PS4 vs Xbox One: Sony’s in Trouble, Not Microsoft

A year into the PS4 vs Xbox One debate, it's time to look past the consoles and at the larger issue. And Microsoft has the advantage.

[norhavic]

thanks this awesome

[TheWatercooler]

So much wrong with this artice I don't eve know where to begin

[LeCreuset]

I do. At the beginning:

"It’s time for video game fanboys to stop pretending to be business people."

Proceeds to rehash the same tired "Sony's going under" argument that fanboys have been hoping will give them a default win in the console war, for at least two gens now.

[fr0sty]

While also ignoring the fact that every division they have is actually doing better than they were at this time last year, despite them still having operating income losses. Even their mobile division has better sales vs. last year, and that is the division that is losing them the most money right now.

[XBLSkull]

Microsoft operates way, way in the green, and Sony operates significantly in the red, it isn't exactly new news, it has been known for a while.

the PS4 vs Xbox One doesn't need to be in this articles title though, "Sony is in trouble, not Microsoft" would have been a better title. At least Sony has the PlayStation brand they can sell off before the ship sinks, I could see Amazon or Facebook buying it.

[UltimateMaster]

Yes, they do need to stop pretending being business people. He can't even get his numbers straight. He doesn't even know the difference between revenues, gross profit and ACTUAL net profit. Net profit is how much the company makes after they subtract the operative cost.
Huge fail on the article.

BTW: Total Xbox console sales were 2.4 million, growing 102%, and Xbox One launched in 28 new markets.
http://www.microsoft.com/in...

Taking from the same link provided in the article. So you can't say it's not in most countries anymore, it ain't selling all that well.
Taking from Total Xbox sales meaning Xbox One and Xbox 360.

I don't know what the author was thinking of accomplishing here beside looking dumb, but whatever.

[UltimateMaster]

@XBSkull

Sony can spin-off the PlayStation brand as an independent company and it would be successful.

If anything, it's PlayStation that is keeping Sony afloat.

I've talked how Xbox would be better off as a spin-off from Microsoft, but so would PlayStation be in a better position.

[SilentNegotiator]

This is a stupid argument. By this article's logic, an Xbox that sold only 12 systems wouldn't be in any trouble whatsoever if Microsoft was still making profit.

Trying to compare two gigantic corporations as a whole as a means of discussing the health of their individual products is idiotic.

[sonarus]

i don't know if the article is wrong. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Truth however is that the evidence that we are seeing isn't really supporting the prediction however, that could easily change. This particular price drop where the Xbox is priced lower than PS4 for the first time will be very very telling in terms of Microsoft's fortunes this generation.

However, Sony remains in the enviable position of being able to respond to Microsofts price drop to remain competitive. For the longest we have been hearing how Xbox has the better games the better cloud the better internet bla bla bla but somehow nothing has changed for them. Now they have the lower price but eventually what matters is that will gamers perceive the Xbox one as representing greater value.

[xer0]

It's definitely written by a fanboy...

No mention of how much Microsoft is losing because of freebies, discounts and pricing the console cheaper within the first year.

[miyamoto]

Introducing the new
Xbox One
#pleasebuyme

[morganfell]

@LeCreuset,

You nailed it. There is so much hypocrisy in the statement you listed:

"It’s time for video game fanboys to stop pretending to be business people."

Does this person at dailygame.com not see the irony in their writing this line? Are they suddenly businessmen?

[ragnalamb]

First of all, the guy writing this article IS pretending to know business, its obvious he isn't.

However, and Im not a business expert either, but sony losses are not a real problem for playstation brand. Sony corp is divided for a good reason... if something doesnt work, the close/sell it, like VAIO division. And ultimately, if all divisions end to be a mess, the can be a game company... just like nintendo, and still would be in a good consumer position.

Hope they can make things work. Ive always liked sony products in general since my firs walkman, they are top quiality, expensive, but the are woth the spend.

[Picnic]

The only thing that's massively wrong is 'Microsoft winning the long-term war'.
The Xbox One might be a bit like the PS3 was to Sony- sales figures up to half that of the previous generation (alhough I think it'll be more like two thirds instead) but also a fight back to popularity again through being humbler, more generous and even potentially having more exclusives than the competition (not including Nintendo).

Microsoft already kind of won a war - all the Xbox Live subscriptions going right back to 2001 raking in lots of money without much to the player in terms of free games in return. Microsoft deserved for this to be a rougher ride this time. Their Xbox 360 strategy had become loose, a mix of the casual and the die hard Microsoft fan just like Nintendo pulled with the Wii- plus with RROD. It seems that players sometimes think 'Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me'.

[Dirkster_Dude]

Well I can begin with saying there is nothing wrong with this article. It is an opinion piece. By definition it is an opinion based on accurate facts. Sony is losing money even if they are not losing as much money as before. Microsoft is making money and has billions on hand in ready cash to make more money. The whole - which console is better because 1 console or the other has better games or is more powerful is pointless since it is the company that has to win to stay in business NOT necessarily the PS4 or XB1. The PS4 helps Sony stay in business, but this is a business where Sony will not be able to make a real profit for years no matter whether they tell you they make profit off of each PS4 sale. That only relates to hardware not the people who put it together or the marketing or sales costs or the shipping, etc.

[Ducky911]

UltimateMaster

You're numbers are also being reported in a way that is off. The Xbox (both One and 360) sold 2.3 million units that quarter. Not the entire year. So the actual to date numbers will be much higher. It will do fine in the long run just like Sony did fine in the long run up against the 360. And as with the 360 and PS3, in two to three years I'm betting we will have very different consoles than the ones we originally thought we were buying due to more efficient use of the hardware and better software technology (example: Who remembers the blades on 360?). So right now, it's not really anyone's victory, although victory is a stupid concept in the "console war." Who knows what could happen. But if I had to make an educated guess, I would say that neither is going to go away and that both companies are going to keep doing dumb and awesome things.

[IGiveHugs2NakedWomen]

While Sony basks in high PS4 sales results, the number of must-have exclusives Sony’s negotiated is surprisingly small considering the console’s "13-million-plus install base. Furthermore, Sony suffered a massive $806 million loss during the previous quarter. And that was lower than investors had initially feared.

By comparison, Microsoft announced revenue of $23.20 billion in Q3.

Those revenue results have a direct relationship to video games, and it’s foolish to think otherwise."

Of course the author "conveniently" failed to mention a few things:

1.The PlayStation Division is more profitable than the Xbox Division

2.Sony's losses are a direct result of selling off it's computer division and restructuring it's electronics division

3.Sony is not in trouble since it has 149 billion dollars in assets

4."According to a recent SEC report, Microsoft's Xbox division revenue is now up to $1.7B annually, because of the Xbox One, but its costs are up to $2.1B, also because of the Xbox One. That’s yielded a collection of startled headlines about how Microsoft has dropped the ball with their new console by losing $400M already."

http://www.forbes.com/sites...

5. "Buoyed by strong sales of the latest PlayStation 4 and the rollout of games and content for its network services, Sony Computer Entertainment CEO Andrew House hopes he can again raise the division's profit forecast for the year to end-March. Sony pushed up that forecast in July to 25 billion yen ($230 million) from 20 billion yen."

http://www.reuters.com/arti...

6.(These figures is from 08/12/2014)
"We just announced that the PlayStation 4 has sold through more than 10 million units worldwide –- and more than 30 million PS4 games have been sold –- since its launch less than nine months ago."
(So using the current numbers as a guide, 13.5 million consoles/More than 35 million games sold)

http://blog.us.playstation....

7. No one knows exactly how many Xbox One consoles have been sold. No one knows how many Xbox One games have been sold. Microsoft hasn't released any numbers at all. What's with all the secrecy? Are the numbers that bad when comparing them to the PS4?

8. Microsoft is now losing money on each Xbox One that it sells

Yes Sony has it's troubles, but they are far from going bankrupt. On the other hand, if sales of the Xbox One don't pick up, Microsoft is going to have a gaming problem on it's hands.

[Ps4andxb1]

The XB1 sales aren't low.

You've got caught up in the Sony fanboy talk that states "if xb1 sales are lowER than the ps4's, then the xb1 is a disaster".

It is fact that the xb1 sales have been doing extremely well.

[redwin]

The headline reads Sony is in trouble not microsoft. We do know that the Xboxone division is loosing money, but as he mentioned, Sony has bigger sales and less exclusives in proportion to sales and exclusives on Xbox one. And I do feel like Sony just wants to do nothing because they feel like they dont need to do anything. They might think that they don't have to do anything because they are selling well as it is. Let's see, share play can be turned off by developers when Sony first said they couldn't, Driveclub was a launch dessaster, given its argumentative, the UI and its updates are very shaky. MS can not get away with any of that, we know that. What do we hear in return? I get more free games and I get 1080p. Yes, I feel like Sony thinks that they have to do nothing, because they are sony and they will sell anyway. And they won't spend any money because the other divisions are loosing money. That is what I take from the read.

[Death]

Ugh, you are seeing what you want to see. Microsoft didn't lose 400 million, if you look at their financial statement the made 900 million in the division. The higher costs they incurred cost them 400 million which took the number from 1.3 billion to 900 million. You are separating revenue generated by platform instead of looking at Xbox as a whole.

