Newell: "Go Ask Blizzard if PC Gaming is Dead"

Charmers - 512 days 16 hours ago

Exactly why would you buy a new graphics card everytime a new game comes out. Oh that's right you don't have too, or if you do have too then you are doing something very very very wrong.

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JsonHenry - 512 days 15 hours ago

Saying you have to buy a new video card every time it comes out shows just how ignorant of PC gaming you are. You talk about how "cheaP" your console is. But if you factor the cost of a TV (even a non-HDTV), your consoles price, and batteries and recharge kit your "cheaper" console cost less than it did for me to build my gaming rig.

And the only thing being killed off is the console. Your console has done nothing but mimic PC gaming for two generations now. You have down-loadable updates, expansion packs, you have installs, you even have game crashes and internet browsers!!

The SINGLE BIGGEST REASON you like console gaming so much is the fact it MORE LIKE A PC now than ever.

Think about it. The PC is not dead or dying. Your console is evolving into a PC!!

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Revvin - 512 days 14 hours ago

Factoring in the cost of a TV for console ownership is a ridiculously flawed argument. How many households do you think that are in the market for a current generation games console don't already have a TV?

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Gorgon - 512 days 14 hours ago

As someone said already, do you know anyone who does not have a TV? You probably have one too. And by the way, even if you don't want an HDTV you have to buy one since CRTs are almost impossible to find these days. So adding the cost of a TV is pointless.

As for the battery chargers and batteries, I never had that problem with a PS3.

Also, who cares if consoles are becoming more like PCs, with installs, etc? That was never the point and you know that very well, it just happens that you don't have more arguments to throw around.

Newel is a fun guy. The only argument that I hear about the healthy state of PC gaming is WoW. Let me give you some more, Newel:

Crytek giving up on PC exclusives. Epic developing Unreal Engine 4 primarily for consoles. Far Cry 2 going multiplatform after beying a PC exclusive (in fact most footage nowadays from the game is actually Xbox footage, not even PC; they know where the sales are going to be). CD Project developing The Witcher for consoles. GSC becoming a Xbox authorized developer and bringing the STALKER franchise to consoles. Dragon Age coming to consoles in one form or another. Heck, even a aircraft simulator like IL-2 Sturmovik is coming to consoles!!! Who would have dreamed that 5 years ago? Oh, and Operation Flashpoint 2 too!
Do I need to say more, Newell? Why did you guys at Valve even bother doing lousy console ports if the PC market is so good? Just do like Blizzard and keep WoW as a PC exclusive then! Hypocrite.

Do you actually think that any publisher/deveoper in his right mind is going to develop PC exclusive games that cost 50 million dollars to develop plus millions in advertisement just to sell 1.5 million copies when they can sell 4 million in multiplatform? PC gaming is the place for MMOs and RTS games or, if you like it, the place to play Poker and Mahjong on-line. Games are rising exponentially in deveopment costs and 1.5 million sales don't cut it anymore. PC gaming in terms of big budget productions is just an appendice to the console market and it will continue to be so. FPS, action-adventure, RPGs, etc, are the domain of consoles now. No one develops solely for PC anymore unless its a MMO or RTS.

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Tempist - 512 days 12 hours ago

It's coming to the point where if you're not an unhackable MMO then you're not going to make money. Casual PC gaming is booming, but other aspects such as popular hardcore games are getting the short end because honestly there's no longer strong incentive to pay $50 for a 10 hour PC game that's probably going to look like crap on your two year old computer.

I have to say that Valve got one thing right and that was to use an engine that played well on older hardware. If this formula is used on new games than it would probably drop dev costs and cut down on piracy because games become affordable again.

Other than that, Blizzard is unsuccessful in the sense that they have not been making games and being progressive. WoW was a lucky break cash-cow, but does still have it's problems.

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ChampIDC - 512 days 15 hours ago

The thing is, PC gaming is turning more into free games with ads or free games with item stores. PC gaming still has more people playing every day than any of the consoles. Yeah, big companies can't ship out massive amounts of software, but there's still plenty of money to be made in the free game formula. Just look at stuff like Maplestory.

