Microsoft: $4.8bn spent on 360 product in US

US consumers spent $4.8 billion on Xbox 360 hardware, software and accessories in 2009, according to Microsoft, with $1.1 billion in sales during December alone.

The company also claims $2.7 billion was spent on Xbox 360 games during the year, with the console accounting for a 43 per cent share of third-party sales – or $2.4 billion.

[Capt CHAOS]

MS have come a long way since the old Xbox..

[deadreckoning666]

WOW..and this happened during the 360s worst year. Very impressive and VERY good for the gaming industry in general. However, I still believe M$ charges way too much for Wifi.

Edit: I agree with Saaking. Even the PSP has built-in Wi-fi. And with a 360, you have to buy those expensive hardrives just to save your game saves. With the PS3, you can just use a regular usb stick and transfer your game saves to a PC as a backup.

'Also who on earth uses wifi?"

Ur being sarcastic right?

[Saaking]

MS' accessories are a complete rip-off. With 90 bucks I can get 500 GB on the PS3, but I need like 120-150 JUST for 120GB. That is insane. The Wifi is 100 bucks, yet EVEN THE WII has built-in wifi. What a complete rip-off.

[-MD-]

I have like 50 cds and 40 arcade games, tons of DLC on my 20gb HDD and still have 6.5 GB left so I never understand why the average consumer would need anything bigger.

Also who on earth uses wifi?

[Blaze929]

Yeah...I think we all know that now. Can we tell a new story finally? Don't like the prices of their accessories then don't buy a 360. PS3 is usually on the shelf right next to it. Like really, got a broken record over here. We ALL know they rip people off. No surprise the comment came from you though.

------

Anywho, 4.8 billion is pretty impressive. I wonder how much accessories alone. If pretty high and numbers show the 360 audience likes to buy a lot of accessories, maybe 360 customers will be into Natal after all.

------

@Murderdolls. When referring to wifi, I hope you question in regards to gaming no? Otherwise...that's a pretty silly question. Who DOESNT use wifi?

[-MD-]

Uhhh anybody with an ethernet cord...

[Government Cheese]

^^Yep. Hardwired is the way to go anyways.

[LordMarius]

I use wifi :)
I'm always moving my console from room to room, it really is a necessity now IMO

oh an no lag

[qface64]

wifi is a must for me so i had no choice but to shell out 100 bucks for that dumb adapter
i didn't like paying for it but hey i need it

[randomwiz]

Some people don't like digging holes through their basement to their 2nd floor.

@dead
2009 and 2008 were the 360's best years, with the 360 only selling about a 100k units less in 2009 than 2008

[Wrathman]

sorry this article states the obvious.

but some of it is plain unnecessary.wifi adaptor gets owned by a 20 metre ethernet cable that cost £6 on ebay.but some of it you need.like the plastic shell casing on the HDD.the rest is pure luxury.like the txt pad.i didnt need it.but its damn handy for txt on msn while i play games.lets see wot else..oh the plug and play kit.you dont need it if you have a wired controller.

but lets face it..no teenage gamer is paying for these add-ons.mom and dad is.and i normally defer these things to xmas and get them bought for me.like my ps3...xmas present 3 or so years ago.same goes for live gold.tho i never get why you guys complain about the cost of live.its pennies or a whole year

[Anon1974]

So, people spent 4.8 billion on the 360 in 2009 in the US alone, and yet when you look at Microsoft Entertainment - the 3 quarters they reported in 2009 showed a profit of just over $150 million. I know there's more to Microsoft Entertainment than just the 360, but still. Those analysts that reported in September that the 360 was being sold at a loss must be onto something. I noticed that in the six months after the last price cut as well. Revenue was up year over year, but profits plummeted 130%.

Considering that 360 sales seem to have flatlined, you seriously have to wonder how Microsoft intends to make money at all with the 360 considering how much they've lost on the console so far.

And remember, we're talking about Microsoft here. Whenever you bring up the money being made from the 360, someone always yells "Look over there! Sony!" No one is saying Sony is doing any better, but at least we know why Sony is having issues at the moment - the same reason every other Japanese electronics maker is struggling, fx rates. We really have no idea what's going on with the MS Entertainment Division. All Microsoft will say as the "cost of generating revenue" has increased. Profits dived 130% after the price cut! Are you running a business or a charity for gamers? How long are your shareholders and board going to put up with the way this division is run?