The Playstation is not more profitable either and has very little relevance to Sony's bottom line. Only gamers thing Playstation is Sony's main revenue source. The reality is gaming has the least profit margin within both companies. Sony makes the bulk of their money within their financial division which is credit and insurance. Camera's have a very good profit margin too. Their movie business is up and down. The cost of revenue for Playstation is very high. What fans easily forget is Sony incurs a loss with every one of the 13 million PS4's they sell. Software and services need to make up the loss.

[feedthereaper]

You got one small detail wrong.... when the massive loss was not as big as originally feared, you forgot to mention that what was ORIGINALLY feared was actually a lot, lot LOWER than they originally said and suddenly with barely a few weeks before revealing results they raised their losses projections massively so that when the huge loss came out, it then looked to be "lower" than they feared!

In other words, its the same as saying "I think we are aiming to cut our losses and only lose £10!" and then a week before results saying "Actually, we think we will lose about £1,000!!!" then announcing the results as "Well, we only lost £980 so its not as bad as we feared after all, so lets all relax and not panic!"
The actual fact is that the tactic has conned casual media and gamers who will trumpet it as a turning point, but for the investors who know their business, its just a cheap trick to plaster over a major problem and prop up the business for another 3 months.

[BitbyDeath]

@ps4andxb1, they sold more or less than 2 million consoles in a 6 month period. That includes launching in 30 more countries and yes China too, that is extremely low.

http://cdn.arstechnica.net/...

[KirbysDump]

Dont be silly

[WilDRangeRfc]

Sony sell PS4 at a loss MS makes a small amount on each X1 you are deluded and your links are BS,Sony went from 168 billion to around 16 billion and they are in serious trouble,the Xbox division is worth more than Sony alltogether,MS made more in 3 months than Sony are worth around 20 + billion,you keep living with your head up your arse but deal with it MS>Sony it's not even close pal

[WilDRangeRfc]

Only on this site would people agree with your deluded bullshit

[DarkZane]

@WilDRangeRfc

Sony doesn't sell the PS4 at a loss. They're making profits from it and they can also afford to match a price drop from microsoft if they need to.

However they don't need to, the PS4 fly off the shelves and despite that price drop from Microsoft, the PS4 is still gonna win November and December.

[Kayant]

"But more than likely it’s an opportunistic and proactive decision to win the “marathon” as Microsoft has called it rather than “the sprint.” - Newflash the marathon is over XB1 is never going to catch up in WW sales, it's a smaller brand than PS4 and PS4 already outsells it in almost every country both are in.

"Those revenue results have a direct relationship to video games, and it’s foolish to think otherwise." - Really now. Oh you're just trying to push an agenda here. Please how many years in a row have the be losing money and the PS is still fine.

"In addition, Sony’s nabbed some high-profile exclusives, most notably timed exclusivity on some Destiny DLC. Though Destiny itself hasn’t been the mega hit Sony (and Activision) had hoped it would be, the agreement still has political clout.

And yet over the long term, none of that may matter. Microsoft is frankly in a better position" - Looool Based on what exactly?

How has the mountains of cash helped MS for three generations. Hint: not so much they have never won one yet and have already lost the current one in terms of WW sales.

"While Sony basks in high PS4 sales results, the number of must-have exclusives Sony’s negotiated is surprisingly small considering the console’s 13-million-plus install base" - What is install base got to with the release of exclusives. Games take about 3 years to make they are not going to suddenly take least to make because install base is increasing at a high rate.

This opinion piece is just full of so much wrong and doesn't hide it's agenda for flamebait well.

[avengers1978]

MS money also hasn't helped the surface be the number one tablet, or bing the number one search engine, or the zune the number one MP3 player, or windows phones...

[Ju]

If Destiny wasn't a mega hit - given the 5 N4G trolls might rip it apart vs. the millions who actually bought the game - then I don't know what was. It is the biggest selling new franchise this year.

And DC was a disaster, right? Despite the fact it probably sold 2x-3x of FH2 (counting digital sales). Yet again, a handful of N4G trolls want to make us believe otherwise.

[Death]

Fanboys care about being number one in sales. Companies care about running a profitable business. Investors care about getting a return on their investment.

Surface is not the number one selling tablet. Xbox One is not the number one selling console. Both are housed within the same division at Microsoft and the division is making a profit.

[WishMeWell259]

Small amount of exclusives...

two words...naughty and dog

Typical xbox comment: They are so overhyped.
My comment everytime: Well you say that because you dont have them.
With studios like naughty dog and other 1st party studios sony has. Xbox has crap and wont compete once sonys studios starts generating titles.

[Utalkin2me]

If you're going to troll, at least get your English right.

[kenshiro100]

Lol, Sony in trouble...

This author must be drinking from that spiked koolaid again.

And here comes those armchair analysts in N4G again....

[Death]

If Sony isn't in trouble, what do you call losing money annually and having your stock reduced to junk status? Sony has been in trouble since 2008 selling off assets to keep even more investors from bailing. They now rent space in the building that houses their HQ instead of owning it. If the company is losing money, where do you think profit from all their divisions go? How will Sony upgrade PSN servers if they struggle to pay the electric bill? The companies overall health has a direct and very significant impact on each division within it.

[4me2]

@Death

Well, will all know that as whole MS id doing better than Sony but "Console" is only a part of their total business.

MS accumulated huge cash reserves to the fact that for very long time had virtually a monopoly in regards to PC/OS and Office, but now outlook is changing. Growth of Apple, sales of PCs down every year cut significantly into MS profits. Governments and companies,schools switching from both Windows and Office do alternative choices (f.e. China, Holland and even branches of US Government). In their new vestures (i.e. cloud and phone/tablet) MS no longer has MONOPOLY, they have to compete (Goggle, Apple, Amazon, Oracle Rackspace .....). The IT world is changing.

The worst part is when author says "MS has money". What kind of statement is that. Maybe when you 15 you think that gaming is most important thing in MS business vision and they will put billion after billion into console to make kids happy.
MS sign 5B/5Y deal with NFL to promote tablet and XBOX brand. They spent more than 1B (unplanned) at XBO launch last year, 2B for MineCraft. If these investments wont bring profit what do you think investors gonna say? After all MS is publicly traded company and they have obligations towards investors.
They did not get rich by mindlessly spending money because if they do, eventually, they you will run out the money to spend.

Gaming is a business for both MS and Sony and they will be in gaming as long they see light at the end of the tunnel(profit), and not because somebody says "they have money".

[kenshiro100]

BX81 - Sony is not losing money as a whole. Please stop spreading that crap around. There are divisions that are doing well, while some have their own set of issues.

[strangeaeon]

Yes, they are. Do some damned research.

[kurruptor]

Uh yes Sony as a whole is losing money. What are you smoking?

Their gaming division is not losing money. There's nothing to worry about.

[Magicite]

Sony’s in Trouble, Not Microsoft.

Xbox's in Trouble, Not Playstation.

Ill be honest - I never cared for Sony, but Im pretty certain, no matter what happens with it, Playstation will be fine.

[solidmasta]

Title is stupid here that is microsoft vs sony not xbox one vs ps4

[WishMeWell259]

This guy was complaining about everyone fighting over what is what but he is literally doing it in his article.

Playstation is no where near in trouble. And whether they drop the price on their consoles are not is up to them. You want us to stop pretending to be businessmen for a second? Well You brought up all this marketing crap and I dont see any evidence that you really are one. They always do a price drop around the holiday season so more people buy. Xbox has to drop because it basically has too, They arent selling, there is no demand for them. PS doesnt have to I can see sony lowering the price because it happens all the time, its cheaper now to make, and to keep the ball rolling stay on top. But they honestly dont have to because there is a demand for it. Why is there a demand for it? because it is overall a better system for gaming. Every game runs better on PS4. The Support is great and Plus is way better then live. Which last generation thats all fanboys were talking about was xbox was better because of live.
Now you brought up EA Access. You get to play every EA games for a monthly sum. If you ever heard of Playstation Now, it is a monthly service you can get that plays EVERY SINGLE GAME FROM EVERY SINGLE PLAYSTATION. I dont understand the hype of this EA access when PS Now comes ill ill be playing Battlefield or any other EA game, or ANY other game I want.
PS is fine, and they can do whatever they want as long as they continue to still do what they are doing

[BattleAxe]

"Playstation is no where near in trouble"

He wasn't saying that Playstation was in trouble, he was saying that Sony is in trouble, there is a difference. Although, if Sony continues to have huge losses like they've been having over the past 5 years, then Playstation will be in trouble, or Sony will spin off the business to allow it to be profitable on it's own.

[Muzikguy]

This title is such flamebait. Can't say PS4 vs XB1: Sony's in trouble because it's talking about 2 completely different things! >_<

[Eddie20101]

Don't trust any site that doesn't allow responses to their articles.

Starts off calling out fanboys and by the end of the article sounds like one himself. Slanted comparisons and miss information.

[ChrisW]

I'm going to make an analogy: This PS4 vs Xbox One war is like the initial Blitzkrieg.

[Retroman]

@Norhavic

are-you-SERIOUS!!!!!!
nothing-but-flamebait.
if-you-notice-in-another-arti cle-title-"Microsoft-in-lo st-cause-with-console"
which-one-will-you-be-gullibl e-for???
neither-is-true-or-solid-fact s.

editors-LOVE-a-sucker-like-yo u.

spacebar-broke.........

