know possibly the world's most popular game right now?

Sony don't need to invest 250mil to make epic say nice things in hope for more sales. The playstation brand sells its self. Has done for 25 years and will be the best selling console next generation.

[Marquinho]

Tim Sweeney's behaviour on social media has been very erratic lately. Looks like he really needs advisory.

And this post of him sounds very implausible to anyone familiar with investments of this magnitude... or probably to anyone in general.

[NeoGamer232]

I find it funny that gamers are looking at conspiracy theories and agendas for anyone making a comment about the next generation of consoles.

Maybe all these engine designers and developers making comments actually are just trying to promote the next generation products and telling gamers what they see. Both consoles have a lot of advantages over the current generation. It seems to me like gamers are looking at all this way too closely.

The comments to almost every developer or engine maker article are a mix of, "See this person is God and they know everything" or "See this person works for [MS or Sony] in some way and therefore cannot be trusted". Maybe they are just people making comments based on what they are working on and how they feel this next gen of consoles are going to be..

[subzero1992]

The keyword here is "Serious talks" started after the PS5 demo. Which mean casual talks started before the demo. Basically Sony like the response the demo got and loved the way Epic praised PS5. So they made good on their casual "investment" talks.

[MoonConquistador]

Whatever makes you sleep at night.

Jeez, it's like playing Whackamole. One fanboy rumour gets knocked on the head and another pops up almost instantly

[rainslacker]

And I suppose for all those years they were working with epic on their engine, they were talking about it too?

It would appear epic has had quite a bit of hands on time with the ps5. Could just be that they actually did just like what it had to offer.

Also, I fail to see why epic would tarnish its reputation on the hope that a handshake deal would get them a sum of money they could get elsewhere if they really needed it. Sweeney himself could put this much money up and still keep his multiple ferraris. But why you your own money when you can use someone else's.

[throne]

this isn't even taking anything away from series x, it's got its 12 tf fine, but having some big shot dev not praise the 12 tf sets them off, when he's said nothing bad about the series x but because sony did a great job on it's own design cant be allowed

[Rachel_Alucard]

Tim praised every Sony console since PS3. No surprise he'd do it again.

[Imortus_san]

Yes I remember them said Unreal was only possible with the Power of the PS3 and the BluRay, because the game had 6 months or a 1 year exclusive release on PS3, them it came out on the Xbox 360 DVD with betteer Frames, Split Screen for two players and a lot more levels on 1 DVD.

So yes Epic was totally Paid that time and is this as well, only blind people fail to see that.

[DJStotty]

They used to hype xbox, and worked with Microsoft on the xbox tech when they were bringing Gears of war to the console.

This situation is the same thing with a different player.

[Minute Man 721]

Yes but Unreal ran better on the 360, is it really hype?

[DJStotty]

@Minute

Hype, is when you talk about a certain console, and praise features, nothing to do with whether it runs better.

Hype = "extravagant or intensive publicity or promotion."

It ran better, because Epic and Microsoft collaborated on the design of the console for Gears of War.

https://www.gamasutra.com/v...

Quotes :

"Epic founder Tim Sweeney argued for the inclusion of a hard drive as standard for the system."

"a mock-up of the game with 256mb of RAM was key in making Microsoft decide to ship its next-gen hardware with 512mb."

"Epic Games vice president Mark Rein has been discussing his company's interactions with Microsoft over Gears Of War and the Xbox 360 hardware"

[boing1]

It's the old case of 'He said something positive so he must've been payed off' vs 'He said something negative so competition must've payed him off'. People often see only those two options nowadays. For some, it's unbelievable that a head of Epic, maker of amazing engine technology, could be genuinly excited about next frontier, which Sony enables them to explore with PS5.

[Kratos_Kart2007]

or maybe the PS5 is a great machine?? Grow up people...

[MoonConquistador]

Well said Kratos.

Much like the PS 4, PS 3, PS 2 and the PS 1.

There's a pattern here but I can't quite put my finger on it.

Oh, the PSP, Vita and PSVR were also great machines.

[Blaze929]

He acts like we don't know how business works. "Serious talks" - so they been talking before the PS5 demo, exactly as people thought. You don't start and close a $250 million deal between 2 large companies in 7 weeks.

So they oversold in order to close the deal.

[rainslacker]

I'm thinking $250 million sounds an awful lot like the seed money for a new AAA game, and the staff to make it.

If that's the case, then its very possible that there were some discussions about that game, but nothing serious about sony funding it until after the demo....and I'll further assume it's because until after the demo, they weren't ready to pursue production in full.

The reason I assume this is because of the amount, which seems arbitrary for anything else other than general investment, which epic doesnt need. Couple this with epic having a full game production staff, but tencent having enough control to not allow them to make anything that isnt GaaS, and fortnite likely not taking a whole production staff anymore, but tencent isnt releasing capital to do anything else.

If this is the case, then I doubt anything that cerny did would make Sony just say yes or no to investing in this. They're still responsible to their own shareholders, and Sony could do a lot with marketing the ps5 with that kind of money. I doubt the entire first few years of console marketing would even reach half that amount.