[commodore64]

MS is really to be congratulated on this outstanding achievement.
During 2009, they had to contend with a PS3 pricedrop, PS3 slim, PS3 FFXIII and PS3 UC2.

Did they falter?
No. They did not.

In fact, the opposite is true.
MS's 360 has held its ground against what has been the year that Sony undisputably played its strongest trump cards.
Incredibly, 360 sales have held off what was to have been the triumphant return of the ps3.

Hype aside, the facts show that the ps3, after price cut and after the slim sku release, remains in third place worldwide, by a healthy margin of approximately 5.5 million.

Ultimately all the small minded 360 haters are forgetting these undisputable facts:

- the 360 has posted two years of profits, the ps3 none.
- the 360 has held its ground and remained profitable, despite proven lies to the contary.
- the 360 has posted record peripheral and gaming sales profits.
- the 360 continues to innovate the industry and engage developer support, including through the upcoming NATAL.
- the 360 continues to outperform the ps3 in multiplats, on average.
- the 360 has fabulous games coming out 2010 and beyond.
- Reliability is greatly improved and reportedly on par with other consoles.

The above points are factual, reasonable and entirely good news for the industry.
While the ps3 has caught up a certain margin in install base, it has not achieved the dominance that many haters were predicting.
Moreover, the 360 is gearing up to demolish 2010 and beyond!

It will be interesting to see the upcoming 360 profit figures, after these excellent sales of 360 games and 360 peripherals.
My guess is, the 360 will soon post its third consecutive profitable year, despite the lies told by the haters!

Enough with the hating, children.
Let's be gamers instead.

[aaronisbla]

enough with the number counting children, lets be gamers

@commodore or any other person who keeps talking sales, no matter which side you lie on: How does this affect you as a gamer if you don't have shares in the company?

[captain-obvious]

good
and Sony made 5.1 billion
http://www.psu.com/forums/s...

i wonder who much Nin. made
im sure its the double if not more

[avengers1978]

If Wifi is not important and hardwired is better why did microsoft even bother to make a wifi acces. And why are people paying 100$ for it. And as far as hard drive space goes you most not have any HD movies saved to your HDD because they can eat up storage pretty quick.

[Anon1974]

We know Nintendo and the Wii is profitable, because we can see that from their balance sheets. We know the PS3 is a profitable platform because Sony has flat out stated that it is and has been for some time now. We also know that Sony's games division had returned to profitability until the current economic crisis. Like every other Japanese electronics maker, FX rates by the appreciation of the yen versus the US dollar and Euro cut into their revenue by as much as 25%.

Microsoft is a different story. Last Sept, financial analysts commented that the slowing 360 was a drag on Microsoft's bottom line. They also stated that the 360 is causing Microsoft losses at the current price points. And no matter what the 360 is bringing in, we have no idea how much of that is offset by the current costs associated with the warranty program and defective units. Microsoft cleverly took a hit on the books a couple of years ago so they don't have to report it to their shareholders anymore even though the costs are ongoing.

Even though Microsoft Entertainment Division has posted two profitable years now, we really don't what's going on internally. Microsoft has never once claimed the 360 was profitable and the slight profit the Entertainment Division has posted could have been easily been from Office for Macs (also grouped in with the division) or Mobile versions of Windows (also grouped in) or a combination of any of the other products that included under the Entertainment umbrella.

And there's no doubt that if they were reporting the costs associated with the 360 warranty program instead of hiding them that two years of "profit" the Entertainment Division has posted might look very, very different. Add to that the fact that when Microsoft announced layoffs a year ago, the bulk of those layoffs hit the Xbox division. If everything with the Xbox were cheerily clipping along as expected, why would they need to slash their Xbox division?

[STICKzophrenic]

"enough with the number counting children, lets be gamers

@commodore or any other person who keeps talking sales, no matter which side you lie on: How does this affect you as a gamer if you don't have shares in the company?"

Coming from someone who wants to play as many great games as possible, sales ARE important. Had a game like, let's say...Uncharted: Drake's Fortune been a total sales disaster, we wouldn't have Uncharted 2: Among Thieves.

If a game doesn't sell enough, no matter how good it is, chances of a sequel are reduced.

Personally, I'm not a sales guy. I buy and play a ton of games, everything from Halo and Gears franchises to Killzone 2 and Uncharted franchise. BUT, to someone, somewhere, sales do matter. They matter to the development studios, the publishers, Sony, Microsoft, and to an extent, they should matter to gamers so that you can play future iterations of that awesome new IP.