[BattleAxe]

Not a particularly well worded article, but I agree with it for the most part. Sony as a whole is trying to fight their way back to profiability with an $806 Million loss last quarter, while Microsoft is pulling in $4-$6 Billion in net income every quarter.

Microsoft just has more financial resources available, and they also have Windows OS, which is used globally. If they ever manage to leverage the user base of Windows PCs, then they will reach heights that Sony could only dream of.

Sony needs to think bigger, beyond their traditional console business. A smart decision would be to use GaiKai on open platforms, as it was original intended, to attract users from around the world on PC and Mac.

Since Sony is one of the largest music publishers in the world, another smart decision would be to have an online store similar to iTunes, where they could sell music by way of MP3 downloads, and similar to Steam, where they could sell video games downloads. By sticking with their own hardware, they are severely restricting themselves.

[cooperdnizzle]

@ At ashcroft.. It is not you're ass its your ass. Maybe you should read a book?? Up you're ass would be up you are ass. Funny stuff on n4g.

[ashcroft]

He said your my idol... it's you're my idol. Clearly you don't know who I was responding to and you made a mistake.

If you're gonna call someone out, make sure you know who that person was. Otherwise, you're the one that looks like the ass.

[cooperdnizzle]

Yep,. guess that was my bad. LOL

[ashcroft]

It's actually my bad, I should have at least put in a mention as to who I was replying to...it's all good.

I know when to use your and you're... it really bugs me when some don't. Being a grammar Nazi is hard work man.

[Neonridr]

The only major concern for Sony as a whole is the fact that even though the Playstation 4 is extremely successful, the company is still losing money each and every year. Too many other divisions aren't performing as well as they would hope.

[Volkama]

+ DriveClub still doesn't work. That's gotta top the agenda at the board meetings.

[Neonridr]

I'm pretty sure the profitability of the company as a whole is more paramount than one specific game not working properly.

but yes, Driveclub still needs to be fixed too..

[badz149]

if you are still saying that DC is not working, you clearly don't play it. so shut up!

[Volkama]

I'm just messing about. Bit of the old "topical humour".

It'll only come up in a board meeting if someone on the board has been trying to connect :)

@Badz Come on now, you can't just grin and lie about things that are there for all to see. I played DriveClub yesterday, and it was connected for about half of my session.

[Volkama]

Ah forget I said anything. It was just a joke, I wasn't trying to aggrevate.

[amiga-man]

Driveclub is a hell of a lot better than it was but the online still isn't reliable so definitely still work to do, having said that as a game it's a lot of fun, been playing around with the Atom today, gets knocked all over the place but it's acceleration is amazing, people seem like they are standing still as I zoomed past them.

The down side it is one squirly mother to control.

[BDG]

dont forget the rules of driveclub...never talk about driveclub

[Volkama]

*unless you have something nice to say

[LightofDarkness]

No jokes, Volkama, only srs bsnss here. Clearly people here are too mature for that lark.

[gamertk421]

Apparently Driveclub is an open wound, huh?
Lol at the dishing but not bring able to take it on this site.

[mcstorm]

That is my worry for Sony and even though the PS4 is doing well at the moment it only takes a few mess-ups and they could be in trouble on the gaming front too.

Look at the PSV for example. Great device but they made all the wrong moves with it and Nintendo took advantage of it.

Then you look at the PS4 and the last few weeks it has taken a hit with DriveClub and the 2.0 having issues which could have an impact on the brand.

Im not saying the PS4 is just going to fall off the edge of the earth as I do think the PS4 will be the best selling console this gen but I am worried for Sony as a company as they just seem to be making the wrong moves as a company at the moment.

Look at the TV's they are pushing 4K yet none of the big broadcasters have any 4K channels and we are yet to put all of them in HD and they are also not producing any TV's that can battle with the lower end of the market TV's Samsung and LG make.

Sony's Phones are great devices my brother has the Z1 and loves it but making a new flag ship phone every 6 months is not a good thing and to announce a new phone not long after the last one was announced is never a good move.

I really like Sony products but they are making a rod for their own back and I hope they can turn things around but the next few years will be an interesting one for them.

[Dramacydal]

Somewhere in 2012...

"The only major concern for Sony as a whole is the fact that even though the Playstation 3 is extremely successful, the company is still losing money each and every year. Too many other divisions aren't performing as well as they would hope."

Nothing in your statement stopped The Last of Us, Demon's Souls, Ni No Kuni, and countless others from being enjoyed. Why people worry about the finances of a corporation...I just don't get. Put that energy into, oh I don't know, A GAME. You think ANYONE at PlayStation is huddled at the water cooler saying:

"The only major concern for Neonridr as a whole is the fact that even though the avatar is very cool, the look is still blurry. Too many other comments aren't performing as well as they would hope."

Your welcome.

EDIT:

That's exactly why the PS4 and Morpheus exist, right? Rock on if you want to grasp at regurgitated straws...do you. It's clear you'll say the exact same thing when the PS5 has sold double digit millions too.

and it was a rewording, not an analogy. Sorry.

[Neonridr]

ummmmmmm......

??????????

If a company continually loses money each and every year guess what inevitably happens - they go out of business. Simple fact of life. Sony doesn't build products and provide services for the mere return of hopes and dreams. Money is their goal. And as a whole they aren't making any at the moment.

and your analogy was terrible, sorry.

[DarXyde]

Some of us make it our business to care because we have investments in these devices and services. Consider this analogy since I really don't see the point you made with yours:

Let's assume you have Amazon Prime, which gives you access to a number of services, including Amazon Music. Now Amazon Music let's you download select songs, albums, and playlists, free with your membership. Once your membership lapses, you lose said content. What do you think would happen if Amazon went out of business? Very high probability you would lose all of your content, right? What about the free kindle books? Their cloud services? Considering I love Amazon and their services, sounds to me like I should very much hope they stay afloat.

Like Amazon, I care about the state of Sony's finances because I'd like to protect my investments. I own every PlayStation in existence, 3 of which are still supported with PlayStation Plus which, if Sony goes under, I lose access to a LOT of games. Not to mention games that are multiplayer only won't even work anymore. They won't exist to support updates, patches, etc.

If you have investments in a company that are ongoing, you should totally concern yourself with a company's finances.

[GameSpawn]

@Neonridr

You do know that Sony is more than a company right?

They are even more than a corporation...they are a conglomerate.

Sony started as an electronics company, but has grown and diversified into so many markets it isn't funny. Their music, movie, and gaming divisions could float them for decades. Sony Pictures is one of the "Big Six" studios and from time to time has had the largest share of the movie industry at around 20% of that market (we are talking BILLIONS in just the movie industry alone). Hell, Sony has their own bank and investment firm in Japan ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...
).

List of Sony owned Subsidiaries:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Sony has become big enough in Japan and worldwide that if they were to fail it would cause such large waves in the international economy that it would have detrimental effects far beyond just "some company" failing.

Much like the biggest American car companies, if Sony did get into irrecoverable financial trouble they would end up getting government bail-outs to prevent an economic crisis. Fact is, they are not in that position as they have enough subsidiaries that are doing fine or are wildly profitable to make up for the short comings of their TV and Phone divisions.

[Neonridr]

@Gamespawn - yes, but their Electronics division is bleeding money left right and center. Another 1.2 billion dollar loss as of the last quarterly report.

It's not like Sony Pictures helps pay for the Electronics company. Even though they carry the same name, they are two completely different entities.

If one department continually loses money to the parent company, they aren't just going to be like "It's ok, the other divisions will help keep this one afloat so we will just let it continue to bleed away our profit margins". That would be the worst business strategy in the world.

[strangeaeon]

I have to wonder if you will even notice when Sony goes out of business.

[ragnalamb]

@gamespawn
Looking at that list makes Sony's playstation division look so small!

@Neondidr
Do you recall SCEI was founded with Sony Music an Píctures funds?? Plus, they keep investigating an engeneering new tech... so the investment count as a money loss financially speaking, but it actually isnt.
I think sony corp as a whole, can take on any blow MS throws at them in the gaming divisions.

[GenericNameHere]

Didn't their divisions all turn positive in their recent earnings report other than Mobile?

[Neonridr]

I dunno, all I know is as of their last quarterly report they had lost another 1.2 billion dollars.

[Muzikguy]

This is why I would like to see less companies dipping their fingers in every bowl of candy and just sticking to what they're good at.

[Rainbowcookie]

Speaking from a business perspective that relates to anything else other than the consoles and games I can see how you can get to that conclusion, however unless Microsoft sells more consoles fast and close the gap saying Sony is in trouble is a bit premature. The same goes for saying Microsoft has better exclusives can't be said since it's only a year in and you don't really know the secret ones in development. I don't believe Xbox is in trouble, like the wiiu since it doesn't lack games. I'd rather wait till after next E3 to make any calls on any consoles future.

[blackout]

Sony Corp. has seemingly become reliant on the PlayStation 4 to keep its company afloat. If the company is struggling in other realms, particularly its mobile division, can gamers honestly expect Sony Computer Entertainment America to pursue a PS4 price drop any time soon? Can the PlayStation faithful really expect SCEA to pay handsomely for future third-party exclusives when its parent needs every ounce of profit from its PS4 unit?

Nothing But The Truth. One division can not hold Sony down. Sony is giving people smoke and mirrors. I really hope the find another money maker.