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Gorgon - 512 days 14 hours ago

PC gaming is not dying; its changing. Its no longer the place for big budget production titles; instead, its the place for Poker/Majhong on-line. The only genres that will survive as exclusives are MMOs and RTSs. No one will ever spend 50 million dollars in deveopment plus millions in promotion (and rising) in a PC exclusive anymore to just sell 1.5 million copies when they can sell mulitple times that on consoles alone (Crysis, remember?). Where are those grandiose AAA first person shooters that were once the pride of PC gaming? They are on consoles now. RPGs? The same. This trend will only continue.

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jlytle1234 - 511 days 17 hours ago

good stuff on the size of his member joke. bubbles.

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kevnb - 512 days 14 hours ago

not on an open platform

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dannyhinote_13 - 512 days 11 hours ago

Newell will only "lose his job" if he quits or retires.

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Pain - 512 days 16 hours ago

Blizzard is a Virtual Crack Dealer they dont count since there game is a MMO....

PC gaming is Dead and Going they way of religion.

asking a guy like Gabe someone that Makes PC games that sell More on Xbox....if PC gaming is dying is like asking BUsh how that War in Iraq is going...last i herd they 'think' they winning....................... .

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Montrealien - 512 days 15 hours ago

Pain said..

(PC gaming is Dead and Going they way of religion.)

You are the cutest Pain, really, I can`t get enough of you sometimes.

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arakouftaian - 512 days 15 hours ago

a loser

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Montrealien - 512 days 17 hours ago

You point is over 15 years old though, this debate has been going on for way to long imho.

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The gaming GOD - 512 days 16 hours ago

Every week you get some PC developer preaching how pc gaming isn't dead.

Two months ago all of them even banded together to make the PC gaming alliance (or whatever it's called)

Not to mention just recently games for windows xbox live-esque service has been made free.

These things probably wouldn't be happening if the notion of pc gaming is dying wasn't constantly brought up

You're right, this has been a debate for many years. But it's never been under such scrutiny as it is now. And the fact that almost every pc developer has started to make the pc games for home consoles as well doesn't help matters.

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morganfell - 512 days 16 hours ago

I started as a PC gamer. It isn't dying but it is getting it's ass handed to it by consoles - where I do most of my gaming. It also smarts when the developer of the most popular (NOT BEST) game engine says they won't be supporting PCs with their next iteration.

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Montrealien - 512 days 16 hours ago

I hear what you guys are saying, It just seems this debate has been going on for ever. I would never go as far as saying it is dying, however it is changing.

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The gaming GOD - 512 days 16 hours ago

Why is this convo in the open zone?

It's not like anyone is fighting.

But anyways, I guess people say it's dying due to the fact that most of the pc developers are putting their games on home consoles as well. Crysis Warhead might very well be the final major pc exclusive game.

If the pc market could somehow garner more pc only games then the rhetoric of pc gaming dying would go away.

Personally, I think the biggest problem is that pc games are almost never advertised. I know they never NEEDED advertisement much in the past. But now, with home consoles inching closer and closer to pc level games, they need to show that the pc is a gaming console in itself.

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Montrealien - 512 days 16 hours ago

Yeah, the open zone thing is my fault, I`m stuck here and still don`t shut up :S

But yeah, lack of marketing is not helping it at all and would need more these days to hit a broader audience, but I think the MMO market, services like Steam and Gambling are just making this a different beast from a boxed game market we are mostly used to.

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The gaming GOD - 512 days 16 hours ago

You just brought attention to another issue. The fact that it IS a different beast might be part of the issue as well. Console gaming is quick and easy to just pick up and play.

PC gaming for some (not all) is a hassle because there are times when you have to upgrade (sometimes that can cost alot of money). Then you have to be weary of the requirements of each game. For example, you have some games that run under direct x 10 but can't run under direct x 9

And as cool as steam and MMO games are as you mentioned, they only hit the select few (although it happens to be millions). Whereas the consoles are easily accessible (play wise) for everyone

But the particular issue overall comes back to the lack of marketing on pc gaming's part. These issues of people not knowing how to game on their pc should have long been gone.

Honestly, I'm gonna stop because I can write a damn book here. But I will say that pc gaming's issues aren't that hard to do away with. But the pc gaming community has to WANT to fight for itself.

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Tmac - 512 days 16 hours ago

Don't even bother debating with Motrealien.