[Anon1974]

...what are you even doing in this news? Clearly the topic at hand is sales.
I guess when it comes to sales discussions there will always be three kinds of people. Those that stick to facts and want to legitimately debate a topic, those who make up unsubstantiated claims and call them facts in order to further their own agenda and those who complain "Why are you talking about sales? I dun wanna talk sales!"

Here's a little tip. If anyone tells you they have proof that the 360 is profitable, your first response should be "Show me." Undoubtedly they'll provide a link to some article or a financial statement from Microsoft showing the revenue for Microsoft Entertainment Division. Now ask "Now show me how much of there how much is attributed directly to the 360, and where can I find and how much is the adjustment for the ongoing expense of the warranty repair program?"

They can't answer that. The truth is, Microsoft coughed up a billion a couple of years ago which has effectively taken the ongoing cost of warranty repairs off the book. It would be like me saying "Today I lost a million bucks" and then tomorrow saying "Hey, look! I made $1600! Woohoo!" Microsoft is using accounting tricks to keep the true profit/loss of the 360 under wraps. You can't just lose billions and then claim to be profitable. Those loses don't just cease to exist because it's a new fiscal year.
So, is the 360 profitable? Really depends on your time frame. Overall, not even close, much like the PS3. They both have a long, long ways to go. The difference is one console's sales are growing, the other...not so much. When you consider the PS3 has outsold the 360 since it was available worldwide, it's clear consumers have spoken. It's Wii, PS3, 360.

[commodore64]

I would suggest it is unclear whether the 360 is making a profit or not. The 360 is part of he EADD and it has not been stated to what extent the 360 has contributed to the EADD profits/losses.

However,
the evidence suggests that the 360 has made record peripheral and game sales, just now.
The evidence sugests that production costs are reduced, via improved manufacturing efficiency.
The evidence suggests that attach rates are at 8.8 and that RROD claims are on the way down.

Thus, it would be a reasonable assumption that the 360 is making profit, given the above, however, we have no direct proof.

It would be an insubstantiated contradicting subjective personal opinion to state that the 360 is making losses.

Everyone is entitles to an opinion, of course.
However, these comments form part of the public record.

Current or former financial professionals may wish to consider the legality and implications of publicly posting as fact what is not known.

We all know the sharemarket reacts on rumour and 'insider' knowledge.
In this industry, spreading half-truths and lies is a slippery game that lawyers soon become interested in.

If a financial professional, such as a broker or professional were observed to make unsubstantiated claims about a major conglomerate's profitability in a public forum, then that may or may not be in conflict with their professional guidelines.

Certainly, financial professionals would do well to restrict their online postings to the entirely factual, lest they be seen as spreading defamatory opinion, false information, or outright lies, about a public company, such as MS.

Of course, anyone who works in such fields, or has done in the past, would be well aware of their legal obligations in this regard.

;)

[Omega4]

Thats a lot considering they didnt even release any huge games last year. With Halo and Natal this year MS will easily have their biggest year ever.

[Saaking]

I'd say that's pretty sad. While MS get's all this money, we gamers get nothing out of it and STILL had little to no exclusives on the 360. Seriously, we don't get anything out of this profits so I don't see why I should be happy. Frankly, MS doesn't deserve it. They've treated their fans like crap all year long.

[mrblacknut]

You seriously do not make sense. The consumers are the ones who SPENT(being the keyword here) SPENT that 4.8 billion. I mean seriously. The consumers don't get anything? Fing Joke man. You seriously need to take you sensitve tale on and take a break from gaming. I isn't that serious and sound all personal why MS did what they did. They give the consumers what they want just like Sony and Nintendo do for the cosumers that bought their products. Give it a rest.

[Elven6]

Out of curiosity, where do you think the money goes Saaking? Do you think the executives pocket it and hope for a better raise next year? All 3 companies put it into future development, paying bills, etc in their divisions.

Or were you really expecting that money to just magically whip out an exclusive title or two before 2009 ended?

No company gives you "anything out of the profits" unless you are a shareholder. The most they give us gamers in return is more games, accessories, etc.

[Saaking]

Well see, I wish MS would use some of that money to build some more first party studios, make better games, further push their console.

A lot of people say that PS3 exclusives look better only becuase are made from the ground up (the devs make the engine and everything) while the 360 normally goes with UE3 or some other engine. Well, with all the money MS seems to make why can't they make at least one game with the same support Sony gives to it's first parties?