[Utalkin2me]

You're right. Sonys movie studio makes no money at all and relies strictly on the PS4 for profit.....roflmao...smh

[LeCreuset]

"It’s the third consecutive month Sony’s offered PS4-owning PS Plus members three free games. Conversely, Microsoft’s similar Xbox Games with Gold November 2014 lineup offers one new game to Xbox Live members, continuing a troubling tradition of not equaling Sony’s generosity."

And that's from the guy on your side of the argument. Kind of invalidates that talking point, doesn't it? Here's the thing:

1) You don't go into a console gen unless you're prepared to support it with content, price drops, etc. Do some of you really think Sony is sitting uncomfortably on their lead, worried that at any moment MS will realize their Achilles' Heel—that all they have to do is drop the price, because Sony can't? Get real. They wouldn't have bothered investing in the PS4 to begin with, if that's all it took to defeat it.

2) Sony's financial troubles are a result of supporting struggling HIGH QUALITY products. Now, all of a sudden, they're not going to continue that tradition of high quality and support for a product making them money?

Come on. Some of you are getting desperate.

[iwin86]

This story is Bulls***. If Microsoft could bought the leadership in the console market, they would already did it. But money isn't everything - its about the games and the credit you have among your costumers.

[GodGinrai]

in business money IS everything. Sony cant run its operations on customer goodwill from playstation fans.

EDIT: LOL @ the disagrees. The truth does not give a damn about your opinion.Companies need money to run. LOTS of it. Losing it is bad. Is that so hard for ya'll to understand?

[Mehmeh]

Clearly there are pepper who dont know simple things about running a business. 13 at the time this is posted

[Ra3030]

Your right...money is everything. What's intresting is the Sony's game division is making a good deal of profit while the rest of Sony is under water and at Microsoft pretty much everything they do outside of the Xbox gaming division makes profit while the Xbox gaming division is under water. Clearly Microsoft is trying to out spend Sony to win but for how long will their board members be willing to do that when half the board or more would vote to sell off Xbox? The one thing Sony has that Microsoft will never have and it's their own fault.....consumer trust! That's the reason so many Xbox 360 users left for the PS4 it was never DMR or Kinect. People just can't trust Microsoft and even if Sony folded PlayStation without selling it off not as many gamers would rush to buy a Xbox as their are to many other gaming options out there to include joining the Master Race as the Steambox has made that the same price as consoles or many would go back to Nintendo instead of Xbox. Consumer trust is what lost this war Microsoft wants so badly to win and if your keeping score Microsofts record as it stands now 0-3 while both Nintendo and Sony having both won at least a round in the Console war and both was done with consumer trust. But let's be honest here Microsoft does not care about consumer trust or winning the console war they only want and only care about winning in America as they think that's the only place that counts and what they do in the rest of the world is a dog and pony show which is confirmed by their opinion that sales during Xmas are the only ones that's count.

[Spotie]

Hey, smart guy: how does an entertainment company make money?

I'll give you a hint: it's by making people want your products.

In retail and entertainment, repeat business is everything. So iwin is exactly right. You're kinda right, just in a broad sort of way that ignores the most reliable way of getting money when you're a business that sells things.

But you knew that already, right?

[MakinBaconXD]

People are also forgetting that they can still bring back their old policies any time if they get the right amount of sales or they are the only ones releasing....China anyone? Yep all that stuff they backtracked on,in China it is all there. The fact that they can do that,sorta makes me nervous.

[SpinalRemains138]

Absolutely. That vision wasn't put to sleep. It was put underneath the rug and only out of sight.

That vision will be reality though. For all gaming devices one day. It just sucks, but it is what it is, and we must keep it at bay as long as possible.

[TheStrokes]

I can see a debate coming...

*exits*

[MysticStrummer]

XB1 is being dominated and there are no signs of that stopping. No, that doesn't mean MS is in trouble.

[SmokingMonkey]

yea, in trouble......

....all the way to the bank!

sorry I had to.

[GodGinrai]

If only that were true, though.

[headshotfrosty]

Sony's PS4 is performing very well. Cheers to that. However we all know one mule can't carry the whole load. Will be interesting to see how this plays out. MS doesn't need to laugh all the way to bank...They live there already.

[medman]

"MS doesn't need to laugh all the way to bank...They live there already."....Tell that to the tens of thousands of people they just laid off and the entertainment studios they just shut down. It ain't all candy and roses at Microsoft either, and the xbox division has been hemorrhaging money for years, hence the talk of selling off the division.

[GodGinrai]

"It ain't all candy and roses at Microsoft either, and the xbox division has been hemorrhaging money for years"

The xbox division is not posting any losses. You should take a look a there last report.MS are making huge profits. The xbox division is making its money, even if they are losing the 'console war' to sony so far this cycle. Who do you HONESTLY think is hurting, more right now?

"Tell that to the tens of thousands of people they just laid off and the entertainment studios they just shut down"

Its called restructuring. Companies do it all the time. A company that made BILLIONS in profit, does not lay off staff because it cannot afford to pay them off.

"hence the talk of selling off the division."

Not happening. They already put that talk to bed.

[IGiveHugs2NakedWomen]

You do know that the Xbox Division has lost 400 million dollars and will probably end up losing alot more before April of next year? (Next fiscal financial cycle)

[Outthink_The_Room]

@IGiveHugs

Actually, that's including R&D costs which over time will be obviously be recouped.

Secondly, you have to understand it's different this time around for the Xbox Division.

Because Xbox is now using Azure, the profit made from Gold Subscriptions, no longer has to go to maintain servers entirely.

Azure is used in every form of MS's enterprising solutions. So Xbox gets a free ride on the back of all the other products that MS puts out. Let's say 20M users pay $50 for Gold, that's $1B revenue without having to dump all of that into servers.

MS had REVENUE of $23B this quarter, but truthfully, the PROFIT is probably closer to only $4-5B. So that $1B the XBL subscription money can potentially make, doesn't have to go to Azure to maintain the service. It's not just revenue, it's basically pure profit for the Xbox Division.

Difference is, Sony does not have the ability to dump PS+ membership money into other facets of the company. They need that revenue stream to pay for the service. And again, all the while the Xbox Division is getting Azure essentially for free.

The Xbox Division won't be hurting for money this generation, not even slightly. It will easily be it's most profitable console to date.

[Godz Kastro]

MS is sitting on a fortress of cash. Playstation divison keeping Sony from drowning. I hope they overcome. If it wasnt for the competition my X1 might not be as awesome as it is today. Good luck to both!

@black...come again? I have no idea what you are saying.

[BlackTar187]

If it wasn't for competition you'd have to ask MS to play the games they sold you

[Blackleg-sanji]

Thats what i dont understand about fanboys of both sides last gen ig xbox 360 wasn't doing so good sony wouldn't have woken up and learned and made the awesome ps4 and vice versa if sony didn't come out swinging this gen alot of xbox fans couldn't have enjoyed their gaming system of choice as much because of all the things Microsoft wanted to do before. I dont have an xbox one yet but i plan to so i would never want a company to fall that just leaves room for the othee company to fall shortly after

[Blackleg-sanji]

I thinl he means the always online, the no used games, the no sharing games etc

[kingboy]

Fortres of cash & yet can't make any decent hardware ..no innovation just cashing on overpriced windows software for years

[BlackTar187]

The american Media and it's constant smear campaigns and hypocritical articles is rather annoying and sad.

These articles these last 4 months have been as bad as when PS3 laucnhed a yr + later then the xbox

[Blackleg-sanji]

Its how it works i already knew once the xbox one startinh saving face and coming back strong the American media would change its tone no surprises here. Its also kind of obvious with devs too with the whole parity thing unlike when xbox had the better architecture last gen

[MakinBaconXD]

I have honestly never seen a group of fanboys for any platform so desperate to see their competitor fail and be gone forever like the Xbox fanboys. I have no idea why they are wishing for that to happen to Sony? I don't remember hearing Nintendo or Sony fanboys celebrating when Sega had to leave. It makes it worse when their "multi-console" owners do this and then are like "I own all consoles,I'm not a fanboy bur bur bur!".

This is why I say they remind me of the tea party and fox news.

[EinRobot]

I don't see the logic.

[Z501]

Thought this article was about video games. (PS4 vs Xbox One) It is not.

Also. Why do people 'convientlty' forget about exclusives the PS3 had versus exclusives the 360 had in 2013?

Ni No Kuni alone slapped everything MS had that year. Do I even have to mention The Last of Us/

Then Sony releases the PS4 along-side the X1. What's Microsoft's excuse? Shouldn't the X1 have launched with more games? 360's 2013 ... what were MS doing? Obviously NOT making 360 games/

"They were busy making X1 games"
Sony was busy making PS4 AND PS3 games in 2013, while still being "broke". What's Microsoft's excuse again?

[dragon82]

I think people forget that Sony was still making exclusives for the PS3 all the way up to the PS4 launch while Microsoft stopped making 360 exclusives about a year or more earlier. The XBone should have launched with way more exclusives than the PS4. Kind of funny that the PS4 still has more at this point than the XBone does.

[Hoffmann]

Very good clickbait article.

[Brooklynbully718]

When there's nothing to write about, you post a story like this

[polow got sol]

Wow sony may shutdown all operations if they don't get it together

[q8kik]

There's always the Nintendo route, so no.
Sorry to burst your bubble though :)

[Predaking77]

Worst clickbait article of the day

[q8kik]

Man these past few weeks it's been like i'm reading the same article over and over about how sony is in trouble or that they're doomed .