[morganfell]

I think this is about the U5 PS5 pipeline. Sony wants companies to have to go out of their way to intentionally retard U5 PS5 games in order to have parity. I think Sony wants U5 based games next generation to simply run away with the show, simply be better, and make it easy for developers to implement an I/O and storage system unlike anything they have ever seen so that this ease provided by the tools actually alters the way they design a game.

[rainslacker]

Seems like a lot to spend on that, particularly since the PS5 APi's aren't a far departure from the PS4's. Plus, I think Epic may put that into the engine if Sony just made it themselves without the extra money involved.

Don't get me wrong. I'm sure that Sony is working with Epic to make things as fluid as possible for devs....I've even heard that from several devs already. But while I haven't heard anything to imply it's true, the number is a nice round number that I've heard used for seed money for new big projects and studio acquisition + production costs, or in Epics case, probably the funds to hire on the staff to do so, since Tencent does have a good bit of control over their current cash flow, and isn't interested in investing in anything but GaaS games.

It's extrapolating several things that seem unrelated, but Epic isn't known to not want to make something good when they have a good idea. Despite what some people may say about them, before the Tencent acquisition, they were usually pretty creative and made a lot of good games over the years.

[rlow1]

Please, to say their wasn't some courting going on. I'm sure nobody was influenced before hand. Poof the deal just happened and we had no clues prior.......Yeah.

[GamingSinceForever]

The general idea that Sony needed to pay for promotion is ridiculous when you think about it. Why would they even need to do that? MS will not outsell Sony.

[neomahi]

Didn't Epic help develop the PS5, more specifically the SSD? Why would they not want to talk about it if they helped create it?

[SaveFerris]

The cheque was in the mail. Tim was just doing his part /s
Perhaps it is to get Epic to help with software tools and maybe more Unreal engine games for the console?

[Father__Merrin]

According to many on n4g they laid claim that Sony bought those comments. Obviously this is a pack of lies it doesn't change the fact that Sony is number 1 and that the PS4 has been so good the PS4 userbasewill upgrade to ps5 and not Xbox series X.

[N4realGMRZ]

Does anyone believe this PR garbage by Tim?

[Yodasfavoritesoda]

It makes sense from a business perspective to talk positive about an investors product. It wasn’t like he was saying anything crazy or even trashing Xbox. He didn’t but I’m sure he is very well aware of the fact the series x is gonna outperform the ps5. There was a little bit of marketing bs from him when he lied about the epic China tweet that showed a 2080 max q outperforming the ps5 but I’m sure that might have had something to do with NDAs

[derek]

Why are some so bothered by Epic talking positively about the ps5.

[RamRod88]

I don't think anyone should, but you can say the same thing happens when devs talk positively about XSX.

[jznrpg]

But the difference is it’s misty MS devs talking about Xbox and more outside devs talking about PS

[RamRod88]

I didn't realize Blooper Team, Codemasters and several other devs were affiliated with MS. Let's not forget the former Sony Dev of 14 years praising the XSX, that was never made it's way to n4g. I mean, considering Sony is the market leader, it makes sense devs would praise them more than MS.

[Petebloodyonion]

So I'm supposed to believe that discussion, purchase, etc for 250 000 000$ all happened in less than a month?
Ok you says so!

[derek]

What are you insinuating Pete? That Epic is lying about their opinion on the PS5 a system they had influence on when it was being created and produced their first demo of UE5 with? Sony invested in them so they're lying about how much they like the ps5s architecture?

[Petebloodyonion]

Read the title and read my post.
“ Sweeney insists “serious” talks started after PS5 demo.“
And don’t even have to defend my points you already acknowledge that they were in bed before.

[VariantAEC]

@Petebloodyonion
"...Don’t even have to defend my points you already acknowledge that they were in bed before."

Option 1: Obviously Sony never had any UE3 games on PS3 or UE3/4 games on PS4. In fact before the Unreal Engine 5 tech demo on PS5 Sony never heard of Epic or Unreal Engine before.

Or option 2: Maybe just maybe Sony and Epic had heard of each other before and Sony was and still is trying to get better engine support to their console knowing full well that back in the day Unreal Powered games ran like garbage on PS systems. Still as Sweeny said the serious talk about this investment only started happening after Epic created the demo and showcased it for Sony. This option requires further elaboration from you.

Option 3: You're fantasy world is 100% on point, obviously Epic needed the cash from Sony. Sony money-hatted support, but couldn't pay Epic until now because Sony cheap as ••••! Obviously Sony being cheap as •••• still managed to convince the mighty Epic that they could scrape together $250 million in pennies if and only if Epic could praise PS5 because this is how real business works. No explanation required, it only makes sense to degenerate fanboys and as a result makes perfect sense to anyone who dislikes Sony and PlayStation.

Did I miss anything?

[aquamala]

he didn't say there were no talks before the demo lol, so when did the non-serious casual $$$ talks start?