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Charmers - 512 days 15 hours ago

@ morganfell what on earth are you talking about ? Is it perhaps the story that the Unreal 4 engine won't be on the PC ? If it is then you are wrong, Epic have already CORRECTED that misinformed bit of garbage. They have stated the PC is of course going to be supported, they just didn't say it because they thought people would assume it would be. Here is proof of what he really meant :-

http://ve3d.ign.com/article...

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Montrealien - 512 days 15 hours ago

@Gaming God

Sounds good man, same here, in the end the videogame market as a whole is winning whether PC gaming is dying or not, great games are coming from all over the place and that`s all that matter to me.

I think Tmac said something but he is ignored so i`m sure it is nothing worthwhile...

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Tmac - 512 days 15 hours ago

Dont worry Montrealien your opinion dwindles on the expressive value of dogshit, you didnt miss much.

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morganfell - 512 days 15 hours ago

They didn't correct anything. They cahnged their statement baSED ON PRESSURE. as a member od the Unreal Developer Network they had planned on dropping support. They made that plan for a reason. Profitability percentages on PC titles are much much lower than consoles. Fact. PC titles do not get anywhere near the attention nor im[portantly the dollar support of console versions.

People like Newell are actually part of the problem and Valve would be better off without him. I am reminded of the RIAA and the way they went after Napster. They were too stupid to realize that integration, not exile is the key to the future.

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Charmers - 512 days 15 hours ago

@ morganfell - can we have some proof of these "dark intentions" then ? It sounds to me you are putting words in Epic's mouth to justify your fanboyism. Epic have clearly stated they will be bringing the Unreal 4 engine to the PC, but no that isn't good enough for you. Your point doesn't even make sense, why would Epic give into pressure, I mean if the PC isn't "profitable" what do they care. You got caught out and you should just go "thanks for correcting me" instead of coming up with this load of cobblers and X-files type conspiracy.

The reality of it all is this, there was NO grand plan by Epic to ditch the PC. It was a simple misunderstanding that console fanboys lept upon and blew totally out of proportion.

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morganfell - 512 days 14 hours ago

Dark intentions? What are you smoking dope? I have said time and again that the greatest RPG game ever made is a PC game. I play it a lot, I mean a lot. I am eagerly awaiting the new upgrade coming this fall. Do I prefer consoles? Absolutely.

But I recognize your type. Console gamers look at PCs and do not think twice. Meanwhile PC gamers hate consoles with a passion from hell. They blame consoles for the downfall of the PC industry. They blame console game makers for switching and being what they call disloyal. They blame everyone but the people actually responsible – PC gamers.

PC gamers are the source of all of their own issues. Everything from trying to run a configuration from hell wired together with rubber bands to being unwilling to compromise in any way on a game and thus rebelling and attacking developers. Been there done that. I worked on an Ubisoft project and watched fans get livid and attack the developers over decisions made. They then started petitions to protest the product and encouraged people to boycott it. Hey, that other foot is still moving Earl, get the shotgun.

If PC gamers want the attention they once had they need to do something besides set around and bellyache, lamenting the state of the industry. They need to get of their fat asses and exercise their wallets like consolers. Buying power, that is the key. PC gaming made the same mistake as the RIAA when they went after Napster. You can’t stop it. Instead you exercise the Chinese water principle. And you redirect the flow by going along with it and controlling it gradually from the inside.

Developers know that products like WoW hardly ever come along and it is much easier and support friendly to build a decently selling console game. The return on their time and effort is much better rewarded. PC gamers expect these companies to produce landmark titles that require a mountain of resources and then sell a relatively few number of copies. Some PC gamers think that if the developers make a great game then console gamers will buy it too. Sorry, but you had your chance years ago when great PC games were being made then. People were not buying in numbers. And now they never will. Not on the amounts that are going to make developers abandon consoles.

I noticed his royal fatness said ask Blizzard, a company that is actually an anomaly. He should have asked the hordes of other PC game developers that are leaving that area of the market. The only reason more haven’t bailed is the initial enrollment and dev kit costs are beyond many.

You didn't call out anyone or correct anyone. Delusional. Anyone in the Unreal developer network knows this. And it is the reason Crytek is also looking at console. No buying power in the PC market can rival the console market. Over 90% of Epics profit comes from Consoles and the engine licenses for console products.