[BlackTar187]

American media smear campaign.

[Omran]

and here we go again

[XanderZane]

Yup.. and again.

http://n4g.com/news/1617263...

Fanboys have nothing else better to do with their time or computer.

[Blackleg-sanji]

Honestly im just going to go ahead and say it as gamers is this really our concern? I mean yea the big picture it is and its worrying but on a gaming website the only thing we should be going back and forth about is video games ps4 vs xbox one vs wiiu GAMES!!. With that said nobody has bragging rights for 2014. 2015 is where it starts.

[Visiblemarc]

Sales and user base are the *economic* measures of success in the videogame industry.

By that measure, Sony is ahead and no spin you put on it can change that.

It would be like watching a football game, one team has 42 points, the other has 18. Then you lean over to your friend and say, yeah but the joke is on them, they guy who owns that "winning" team is having financial trouble.

Long term, from a non-fanboy-realist perspective, I would expect Sony to isolate their games division. This might mean a spinoff or it just might happen by reducing and eliminating weak divisions.

Not sure why there are always articles trying to spin the facts. What good does it do?

I mean, I love my Wii U a lot, but I don't sit around trying to create a reality where Nintendo is secretly in the lead...they aren't.

I also won't do that with the Xb1 or any other console, no matter how much I personally enjoy them.

[rainslacker]

Sony Computer Entertainment is already a subsidiary of the main business of Sony. The division itself is profitable, but Sony as a whole, with all it's other divisions is not. So basically, Playstation is already spun off from the main company.

It's possible to completely separate it from Sony if it were necessary to keep it afloat, but the chance that that will be necessary is still pretty far into the future.

That's the thing that articles like this fail to really go into detail about. What it comes down to is that SCE has it's own budget within Sony, and it's not necessarily connected to the finances of the rest of the company. So long as SCE continues to profit, it's unlikely that the PS will go anywhere.

[Undini]

Why ppl keep doing this? So stupid. Yeah xbone is 100 cheaper and you think is good for them loosing money. Anyway sony console keep selling a good rate. But is ok. You like that Microsoft ripoff

[2cents]

Aww man... and the day was going so well.

We just had to have this didn't we.

Edit: "It’s time for video game fanboys to stop pretending to be business people. For the past year of the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One’s commercial existence, die-hard fans of both consoles have engaged in an endless, tireless and frankly meaningless argument about everything related to “PS4 vs. Xbox One.”

But the points that are brought up are those exact same points we are all arguing over anyways. So how is this article any different from the gamers views?

[SpinalRemains138]

What I don't understand is, how did all the sales talk turn from install base = Developer support, to company with most money wins?

This isn't about who makes more money. Never was. Not for us anyway. It is about having the largest install base so that your favorite machine will inevitably receive the most attention. More games. That's what we do.

Jesus, you'd think some of the gamers here are studying stock reports when they should be jumping and whipping or shooting with their digital guy on screen.

[danny818]

Just because ps4 is doing extremely well doesn't mean that that the company will be pushing forward. Point is that Sony is doing bad as a whole. And the exclusives just aren't there, and the network always has hiccups.

[jmac53]

What this guy has failed to realize is that Sony has built the momentum, and that is a hard thing to stop. MS had the momentum with the 360 and it took an entire generation for the PS3 to catch up. This generation is a little different in that there double the amount of PS4'S out there already.

[GamerX2]

all that money... yet there system continue struggle with 1080p..

And sony ..supposedly is on foodstamps .. poured enough money into there system to hit the resolution often then not..

[SpinalRemains138]

Exactly.

As far as a gamer is concerned, PS4 is just better. Bigger base for developer support, better first parties and better hardware.

Unless you're a CEO with either of the two, the finances don't concern you. The games and their subsequent offering potential do.

[bez87]

what he also fails to realize is that the PS3 struggled with third party games, cost a couple hundred more and then still went on to pretty much out sell the 360. so with that in mind
PS4 better priced even with the X1 price drop, third party games being alot better, more varied exclusives over time, and still riding the hype with sales that they don't need to have a price cut so soon, and yet we still haven't had massive exclusives come out yet and there all coming next year. hmmmmmmm not sure why there in trouble :S very very very short sighted article and not taking into account that people trust Sony to deliver, otherwise the PS3 wouldn't of sold so well in the end.

[corroios]

I also think that sony is in trouble 12 or 13 millions sold, breaking record after record, months after months, with the PS4...

But they were forced to give exclusives games for free, cut the price, end their strategy, talk about the clouds every single week.

I think the PS4 doomed and no one else is gonna buy the console.

[alwayzbusi1]

While this article was written to help some people sleep at night. I'd like to inject another dose of reality into the mix. I think it's unfortunate for Sony as a whole, but it's great for us gamers that Playstation is Sony's main bread and butter.

All this means is the company is hungry, and as we all know, pressure either bursts pipes or makes diamonds. Think about it, what does this mean for Playstation? Sony will just invest more into their gaming business and who wins? Us gamers. Hunger breeds innovation, just look at all of the recent ones. Morpheus, PS Now, PSTV, these are not signs of Playstation slowing down at all.

Sony has always delivered for us gamers, and by the looks of the PS4, that's going to continue. Does the author think Sony's studios suddenly just stopped making games? Microsoft damn well better be having more games than Sony in the beginning, am I the only one who remembers them leaving the 360 for dead last gen?

PS4 is almost on track to bring back the PS2 days. And if that happens, forget about Sony vs. Microsoft, Xbox and Xbox owners would be in trouble due to lack of third party support. Even I don't want that bloodbath again because that brings too much cockiness.

[PR_FROM_OHIO]

Another day Another negative SONY article they must be something right LMFAO!!

[lemoncake]

There was a time when I had a lot of Sony stuff in my house, CD player, TV, laptop, playstation. Now the only Sony thing I have is the playstation

[GodGinrai]

Discman= replaced by the ipod years ago.

TV= lost that market to samsung and LG ( for the record, I love my Bravia, and will replace it with another bravia...or a samsung).

Laptops= RIP VAIO. To be fair though, laptops have been losing ground to tablets for years.

[Gore-Content]

Clickbaits keep every sites running. It's cheap tactics for peasants like these people at dailygame.net. Works everytime, too.

[bleedsoe9mm]

its a about time we start seeing some of the restructuring impact the balance sheet .

[joeorc]

@bleedsoe9mm

"its a about time we start seeing some of the restructuring impact the balance sheet . "

100% exactly, and for those that think its like that of the west in Wall street. They have another freaking thing coming. This is not about the WEST its about JAPAN! THE MARKET IN JAPAN DOES NOT WORK LIKE IT DOES IN THE WEST, PEOPLE TRYING TO IMPLY OR TRYING TO TREAT IT LIKE THAT HAVE IT SEEMS ARE JUST NOT GETTING IT.

Oh' freaking for the love of God.....
Many here including the d@mn author of this Diatribe, do not yet seem to grasp or ignore what Sony did in the Quarter.

Let me break it down it is very Simple:

SONY Back in 2012 did this:

Sony completes Sony Ericsson buyout, launches new brand

Sony Mobile Communications is born out of Sony's $1.47 billion acquisition of Ericsson's half of their long partnership.

you see that 1.47 billion?

Sony Gave that part of the company a lil breathing room before its Restructure!

Sony wrote down a 1.2 billion Good will write down on the Mobile section of the company! in other words they themselves IE: Sony valued Sony Mobile IE: the xperia Brand Name valued at Zero! do not people get that?

they did this to Make sure when after the restructure they can see what more they need to Cut! instead of taking this cut back in 2012 you know when they lost from TV's a further 2.0 billion! Sony did this now, because A: they are cutting a further 1,000 employees out of the 7,000 employed in the Sony Mobile part of the company and lowing the number of models and what market regions they are cutting back on Aka: China for Sony Mobile.

As for those that keep saying Sony needs to spin off playstation to protect it....Again

Back in 2000 freaking 4... Sony itself Bought all that again all of SCE LLC stock.. IE: Sony the Holding company purchased all of SCE LLC's stock back in 2004!

continue->

[joeorc]

example:

Sony Computer Entertainment America LLC (SCEA) is responsible for keeping PlayStation® growing and thriving in the United States, Canada and Latin America. Based in San Mateo, California, SCEA serves as headquarters for all North American operations and is a wholly owned subsidiary of Sony Corporation of America Inc.

http://us.playstation.com/c...

See this here key point!

" SCEA serves as headquarters for all North American operations and is a wholly owned subsidiary of Sony Corporation of America Inc."

IE:

Sony Computer Entertainment, Inc.
Type Subsidiary
Parent Sony Corporation
Subsidiaries
SCE America
SCE Europe
SCE Japan
SCE Worldwide Studios
Gaikai
Sony Online Entertainment

Employees : 8,000

Since once again Sony owns 100% of all the stock anyone investor , Hedgefund etc. would have to ask Sony to Offer those stocks in a (IPO) BID.

Which just with Dan Loebe who owned 7% stake in Sony as a company the entire board Said No!!!!!!

continue->

[joeorc]

Again:
Sony rejects Loeb's proposal to spin off entertainment unit

By Mari Saito
TOKYO Tue Aug 6, 2013 2:48pm EDT
http://www.reuters.com/arti...