Instead they waste the money on exclusive DLC, making exclusives go multiplat, or pushing Natal (which imo is pointless). As a 360 owner, I really wish they'd do more.

[Elven6]

Microsoft doesn't use the Unreal Engine for internal projects by first party studios, they always build custom engines. Microsoft does spend some of that money on their first party studios, 343 Industries has been hiring a lot recently, they also have a ton of internal teams that work on stuff such as assisting studios with their projects, making their own games, etc.

Not a huge fan of Natal after hearing Ensemble and ACES were shut down specifically because they didn't fit into the Natal vision at MGS.

[Wrathman]

@saaking.

dude you sound like you wish you lived in a communist country.ms and sony are capitalist companies.if sony thought they could get away with half the sh1t MS do,they would do it.if xbox products were half the pile of dung you guys think they are ,then it wouldnt sell.plain and simple. each has shareholders which need to be appeased.and im betting MS shareholders are a damn sight happier than sonys.MS get maximum profit from minimum effort.and if you want anything back from MS,then u really shud invest in shares.

fact of the matter most people own several consoles.in my home alone there is 2 ps3's.2 xbox 360's.2 pc's.2 laptops.1 wii.an original xbox.2 ps2's and a dreamcast in the attic. and i aint rich by any means.all have peripherals lyin around.and the only one i really think is a piece of sh1t is the wii.which my mom plays.

[gamer0123456]

......no one cares what you think that owns a 360 we all know what you are.

GJ MS way to go!!!! ME2 FTW!!!!!!!!!!!

GJ SONY ...so stoke for gow3....i need it now!!!

[Nineball2112]

4.8 Billion (with a B) spent just in the U.S. on Xbox stuff in 2009.

Man... that's probably more than some countries GDP! LOL...

[green]

Can see microsoft reporting another profitable year for the xbox division.

[RememberThe357]

but I can see them posting another profitable year for 2009 as well.

[green]

not talking about the next financial year but this one.

[Mista T]

good for gaming, good for me

[Sarcasm]

"US consumers spent $4.8 billion on Xbox 360 hardware, software and accessories in 2009"

Sad day to see consumers willingly rip themselves off. Then again, that's why too many people in the country are in debt. They want everything now and pay it later.

[-MD-]

How exactly is this considered being ripped off?

I pay them money for a console, I get a console. I pay them money for a game, I get a game. I pay them money for an unmatched online service on consoles and I get the best of the best.

So you completely lost me on how this could be considered a rip off.

[kneon]

Let's see, I pay for a 750gb drive but only get a 120gb drive, that's a rip off.

I pay double the going rate for a wireless adapter, that's a rip off

[-MD-]

http://www.wikihow.com/Use-...

That's for you.

[NateCole]

Lol! Keon. Don't enlighten them. Its best that they don't know that wifi router only cost $50.

[Sarcasm]

I'm referring more specifically to the Accessory pricing. The whole pay for XBL thing is a dead horse beaten to death.

[azmanmanz]

xbox360 accessories is overprice that why ms get 4.8b

[Trebius]

M$ charges insane amounts of money for things that should come WITH the system for free, like on the PS3...

If you have to spend 300 bucks for wi-fi and a hard drive of course you're giving them crazy amounts of money.

They'll KEEP doing it too, cause ppl are dumb and continue to support their shadiness.

[polow got sol]

wow people probably dont realise how much money that is thats impressive

[ActionBastard]

Xbox 360 growth under 1% in the US 2009, PS3 up 22%.

Ok v1c1ous how's this:
Xbox 360 growth under 1% in the US 2009

elven6: 2008 was 2008. They've increased each year since release. Shrugging off a less than 1% increase in a country you've dominated 2nd place in, while #3 has increased 22%, is misguided.

[v1c1ous]

the ps3 was selling like crap a year ago, so of course they will see big gains after the slim and onslaught of heavyweight titles :o

[Elven6]

In comparison to 2008? If you still sell nearly 5 million consoles is that still a bad thing if you didn't do laps around what you did last year?

[NatureOfLogic]

it's about getting better yearly, not how you did the previous year

stop being a fangirl

[Lou Ferrigno]

ps3 wasnt selling like crap a year ago.. majority of 2008 was sony's,taking over microshaft in sales until the desperate price cut made by tho's greedy basturds.