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Charmers - 512 days 14 hours ago

WOW you went off on one there didn't you. Tell me did I say anything about consoles ? Did I ask for your WRONG views about the gaming industry ? No I merely corrected an ERROR you made. You stated Epic were ditching the PC and they clearly are not everything else is just a rant on your behalf. I dunno did PC's do something to you when you were younger ? Did they kill your pet hamster or something.

How about you keep your pet theories to yourself eh. Just like I am doing, I merely stated you were wrong that Epic were abandoning the PC and showed you proof, you are the one that turned this into a whole "I am right PC's are doomed doomed I tell you".

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morganfell - 512 days 12 hours ago

You have some serious issues to sort out. The first requires going back to reading. Look at my first post in this thread. Do I say PC gaming is doomed? No. But is has dropped year on year for the past 5 years in comparison to the grounds gained by consoles.

Maybe on day you will get to look at the other side of the game industry. These are not conspiracy theories but it happens to be the way things are.

When you get a mountain of fact thrown at you your only response is, you went off. Weak. Just weak. I am sorry the PC industry isn't what you want. It isn't dying and I never said that no matter what you make up. But it also isn't close to what it was and it has been repeatedly slugged with one event after another. Had MS not interceded then Epic would have continued down that path. All the major updates we have received on the U3 developer side of the house that are platform specific have been console enhancements.

Facts do not change just because you find them unpleasant no matter how much you hold your special blanket and pray. Money is the great differentiator in this industry and there is a reason one Gamestop after another have done away with their stock of PC titles. They just do not sell like they used to.

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Charmers - 512 days 12 hours ago

I am not bothering to argue with you, because there is NO point. You passed off WRONG information as fact, plain and simple. I called you out on that and you went into overdrive giving us your pet theories on everything. I am not going to waste my breath showing you why you are wrong because it would be totally pointless. Even when I showed you evidence you got a simple fact wrong you still wouldn't accept it.

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morganfell - 512 days 5 hours ago

So then I get the last word? Great.

Did Epic officially say they were not supporting PCs? Yes they did. Did they recant? Yes they did. Did I say they wouldn't be supporting PCs or did I say they made that remark? See the difference? It isn't that subtle and surely a person of even limited intellect can distinguish the difference. If you had any reading comprehension you would get that.

Where did I refuse to accept it? I merely told you that it had been their plan and if you were in the UD network you would have seen clear cut evidence. Pressure from MS changed that.

You are the one that when presented with the facts fails to accept it. Now go ahead an break your word. It has to be eating you up.

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morganfell - 512 days 2 hours ago

Oh look, the PRESIDENT OF EPIC says they are targeting next gen consoles with Unreal 4. Notice HE DOES NOT mention the PC. Now go blow a frigging blood vessel.

http://www.gamasutra.com/ph...

"We've got Unreal [Engine] 4 in production right now... it's going to be in the next console generation - our rough guess is 2012 [to] 2018."

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Charmers - 511 days 21 hours ago

You just can't stop lying can you. Even in that link it says :-

"Version 4 will exclusively target the next console generation, Microsoft's successor for the Xbox 360, Sony's successor for the Playstation 3 - and if Nintendo ships a machine with similar hardware specs, then that also. PCs will follow after that."

That is STRAIGHT out of the article YOU posted. When they say the next console generation they mean the next xbox/playstation, it is taken as READ they will support the PC they don't feel the need to mention it because they don't think anyone is STUPID enough to think they will ditch the PC. Get it into your head the PC is still hugely popular the Unreal 4 engine IS coming to the PC.

You are the one here not paying attention, hell even in your own evidence it says the Unreal 4 enging is coming to the PC but you still won't accept it. Which is why I don't even bother arguing with you about anything else, you are clearly deluded and so biased it isn't even funny.

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morganfell - 511 days 18 hours ago

Lying? Me? let me quote you.

"I am not bothering to argue with you, because there is NO point. You passed off WRONG information as fact, plain and simple. I called you out on that and you went into overdrive giving us your pet theories on everything. I am not going to waste my breath showing you why you are wrong because it would be totally pointless. Even when I showed you evidence you got a simple fact wrong you still wouldn't accept it."