Dan Loebe sell's sony stock

Daniel Loeb, Third Point Sell Sony Stake After 20-Percent Profit

by David Bloom
October 21, 2014 1:01pm
http://deadline.com/2014/10...

So the fact that SCE LLC is a LLC lets examine one of the basic benefits to Sony structure of its entertainment arm:

A) Sony is the Holding company
B) Sony computer entertainment Inc. holds itself the following

"Subsidiaries"

which are drum roll...."wholly owned subsidiaries"
SCE America
SCE Europe
SCE Japan
SCE Worldwide Studios
Gaikai
Sony Online Entertainment

C) Since SCE IS A LLC please note this:

http://www.investopedia.com...

D) Less risk to be "stolen" by fire-sale acquisitions (more protection against "hungry" investors).

Sorry but the dream of Sony spinning off playstation to enable it to be sold, is really a straw mans argument dream so as to convince people that some company will outside of Sony swoop in and take over playstation. The fact is SCE INC. HAS A GRAND TOTAL OF ONLY 8000 PEOPLE...Sony itself Employs over 140,000 people world wide, but yet Sony's playstation section is valued more than even the TV section, but it seems many gamers would want Sony to sell or Spin it off?

yes that makes so much sense...LMAO

http://www.dualshockers.com...

HERE IS A FREAKING HINT PEOPLE!
Sony has spun off the TV section
Sony has sold off the PC section
But yet the board and the head CEO said no on any public offering of any part of the Entertainment arm of Sony. Trying to imply or think they will have no other choice but to sell or spin it off, is really Ironic because it already is!

its just that A)it is already a wholly owned subsidiary B) the entire Stock is Held By Sony itself with no public buy in! C)Sony Corporation of America Inc. can always buy back its own stock from Sony with 1st right of buy back!

its called a poison Pill! no Japanese company the size of Sony in the past d@mn 40 years has ever had a hostile take over from the west! hey anything can happen but to think it has a very good chance to happen is well. pretty d@mn slim to none and Slim already left.

[TheGamez100]

both consoles r doing well, x1 is getting great games at the end of this year, ps4 is doing great in sales and will have epic games next year in terms of exclusives...idk how sony is at a disadvantage

[guiltl3ss]

I don't see either console being "in trouble" right now, honestly. They both have great third-party games on the way, Microsoft's price cut and sky split is moving some more consoles, and first party titles are starting to make their way out into the wild. The Master Chief Collection will be great for MS and Little Big Planet will be great for Sony. Honestly, this holiday is going to be great for all of us, no matter which way we decide to play!

[guiltl3ss]

#gamingbipartisan

[sovkhan]

"Taking all that into consideration, it really feels like Sony’s in trouble, not Microsoft. Sony’s winning today’s sales battle, but the evidence seems to point to Microsoft winning the long-term war."

Long-term and Ms doesn't match, sorry!!!

And Ms has been trying with more than one year start and did not manage to win and still you expect them to win now...ROLF!!!

[MakinBaconXD]

Man,this mindset of "This company has more money,therefor it must be better than the other company!" is not only stupid,but it is so superficial and pathetic. And what makes it more pathetic is that you're not even getting any of the money Microsoft makes,none of us are getting a cut of the pie from any of them at all.

[Spid3r6]

I am happy of the strives MS has had to do in the last year...They have been making the MS experience better only because Sony has been outselling them each month. Being the underdog as a XBOX One owner has been really good. I like that the company keeps pushing hard and made quick changes to make it better.

[quenomamen]

Well that does it, I'm selling my PS4 cuz Sony is in trouble. I mean they've only been around since 1947 what do they know about surviving in business.

[spoiled9]

How corporations are doing is not my concern. Unless you are CEO or have stock in the company, why should you care how a company is doing financially. How does this change that fact that one console is better then the other one. PS4 will always be there no matter what happens to Sony. You don't think that the brand will sold off and continue to kick Xbox to the curb. Really idiots cheering for corporations is so ironic. They are making money cause idiots continue to pay for garbage. Wake up and spend your money wisely! Not because someone tells you that one company makes money and the other looses money, who cares!!!!

[bu3ouf91]

Xbox fans keep creating new topics attacking the succes of PlayStation 4, Burn hater burn !

[XanderZane]

Yeah, we all know that Sony has been losing billions over the past 6-7 years now. A lot of it was caused by the PS3 and it's overpriced system. The PS3 was losing billions for the first 3-4 years and on top of that the HDTV & Laptop divisions were also losing millions. Now Sony expects the PS4 to dig them out of the hole all by itself? That's not going to happen. Thankfully Sony's movie division is doing fairly well. It's not losing billions. I believe Sony's cameras are doing ok as well. Sony will need a big holiday season this year to help clear some of that debt. Microsoft is making enough billions to offset anything the XB1 loses. 6+ million consoles sold in 10 month isn't terrible. We'll see how both systems do in Nov and Dec.

[joeorc]

@XanderZane

" The PS3 was losing billions for the first 3-4 years and on top of that the HDTV & Laptop divisions were also losing millions."

Oh' hold on there, it was not Millions for the TV section try Billions, as a matter of fact try a cool billion for each year for the TV section alone...1 billion a year for 9 straight years!

here read this:

i posted this over 160+ days ago

@@MultiConsoleGamer

i said it once before i will say it again, 9 years + over 9 billion loss for the TV section, and yet when is it going to come to a head? huh, when is the investors going to get the way they want? please tell us all how that change is going to happen?

Really you call out Kaz is telling fib's but yet if Kaz and the board was not doing anything the loss generated would have been far larger in size, so what does that tell you?

Sony employ's over 138+ billion in physical assets, along with an employ in over 138,000+ people! so you are saying they are not cutting the cord fast enough right? that's one of the reason's many japanese despise the "west centric" view on companies. they view the value over welth over people is nothing more than blunt greed for the sake of it. when the nuke leaks from the plants went off, did you see massive looting going on in the street's?

No

There is a reason why, the culture in japan is not like the west, just the fact you and other's do not seem to grasp this very concept shows if you have not grasped that now, you seem to be unable or want to.

it seems you want something so bad that you cannot see the history of the culture that you want to fight against that you are not part of.

you are not japanese, and i am not but at least i understand why something is, you on the other hand seem to refuse to.

http://n4g.com/news/1514889...

the point is take a look at this

look at this from 2 years ago:

Sony is set to lose $6.4 billion dollars

http://www.giantbomb.com/fo...

Now of course no company could take these type of a Loss without doing something about it, but like i stated the market in the west is not like it is in japan. japan culture is not like that of the west. and the change over to more west centric point of views on how companies are ran is going to take a hell of a lot of time to change. There has been changes but not to the extent that hedge funds would like..example D@n Loebe is a example he even made 20% profit on the sell of all of Sony stock!

for a company stock not seen as worth much as its seen as junk bond status, he sure made a profit off of it, but on the same token Sony is not willing to sell off any stake into its movies, Music and software or playstation holdings arm of the company as a matter of fact more investment right back into those sections is happening. and more electronics production is being cut except for entertainment electronics. like Playstation console systems.

[XanderZane]

Oh, ok. Well all combined together, it's definitely billions. I don't think Kaz has done anything to turn these loses around. Sure they got rid of the Laptop division and will have the HDTV division run by a subsidiary company. Even with these changes, they still losed billions and even this year their loses are more then what they told their investors. I can see more investors pulling their stock and running to Samsung at this point. Samsung has dominated Sony in both HDTV and phones. The Galaxy 5 is almost as popular as the IPhone now. We'll see what happens next year.

[MakinBaconXD]

Off topic,But I am glad you mentioned that multiconsole guy. I can't stand him because he comes off as an elitist Jerk >.<. I hate it because they think if you don't own their favorite console(Xbox)then you're not a "real gamer" or whatever that means.

[cyhm3112]

If these people writing articles like these are getting any money, they are just plain stupid.

[dillhole]

Is there any way to filter out these "doom and gloom" articles from N4G? I come here for discussion about the enjoyment of games, not the impending decline of everything.

[jmc8888]

Absolutely retarded article.

Sorry, more advertisements doesn't change facts. Somehow the moron who wrote the article thinks they do.

Hey Microsoft, why don't you use some of those advertisements to inform people that those idiotic, fascist ideas you tried to force on everybody, that many still think is in force, mostly aren't any longer.

So even though Microsoft has had more money during all three of their consoles, it somehow NOW will make a difference? Only NOW?

Because PS4 and Xbox One's situation was formed by advertisements and $$$$.

If anything, if you looked at the specs of the Xbox One, you'd think THEY were the company in trouble. So we've seen they have all that money, yet they created an underpowered console. So obviously with all that money and the advantage over Sony, the design of the console wasn't for the better. So why now?

Also Sony didn't dominate this past year because of advertisements. They dominated because
a) they didn't piss off their customers
b) had the more powerful, cheaper console
c) had the best multiplat games combined with some exclusives

The article talks about the price drop....

Yes let's talk about the price drop. They dropped the price, and added in a game (and in some locales TWO games), and PS4 was still kicking it's butt.

I've said alot about alot on this site, and I've always said that of course there would be upticks around the xmas shopping season. All three consoles will.

But so far, even up through last month's numbers, Sony was still increasing the rate they were pulling away from Microsoft.

Now let's look at the macro, since so few people follow the markets correctly. Hint: Every industrialized economy and stock market is in a bubble. Of course this bubble coincides with our on-going world-wide depression.