[NateCole]

@Vicious. Selling like crap?. You mean out selling the x360 for the majority of 2008 until the x360 late price cut?.

The point is the x360 is 199 for all of 2009 unlike 2008 as well as the Elite at 299 and yet it could only increase sales by less than 1% in its strongest market. Forget about comparative sales for once. The PS3 was at 399 in 2008 for christ sakes and focus on the x360 proformance for once.

Now imagine a situation where Sony dropped the price of the PS3 to 199 late this year and still only sold less than 1% more in Japan. Do you honestly see that as good?.

MS as we all know is running out of steam. They only thing MS has left is price cut. All of its major franchise are out. The hardware is fast becoming obsolete compare to the PS3. With a price of 199 the x360 sales should be on fire similar to the wii right now.

[v1c1ous]

i meant lackluster

[aaronisbla]

Not sure why we as gamers ( who for the most part don't own stock in either of these companies ) give a fvck what was spent.

[AnotherGamerUser]

Anything Microsloth says?

[AnotherGamerUser]

Why would you NOT use wifi if you have the option? The only thing I use ethernet for is to deliver streaming content to my flopbox so I can get a higher quality stream other than that, I use wifi.

[NateCole]

MS spinning as usual. When they are not happy with their HW sales they talk about revenue. More specifically how much they rip off their customers.

[gamer0123456]

4.8b is nothing to spin about.....lol

the way you think you should go here and post..

http://betweentalk.com/

[2 cents]

Seriously i do not understand some people. I personaly go for the best value for my money. Why would you support anything else? I do own a x360 but i refuse to pay for xlive or any other rip off that MS has on offer. I keep it strictly for off line experience of the exclusives and i do all my online gaming on the ps3. Sure the psn is not as good as live but is it 50 times worst? No. So why should Live cost 50 times more?

[NateCole]

It's about social networking which is all the craze nowdays with kids like Facebook,myspace etc. Live builds the same kind of social networking online community with gaming added.

This really is a big draw card for kids on live. You talk to any x360 fan and one of the main reason why they can't move to another console for online is because their online friends play on live. Its all about the community they say.

Contrast this to PS3 fans its generally the opposite. PS3 fans generally only go online for online gaming only. Not to make e-friends and talk about everyday crap that most of us adult want to forget about about while gaming. I have about 5 people on my online friends list. I don't really know them nor do i care. If i don't play online anymore with them they don't care nor them i am sure. Thats really is the way it should be. Besides i prefer friends in person. You can't drink with e-friends nor shag them lol!.

[Gago]

the head sets are absolute garbage

i've gone through 3 wired HSs, and now finally bought a $50 wireless HS

[SUPREME RULER]

over price crap, only a suckers pay for these garbage on the 360 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks sony for making the ps3 open to third party accessories! yes MS cheerleaders mean cheaper items on the ps3. I have a 500 gig in my for 60 dollars! now imagine if ms made one, would about 300 to 400 dollars.

[Wrathman]

lol.wot the hell you got on 500 gig? you say it like its an awesome thing.damn this pc im typin on has only 80 gig.at least 120gig hdd on the xbox has reason to be there.i get to install games.and has a ton of arcade games plus demos i need never uninstall.and theres still 70gig left.then my 40gig ps3 is half full from patches, firmware, home, vidzone,facebook and the bbc iplayer.and not a drop of game on it.

[BISHOP-BRASIL]

Although that IS impressive MS is know to spend more on it's console too, so I would wait someone have info on 360 total costs for Micro or MS themselves to say what the profits or loses are.

Those exclusive ad deals don't come for free you know, Activision knows better.

[gamer0123456]

I bet Some ONe has a jealouslY issue and wish they had that kind $ coming in

[Halo3 MLG Pro]

It's pretty clear to see why the 360 is such a success. The ps3 will never see the same financial success as the 360. That pretty much is clear.

[JJFNIGHTS80]

With their overprice accessories they still need some price cuts on their peripherals.

[kewlkat007]

then again some are paying for it and every company these days are out to get your money regardless. If something sells then no need to drop prices on Ms's part.

XBL Money + Accessories + Software selling well = successful from a business POV.

Ms's marketshare needs to get bigger, I think before they start cutting prices. Your just not a very strong brand like Sony/Nintendo. With 100 million user-base to tap into.

Pretty much everything with the Xbox 360 is growth from last-gen to today. Obviously not that hard to do the math, when you hardly sold 30 million original xbox's.