310°

Factor 5 To Game Developers: Make the PS3 Version First

Eggebrecht comments on the number of development studios who have so far complained that programming games for the PS3 is far too difficult in comparison to the 360. In his opinion, the majority of these complaints come from development teams who try to port games from the 360 to the PS3 instead of doing it the other way around.

OC_MurphysLaw6240d ago (Edited 6240d ago )

Was the group of Sony VP's who were controlling the strings to this puppet. I am sorry ...but what a load of PR crap. This "interview" is more like a Sony advotorial than an actual interview. I especially love the "develop for the PS3 first not second comment". (rolling eyes) yeah that totally makes sense right now for most of the 3rd party devs out there.

LSDARBY6240d ago

You cant win with people like you around if someone like F5 say it, xbots are like theyre basically sony, if EA were to say it "Ea dont know what theyre on about Sh*t game devs". But if someone from Ubisoft were to say it they'd be right on the ball cus they arent biased at all :rollseyes: :P

OC_MurphysLaw6240d ago

Actually you are dead wrong... When Epic tried to say Gears of War could only be done on the 360 way back when I rolled my eyes too. Fact of the matter these systems are far more similar than either camp wants to admit.

I just am laughing at this article in particular because well...its pretty blatant with regards to the "pro" Sony news.

I am pretty even when it comes to handing out praise for games. I think Lair is going to be a very good game. I still have questions around it but it definitely is good. I also thought RFOM and Motorstorm are both excellent games for the PS3. And if you bothered to see my post in the FEAR comparison I stated pretty much exactly what I am saying here...the systems are very comparable.

I know you feel I am an xbot...you have your opinion...but I am about as partial as anyone here when it comes to good games. This article...was a joke of an interview. enough said.

Torch6240d ago

What existential facts or evidence substantiate your harsh accusations?

I'm seriously asking because I'd honestly like to hear why.

InMyOpinion6239d ago (Edited 6239d ago )

What else can they say, really? Suddenly, all Ps3 developers come out to say how much they're enjoying developing for it.
Hmmm...could this have anything to do with the criticism a while ago about the Ps3's architecture being difficult to work with?
I'm a bit suspicous about all these statements from developers. They feel biased to me. Too obvious. I'd like to hear someone who has developed for both the 360/Ps3 to give his/her opinion instead.

And yes Dlacy13g, people on this site sometimes seem blind to the fact that both MS and Sony (Nintendo too) are moneyhungry multinational corporations who would do or say anything to get you to buy their products. They don't care about you, only about where your money goes.

@Virtual Gamer. Thx, really nice interview. He was completely unbiased.

VirtualGamer6239d ago

Here you go a Xbox and Xbox 360 developer who is making their first PS3 game.

http://www.gameinformer.com...

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 6239d ago
GameJunkieJim6240d ago

We get it, the PS3 is hard to port to because it doesn't have unified memory.

That's Sony's fault isn't it?

Enough of this story.

DJ6240d ago

That's actually wrong. Unified Memory has very large performance deficits due to the fact that both the CPU and GPU access the same pool of memory. This leads to lower bandwidth and more issues for developers since they don't have a set amount of RAM for the CPU or GPU -> they can end up fighting for resources. The other downside is the usage of one memory type, in this case GDDR3. GDDR3 RAM has high bandwidth, but high latency as well. This aspect is well suited for GPU's since they access large amounts of data, but not very often. CPUs on the other hand are constantly accessing small chunks of data.

Split Memory Pool also has an issue, which is communication between the two memory pools and processors. Sony and Rambus fixed this problem by putting a 30GB/s dedicated bandwidth line between Cell and RSX, as well as a total of 48GB/s of bandwidth to their memory pools. Plus XDR RAM runs at 3.2GHz, so that helps as well.

Unified Memory Architecture is just a fancy term that Microsoft likes to throw around as being superior; sadly, that's just not the case.

TylerDurden6239d ago

that is why I am always replying to what you post. What you say doesn't seem to make sense. It would seem that Unified Memory would be better and would result in less contention for resources. What if the GPU needs more than 256 MB of RAM but the CPU doesn't? In the split model there would be a resource issue, and in the unified model there wouldn't. The only way a resource issue pops up on unified if more than 512 mb is needed. Split model issues can crop up if either need 256MB regardless of how much overall memory is needed.

It would seem the likelihood of a resource issue is greater on the split model.

CG6239d ago

Thats why the latest and future ATI and NVIDIA graphics cards has/will have UNIFIED architecture!!!!!!! you are so full of sh@t, you dumb moron!!!

GameJunkieJim6239d ago

Sorry, but if any piece of graphic data needs say, 300 MB of RAM, the PS3 is out of luck. And you can have the fattest pipe in the world, but does it compare to having integrated EDRAM ready for swap?

I think not.

DJ6239d ago

"In a game, the most memory consuming process is graphics.
Tranditionally, we process graphics by doing the following:

1) Loading data from South Bridge to system RAM,
2) CPU load comand and data from system RAM and store GPU command and result back to system RAM,
3) CPU copies the GPU command and result data to video RAM,
4) GPU process the GPU command and result to build up the graphic and output it.