Japan has been in a deflationary spiral since the end of the 1980's. Their demographics isn't helping either.

[XanderZane]

You may want to sit down and read "The Art of War". It could help you figure out Microsoft and the XB1.

[jmc8888]

They have absolute morons running their economy, who believes, that if they print money, and buy up their debt (Japan is monetizing 100 percent of their debt), they will soften their exchange rate...i.e. 140 yen to the dollar compared to say 80 yen to the dollar. This in theory is suppose to make the prices on their exported products cheaper to the buyer in another country. Thus when you buy, say, a Nintendo game, it will garner them say 8400 yen @140 USD/Yen compared with say 4800 Yen @ 80 USD/Yen.

And/or they can cut the price and compete better with Chinese and other Asian made goods.

Of course this isn't working out too well. But what IS doing, is that all the input costs that go into making those goods, and simply to live in Japan, are going up. So it's really HURTING that which it is supposed to HELP.

So in reality, what is hurting Sony and Nintendo far more then anything else, is actually their own countries monetary policy.

If Sony goes under, while many will point the hand at Sony as the main culprit, the real main culprit will be Keynesian indoctrinated economic fools running their MONETARY policy, as well as them having to compete with China in a free trade world.

What alot of people don't understand is..outsourcing doesn't just happen to the U.S.

With free trade it happens to anyone where someone else can use manipulated markets to find a cheaper market to make goods. So it's a constant, revolving process. Goods made in America...went to Mexico...which went to China...which are now going to say Vietnam.

Same thing with Japan. Goods Americans or Japanese once made, are made in China and South Korea now, and increasingly even cheaper places like Vietnam.

Meanwhile Microsoft isn't all rainbows and sunshines either. Just wait until the true market crash comes. We only saw a small bit of it in 2008-2009. A much bigger one then 2008 is coming. Where will Microsoft be financially if it's stock price is $3 a share?

Doesn't matter if you're Japan or America. Bush, Obama, Bernanke, Yellen, or Abe. Same scams.

[Mindsucker]

"It’s time for video game fanboys to stop pretending to be business people. For the past year of the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One’s commercial existence, die-hard fans of both consoles have engaged in an endless, tireless and frankly meaningless argument about everything related to “PS4 vs. Xbox One.”"

Nicely said, sadly just another fanboy posting theories and trying to put a positive spin on the situation of their favorite console...

[Jaqen_Hghar]

After reading that article he brought nothing new to the table and seems to ignore that MS has offered numerous price drops in the UK and still loses there (their second best territory last gen). They've all but given up in Europe and were less expensive all last gen and still got outsold with a year head start

[Silly gameAr]

When fanboys are able to write opinion pieces and submit them. N4G is a magical place. :/

[Condemnedman]

Well unless it anti ms then it's ok

[Silly gameAr]

Haven't seen many of those around. Seen plenty of anti-Sony ones though.

[jts1891]

I have to laugh. 'Sony isn't making money in other divisions! MS is though! So the Xbox is better!'

Right.

Even more amusing is that Destiny isn't the 'megahit' that Sony had hoped. It's the best-selling new IP ever, and it's one of the 10 best video game launches of all time. From a sales perspective, Destiny is the very definition of a 'megahit'.

[quenomamen]

Yea the fact that Sony is in the red will make all the upcoming multiplats run at 1080p on the X1 instead of the usual 720-900p. Hey maybe if Sony goes bankrupt all games will magically run at 1080 in the X1 ! Even games they already bought ! Hell it might even bring back the Zune and Kin Phone !

[Ps4andxb1]

Destiny = Justin Beiber

[CervantesPR1]

what a terrible article, looks like it was written by an average fanboy.

click bait at its finest

[ajax17]

I love how these articles always compare the WHOLE company vs the other WHOLE company... as if that will affect the video game aspect. Sony spent soooo much money on the Cell processor and suffered the first few years last gen, AND YET THEY'RE STILL HERE!!

Sony isn't losing money in the video game market!! What the hell is this guy smoking?? Hell, even their TV sales are up from last year:

http://www.bloomberg.com/ne...

[ScaryMonkey]

If that's the case then why so many desperate propaganda articles from the xbox fanboys? There's seriously a dozen of these sad articles from them every single day.

[smokedrugs]

I am taking fat hits of vibrant powder creams and the one thought that enters into my mind is: why are all of the xb1 supports writing their blogs on an Apple computer?

[Hammtweezy2192]

Anybody who says that Sony is doing GOOD or that Playstation can save the company entirely is oblivious to how the real world works. Sony and many different Corporations have multiple divisions that make up the entire portfolio. It's how they diversify and lessen the probability that they lose money just like an investor mitigates losses in a financial portfolio.

Sony's portfolio at the moment loses money in almost all its divisions but not the one that contains PS4. Bottom line is that it alone can't sustain a company of Sony's size thus why they are classified as JUNK and continue to lose millions and sometimes billions. Either they restructuring of the company reduces expenditures enough that other divisions began to operate in the black or Sony will begin dropping divisions.

Sony will likely focus much of its resources on what is doing well like PS4 but it's a fine balance as major investments will be required elsewhere to bring other divisions in the portfolio back to black. That ultimately means that there will still be cuts to PS4 expenditures and may cause inherit problems in things like R&D or maintenance to the platform.

If you are a diehard Sony fan that's awesome and I hope you enjoy they hell out of your PS4. I want to get one at some point as well but as a person knowledgeable about the inner workings of large Corps, it's hard to make that investment when I see things like crippling software updates and a games not functioning properly (Drive Club). These types of things are quality control issues which come directly from reducing expenditures. I personally hope for Sony to turn around as they do make good products but they can always be better when they have more cash on hand and divisions in the black.

[alwayzbusi1]

Yes, of course. It's just bad business to make games for the fastest selling current gen console. The company is in trouble so they should lower support for their currently most successful product. It all makes sense now, I've seen the light. Make less games for PS4 and make less money. What company needs money anyway. /s

[Hammtweezy2192]

That's absolutely not what was said in my comment by any means. I want Sony to turn it around first off so don't get all butt hurt thinking I'm putting them down. The point relayed to your comment however is that they can't survive off of simply investing in whatever division they hold the Playstation brand in and will ultimately need to rectify the others operating in the red. That will take alot of resources as its a very large company. Look up the restructuring of the American auto makers for reference of what that might look like, and each company needed money to right the ship. So yes their Sony PS4 as the money maker is extremely important and as will be their own government. Ford mortgaged off its own brand to have to money to fix itself. GM got a huge cash infusion from the US Government as did Chrysler. Ever heard it takes money to make money, it's true in more ways than the obvious. Sorry to irritate you so much. Have a good one :)

[Yaay4me]

Such a retarded article. Sorry but fail

[Condemnedman]

Watch the defenders come.

[smokedrugs]

the guy who wrote this blog is high on something... and it's not legal.

[arbitor365]

funny how the PS4 is now outselling the xboxone closer to 3:1 per week instead of 2:1

http://www.vgchartz.com/too...

[smokedrugs]

that will end pretty shortly too when everyone that has bought an xb1 will have to go out and buy the updated machine with the new processor.
then the sales will definitely double.
hahah

[assdan]

They have not begun to close any type of gap.

[user78405]

for a guy does not know how do Japanese do business and their governments fund them....??????
sure SONY is always been in trouble with western economy, that is a western countries perspective view but for Japanese economy its doing well for exporting more than 65 countries than Microsoft doing....even selling more in US does not fund enough like china or japan or Russia love the way of trade functions. and NO SONY is in better location for a company to be at...its the western companies can never buy Japanese stock by Japanese law...in otherwords they can sell American or European divisions but not the homeland headquarters...that is a property from the Japanese territory..so money can grow on trees literally but not fast they want to, due to bad luck of weather interference..!!!

[Hammtweezy2192]

I understand that as well but it doesn't mean they have unlimited funding. They still operate within budgets and guidlines but to your point will likely never go out of business. Even though they are supported as such changes will be made as even the Japanese government doesn't like throwing money away either.

[stormswrath]

Ps4 has and will continue to dominate this generation of consoles. So in ps4 vs xbox there is darn near already a victor. Does anyone really expext xbone to catch let alone pass the ps4 in sales before this generation comes to a close. If you want to talk sony versus Microsoft then clearly Microsoft as a company is destroying Sony. It's clear as day on both fronts. No fanboy here just a realist. I love my ps4 and when I can get o e cheaper i will get an xbone because I am a gamer and the only way to experience as many games as possible is to have as many platforms as possible. As a gamer I want al pplatforms to do well.

[bluto34]

You fanboys kill me lol. You only believe what you want. I hate to tell you this but losing that much money isn't good. Do not put your foot in your mouth, it's been one year.

[SharnOfTheDEAD]

LMFAO Sorry Xbox is still dragging it's heels behind the Wii U Sony hasn't got anything to worry about.

[Pogmathoin]

The comments on this thread is very indicative of what is so wrong with this site.
Sharn,
PS is fine, thats the small part of Sony..... The rest is leaking like Niagara falls..... Take of the fanboy glasses, will become clear.

[smellslikeralph]

I love both my consoles evenly but you have to be stupid to think that sony has loads of cash which is not the case. Sont is losing alot of money every quarter on everything but the ps4

While ms is raking in money by the truck loads. If ms wanted to i bet they could easily buy out sony and put an end to them period.