Look at that. You can't keep a good resolution for 5 minutes but you can keep a bad one forever. I know, but Twain is appropriate when dealing with liars and I don't mean Epic though they did. I thought you said you weren't coming back. That is a pretty good example of lying you performed there. Nice. What's that? Well I will call it a phib if it makes you feel better.

That is from the article I posted and that quote is taken from the second interview with Sweeney AFTER he reversed himself. I posted it to point out the fact that the president of Epic didn't even bother mentioning PCs. The interest is flagging and your past time is being relegated to bad ports, WoW, and solitaire.

Are you in the Unreal developer network? Have you sent emails to Epic or asked them personally on the phone or in a meeting what the deal was with the PC support? No you have not. As I told your friend Montrealian, the only assumption I made was that it was MS that put pressure on them to change there mind as MS has the most to lose with their dying Vista and games for Windows venture. Both abortions.

And as I also remarked to him after you apparently cried to him and he PM'ed me, it is your own fault for two things. First it is your fault that you are an uneducated reader that cannot grasp the meaning and weight of the remark

"It also smarts when the developer of the most popular (NOT BEST) game engine says they won't be supporting PCs with their next iteration."

It does smart, it does hurt your industry to have someone say that. Does it help for them to come back and say, "Uhhh that isn't exactly what we mean, blah blah blah." Yes, but the damage is done.

Are you that much of a literary dullard that you cannot understand what that statement means? Is English your second language? I can't believe I am having to explain this to you. It hurts the auto industry for someone to issue a report thatsays SUVs are twice as likely to cause passenger death in an accident. it doesn't matter if it later turns out to be true, it does hurt to have it said.

it doesn't matter that Epic later reversed, errr, clarified their remarks, it smarts , it hurts. I have seen you post here before and you are one of those rabid PC gamers that feels offended by every console ever. That much is obvious. I love it when I am right about someone. Look at the remarks made. If anyone hit a nerve, I struck yours with a 10 pound hammer. You tantrum, I mean bald face lie about being through was a nice try. But then I hit that nerve, dug in there and made your wince then scream and back you came breaking your own word. How easy it was to manipulate you. Here let me pull another string puppet boy. Dance, go ahead, dance for me.

Second it is your fault you are a PC gaming maniac that lets people yank their chain and lead them around like Pavlov's dog. Obviously I am done here as I am out of bubbles. Even so I will do something you can't. Keep my word and say I am done with you. I will show you how to use an ignore button.

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Charmers - 511 days 17 hours ago

Is Epic bringing the Unreal 4 engine to the PC ? Answer YES
Is Epic abandoning the PC platform ? Answer NO

How about you read what I put next time. I never said "I wouldn't be back", I said "I wouldn't get drawn into a debate about the state of the PC industry with someone that ignores facts". You even make up more lies claiming I am somehow Montrealien's friend and further imply I had communications with Montrealien, I have never communicated with him in my life (no offence Montrealien), yet here you are spouting more lies.

Therefore what you stated was complete RUBBISH, you of course can speculate as much as you like. However speculation is NOT fact. Epic have already explained that they have NO intention of abandoning the PC yet because they don't mention the PC every five seconds you think they have abandoned it. I mean use your brain they are part of the PCGA you know the PC Gamers Alliance, yet here you are saying they have ditched the PC ??? It certainly doesn't look like that to me but of course you don't like silly little things like FACTS get in the way of a nice bit of misinformation you could spread eh.

As for yanking my chain, meh I don't actually get that hot under the collar with people that don't check their facts. I have seen your kind since the the 8 bit days. Yeah we heard the same crap then you know "PC's dying". We have been hearing it for 20 odd years, I have no doubt we will still be hearing it 20 years from now. Just goes to show all console fanboys have is lies and misinformation really which sums you up nicely.

The fact you so rabidly tried to defend yourself against the indefensible shows you KNOW you got it wrong. You come up with this intricate conspiracy like "microsoft sent the heavy boys around to epic" when in reality it was just a simple "miscommunication" which they corrected but you won't accept it.

Still at the end of the day at least you have finally shut up now. Things could have been so much nicer if you had just acknowledged you got it WRONG, but no your ego couldn't take that could it ?

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Mr Bun - 512 days 14 hours ago

hahahahaha...nice!
Fat people are funny!

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