[OC_MurphysLaw]

Look, reality is Sony and Epic had a relationship prior to the investment...hence their working with Sony specifically around the tech demo. That partnership was a great boost for Sony and they realized investing in Epic would be a smart move...it was and is. I think it is safe to say moving forward Epic will always have some favorable things to say about their investor...doesn't mean it isn't true but I think its pretty clear we are not going to hear them come outright against any decisions from Sony.

[DiRtY]

“Serious investment discussions followed from the Unreal Engine 5 demo we showed on PlayStation 5. I guess they liked it!”

You don’t close a 250 million USD deal in 4 weeks, though.

What do you guys expect him to say „Yeah, they have paid us big time“ Not gonna happen.

[Mister_Wolf]

Look, buy the system you want to buy, then shut the fuck up. All this console war dick measuring is pathetic.

[Minute Man 721]

Most of us just do this for fun....

[Rhythmattic]

If that is the bar you set for fun, I hate to think what people may consider trolling Trollops....

Mwhahahahahahahhahaa

[343_Guilty_Spark]

I won't care if MS gets WB.

[sushimama]

I must admit, that would be an epic aquisition if they managed to get them. They won't own the IP, but the studios themselves are serious quality.

[rlow1]

It will interesting to see what those studios could unleash if MS were to pick them up.

[nowitzki2004]

They need them

[XxINFERNUSxX]

Poop, that is all.

[Thundercat77]

The Unreal 5 PS5 demo totally destroyed Xbox fans confidence.

Then it was the big mega success of TLoU2 despite the biggest hate campaign ever with a video game.

And we haven't even started next gen yet.

[RamRod88]

I don't think anyone is feeling destroyed by a 3rd party engine tech demo that Xbox's own 1st party studios will utilize.

[derek]

Sorry Ramrod, xbox fans have talked more about the UE5 demo than Sony or its fans have. Xbox fans having been trying to discredit the positive comments Epic made about the ps5 architecture ever since.

[MetalGearsofWar]

I don't see any Xbox fans

[RamRod88]

Yeah no sorry, xbox fans really have no issues with the UE5 demo or what epic said. Xbox fans only say anything when Sony fans claim everything done in the tech demo is only possible on ps5. Which I've seen numerous times on here.

[timotim]

This sounds like Sweeney is damage controlling. The praise was suspect from the beginning, come to find out they have a deal in place where money has been exchanged...its not a stretch to put together that one tends to praise another when they want something from them. His words here does nothing to change that.

[sushimama]

Dude you're seriously crazy and delusional. Keep speculating my son

[Silly gameAr]

Well, gamers are the most knee jerk reaction/sensitive bunch of people on the net, so Sweeny (or anyone else) should be surprised by the claims, We're all detectives and tech geniuses, and we know better than even the people who make the games and close the deals.

[rlow1]

Lol, so true!!!

[JesusBuiltmyHotrod]

People on the internet are pathetic, get a life.

[Zodiac]

This whole thing is a shit show lol. It’s all clearly business - the whole damn industry is - and it’s a controversy because nobody can actually come out and say just that - obviously. Holes are fun to dig, though. Sweeney needs to shut up.

[littletad]

Simple logic, if someone invests millions into your company, you're going to praise them to high heavens. Sony fans trying to spin this is hilarious.

[derek]

They didn't just randomly praise the ps5. They made a demo of their newest game engine on it and praised the capability of the machine. So it seems you think you know better than them I suppose.

[littletad]

Sure, enjoy your spin.

[CaptainCook]

We believe you Tim Sweeney /s

[DEEHULK88]

They own 1.4 percent of the company and I don't understand what the big deal is.

[Wulfer]

Bridges for sale get your bridges here. I have some swamp land in the back too...

[WelkinCole]

Again over a demo on the PS5 and Tim's praises of the PS5 SSD and architecture.

It is amazing how something so simple can cause xbox fans to lose their minds.

Tim didn't even say anything bad about the x1x. His great sin according to xbox fans is him not mentioning the X1X about a demo on the PS5.

Seriously xbox fans. You guys really need to grow up.

[Harryvok]

I think people worry about this a bit too much. Even though nice things were said about PS5, they didn’t make bad remarks about XSX. People getting a bit butthurt I think.

With the use of Unreal Engine in movies and tv now, for a huge entertainment company like Sony, it makes perfect sense. And if they can get any exclusive advantages for PS5 along the way, why wouldn’t they? They’re a business.

[tontontam0]

Meanwhile..
MS investments influenced negative Ps5 comments.
Devs can't say anything about the xbox series x because they know that the supposedly "TFLOP advantage" will barely show in their games.

[arminukxbox]

Epic got marketing deal with Sony they not going to say other console will be better than ps5

[_dangerclose_]

Oh so the investment came about as a result of the demo. Looks like the fanboys attacking Sony jumped the gun and got it wrong yet again. Really looking forward to seeing the results of this great partnership.

[Harambee]

The level of biasness, IQ and delusions in here is astounding. All i can say is yesterday is not tomorrow and nothing beats hardwork. Keep trying even if they say negative things about you, keep trying and one day you'll eventually surpass them.

[Telecharger]

thanks for the information very helpful

[PyroMessiah86]

Epic were paid off. That much is obvious.