Who knows what the future will hold for either of these companies tho i dont believe either of them are going anywhere

[Trekster_Gamer]

Another lame article. I'm a huge XB1 fan but I don't think the XB1 is in trouble and I definitely don't think the PS4 is in trouble. They're both doing great, THE PS4 is outselling the XB1 and I could really care less. I am extremely happy with my XB1 with it's incredible game library and 2nd to none online service.

[D-riders]

I'm confused. Sony vs ms. Consoles but your talking about the company is financial. You can repeat this to people all the time. Oh and by the way some of us gamers are business people.ms isn't gonna a keep dumping money into a sinking. Ship the need to reach 10 million soon. Or as a business supersonic you have to start rethinking get your investment. Get rid of the console and aim for browser under the Xbox name. It will probably happen. Gamers have spoke and that's something that isn't unique in the entertainment market people speak with their wallets.

[DEEBO]

Sony is doing financial better then so I'm happy for them and everyone that's making money.

Money comes and goes most of these big companies are safe so let's get back to gaming.

COD AW is sooo much fun.

[the_dark_one]

http://giphy.com/gifs/laugh...

[Father__Merrin]

as long as PS4 is doing better than Xbox1 that's fine by me!!!

this article is a fail

[Flames76]

No doubt sony just posted another 1.2 billion loss last quarter.Microsoft and the Xbox division profits was up again.Sony is done thats why there are no exclusive games on the ps4 this holiday.Sony cant afford them so fans get a broken driveclub.While microsoft is putting out exclusives left and right while Xbox division profits has never been higher

[Juangie3]

Is there a block button? Im tired of seeing this stupidity i just want to read about games!

[KirbysDump]

Sony is going to suffer soon. like this xmas, little big planet? more like little no sales

[dafegamer]

I will bookmark this comment and send you a message after Christmas, to let you know how deluded you're sounding

[dmonee]

Considering Samsung is killing it in the home electronics department. Im surprised they havent come out with their own videogame system. Even if Sony closed their doors tomorrow, including their Playstation, another company would come along and buy the Playstation property. Whether it be Microsoft or someone else. Either way, if all we had was the Xbox then so be it. Its still a good maxhine and there will and are good games for it.

[Nivalis]

What an awful reactionary article posted an hour after the piece that triggered it.
Both are currently hottest, its plain to see he read it, got butt hurt and wrote a reaction.

[lawgone]

It's a shame that reading comprehension and critical thinking isn't stressed more in schools. Then again, the fact that so many lack those skills has kept me employed.

Key point to the article has been video game fanboys with no business training or experience keep trying to give their amateur analyses and coming to the conclusion that Xbox and MS are doomed when that couldn't be further from the truth. Please, go to college and take a few finance and marketing courses.

[Revengeance]

LOL Xbox will leave the industry before PlayStation ever does. That's a fact!

[thexmanone]

LOL!! Will you be my friend? Your so funny

[TheOnlyMastrx]

Neither company is in trouble. Hell, even Nintendo isn't in trouble. They all have their own things going for them and they all have problems come and go, but none of them are doing terrible by any means.

[SynestheticRoar]

LOL.Idiots imbeciles morons simpletons, and retards alike. Who believe this nonesence. X1 like the last two systems before it will come in last place. Let's just hope they can hold their own, till the next console race. Maybe then they will get it right. I followed the X-box from it's inconception and I feel they only did this damage to themselves.

[tekksin]

what a fanboy article.

[Ragingdemon666]

Hey fanboys...
Stop your Sh*t. Neither Microsoft nor Sony will fall. These are companies that are considered too big to fail. Microsoft is a software giant and it has lots of investments in other companies such as Hewlett Packard and Dell as well as Lenovo. They even have part or major shares of microchip and soundcard companies like Intel and Bose. Sony also has investments and shares in the same companies as Microsoft. Sony also has their movie studios, music companies. Sony bleeds money but has the the investments that make it money, just like Microsoft. How do you think Nintendo stays afloat after all the blood and money they have lost. Like the political parties, they're both exctly the same except their messages are different. Sorry to burst the bubbles of so many but do the research yourself. Stop with this people fueled d*ck measuring contest. Love one system or the other. Buy it enjoy it and hope for the best with your investment.

[hkgamer]

want to start of by saying that its a bad article. sounds like author believes that whoever has the biggest advertising budget wins. also ms makes billions of dollars so that they can spend even more on the xbox if they are losing out.

[xkevmandc]

everybody knows the TRUTH Sony is in financial trouble NOT Microsoft. And Sony just lost one of their biggest American BILLIONAIRE investor 2 weeks ago...

[Sneakybudda]

I have an Xbox one although I love it I don't think Sony is in trouble but Microsoft is. This article is a bit daft tbh.

[dafegamer]

Sony is in trouble, even if the sales are almost 3:1 worldwide in favor for Sony? I don't get this article

[Artemidorus]

What is it with Sony fans and the word; deluded?

Playstation is going towards 15 million sales yet Sony warns of a 2.1 billion loss.

Now I know the IQ is lower for Playstation 4 users but if you cannot understand what's going on then you never will.

[Commodore]

Denial and Desperation is a terrible cologne.

[gigantor21]

Microsoft as a company is in a far better position than Sony, but that doesn't mean that their odds of winning the generation are good. They put so much money into the original Xbox that it was never profitable, and that still didn't stop the PS2's momentum. The 360 had several advantages over the PS3 in the beginning (came out a year earlier, better online, better library, lower price up front) and the PS3 still managed to catch up in the end despite Sony's deteriorating finances.

It's true that nothing is guaranteed yet, but that's equally true for BOTH companies.

[DougLord]

Sony fanbois need to stop with the Playstation is doing well financially. You idiots have never even read a Sony financial report have you? Sony made a measly $200 million from the Playstation and Vita. It was a lousy 7% profit margin. Sony LOST $1.2 BILLION as a whole. Playstation is a pithy 15% of Sony's revenues. It can't save the sinking ship. If Sony was to sell Play station they might get $3-$5 billion for it. Sony has over $60 billion of unfunded pension debt.

Playstation is the property of Sony's debt holders. They can't spin it off with out getting sued for fraudulent conveyance. You Sony fanbois don't even know what that means. The debt holders will force Sony to sell the brand to the highest bidder. Google, Apple, Amazon and Facebook are the likely buyers. You better hope it's Facebook, because the other players will turn it into a ARM Android/iOS console and sell it for $50.

Meanwhile MSFT made $400 million of profit from selling the Xone and 360. This was a 20% profit margin. See a company or product is successful based on how much PROFIT it makes, not how many units it sells. I could sell 100 million X ones if MSFT priced them at $20. That would not be a success.

Sony has better hardware. But until recently they sold it at a loss. MSFT was selling at an equal or higher price until recently. Sony also spent a lot more on marketing. I've seen very few Xone ads on TV and I see PS4 ads everywhere.

[Jubez187]

Yes but marketshare marketshare marketshare. We learned that in the last generation. 360 cut into the market early and at a lower price, and that was it. Of course, they completely dropped the ball and didn't put out an exclusive for the last 3-4 years of the consoles lifecycle, but yea. Marketshare grows exponentially and will surely pay its dividends down the road. This is an economy where people are not likely to have two consoles. I had ps2 and xbox but shit isn't like that nowadays, not when phones are 600 dollars themselves.

[joeorc]

@DougLord

they did not Loose the Money, it was a good will write down!
you called out for people not reading the report? At least some of us gamers freaking understand it! This was a write down impairment!

They did this for a restructure, if they did not do this good will they would have made a 800 million profit , but on the same time they may loose the profit due to restructure delay so instead of waiting Sony wrote off the 1.6 Billion and decided to value that expend to zero! So after restructure the part of Mobile will be operating at profit.

[OldDude]

I am a businessman, my business has offices in WA, OR, ID and services the US and the far east so yeah I think I know something about business...

At the end of the day no matter what your P&L's show as profit or losses it comes down to one thing; cash flow. Sony has been bleeding cash for years, selling assets for infusion and they are running out of assets to sell. When cash flow is tight the profits from PS4 and other systems are used to help cover other losing divisions. This results in less money for game studios and future hardware development. Its not unlike the Sega Dreamcast or the Atari Jaguar. Both systems were great in their day but Sega and Atari couldn't support them and thus they perished as hardware manufacturers. Today, in economic circles Sony is shown as having a 48.9% chance of bankrupting in the next 2 years. That's puts the Playstation division at risk as courts could order the restructure of the company and selling off assets still worth money. Playstation will be around for years, just don't be shocked if one day its owned by Google.

[Jubez187]

But really, playstation is playstation, sony is sony. Playstation, like you said, can be bought by google tomorrow and STILL WIN the console generation. That's why it's very stupid to say ps v xbox, but then solely talk about sony and microsoft.

[P_Bomb]

Talk about beating a dead horse with a broken record.

[mastershredder]

@ Jonas Allen. You just went full-retard.

THIS is a prime example of gaming industry pseudo-expertise.

[Jubez187]

The problem is is that he's doing a sony v microsoft argument in a xbox v playstation fashion. Two totally different things.

[kenwonobi]

Wishful thinking. Reverse psychology only works on the weak. Sonys parent company is in trouble financially. The Playstation division is not. There are plenty of exclusives already controlled by Sony. They can spin off those games then make a few originals. The library is vast enough for such a thing.