When you look at this, Unified Memory has an advantange of saving a move, which is to copy data from system memory to video memory, since system RAM is Video RAM.

However you don't have to do so with PS3. Since Cell is so damn fast we can do JIT instead by buffering. So the process becomes the following instead.

1) CPU load command directly into SPU and data to system RAM,
2) GPU command and Result generated from SPU got directly copy into video RAM
3) GPU process the GPU command and result to build up the graphic and output it. If you look at this carefully you will find this is a even faster process then unified RAM.

Since commands are copy directly into SPU, so time for copy CPU command to system RAM, and time for caching the command in CPU is totally out of the picture in PS3."

----------------------------- ------
Split vs. Unified Memory arguments are usually based on the assumption that Cell is an x86 or PowerPC processor, when in reality it's quite different. Arguments also 'forget' about the dedicated FlexI/O connection between the CPU and GPU in the PS3.

RSX actually has XDR RAM Communication Logic built-in, AND has twice the texture/lighting cache of ATI's Xenos GPU (I'm assuming this is their best offering). What this means is that PS3's Split Memory pools are actually unified through a 30GB/s connection. In addition to this, developers are using Cell to set up RSX functions such as back-face culling, rasterization, texturing, and even complex GPU functions.

The best part is that when the RSX accesses XDR RAM, it isn't dealing with the high-latency of GDDR3 RAM. Yes, this is more complex for PS3 developers initially, but the benefits it brings are massive. It leaves the RSX free to concentrate on complex shader routines. Xenos has unified shaders which can switch between vertex and shader routines, while RSX has a distinct emphasis on shaders over vertices. The reason they could get away with this is because Cell and FlexI/O were thrown into the equation. The guys over at Ninja Theory are pushing something like 3~4 million polygons per scene, and that's without Cell-based assistance for vertex functions.

----------------------------- -------------
As the Mature, and always eloquent CG stated: "Thats why the latest and future ATI and NVIDIA graphics cards has/will have UNIFIED architecture!!!!!!! you are so full of sh@t, you dumb moron!!!"

Unified Shaders are brand new technology, and they haven't been fully developed. There are still performance issues, but the benefit is that developers can focus more and more and shader routines since polygon counts are increasing so much. However, the RSX was built as the pinaccle of Dedicated Architecture and has aspects that even the more recent Unified GPUs lack in, such as lighting and vertex cache.

Cell also helps in RSX's performance, and this is the reason why nVidia was forced to post two sets of performance benchmarks for RSX: one with RSX by itself, and the other when connected to Cell.

achira6239d ago

DJ is very correct. everyone will say that who has any idea of the stuff. CG you dont understand what you are saying. unified shaders are not the same as the unified memory! unified memory is not as effective as splitet memory but faster and easier to program. the ps3 has a big advantage at that.

GameJunkieJim6239d ago

Let's take Oblivion. Launch title for the 360, and a damn near perfect port to the PS3.

Or is it?

The PS3 has a lack of video memory and usable processing memory, something Oblivion swaps in between at a very high rate in general gameplay in the 360 version.

This is why the 360 version is playable off of a disc alone, and the PS3 version not only cuts some draw distance, but has to install 95% of the game to the hard drive. Check it, the game is barely 4.7 GB, and it takes up that much on the HD. If you're unlucky enough to have a 20GB PS3, that means that only 4 games of that caliber will be playable on the system. The 360's shared RAM allows for the game to use it as it needs it, for whichever purpose it deems, and doesn't require an extra step of loading anything to a hard drive. It's RAM is more useful.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 6239d ago
SmokeyMcBear6240d ago

ok. developers want to make money correct? The user base has grown for both consoles, ps3 is over 3 million, and 360 is almost at 11 million in peoples homes right now. A game developer is not going to ignore 3 million potential customers, its safe to say a developer will want to put a game on both consoles.. right.. still with me? Ok, what costs more to develop for, more man hours?.. porting a 360 game to the ps3, or a ps3 game to the 360.? It says it is much easier to design a game with a ps3 system in mind, then place it on a 360, then the other way around. Its pretty simple. If a developer wants to cut costs and spend the least amount of time developing for both systems, it is much easier to put a game based on ps3 architecture over to a 360 than a 360 architecture over to a ps3. That is all that is being said, don't understand what there is to flame about.

masterg6240d ago

And 3 million will triple if not more in the time it takes to develop a game. Sony has so many games which are sequels from ps2/ps1. This type of game sells much more consoles than new titles.

frostbite066239d ago

Microsoft has a lot of games which are sequels from the ps1/ps2 too. : )

Odion6240d ago

They could just ignore the PS3

TheXgamerLive6240d ago (Edited 6240d ago )

Why does the same 3 or 4 postings keep apearing every few days? Is this all the so called good positive ps3 news, and it's not even true/correct news.

Don't get me wrong, there's good news out there about the ps3, I just wish that's what we saw instead of repeats. This is iritating.

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270°

Top 10 Bad Games by Good Studios

Alex S. from Link-Cable writes: "When shopping for new video games you can often trust the name publisher or developer on the box to be an indication of the quality of the game. Names like Nintendo, Square Enix, Sony Interactive Entertainment, Capcom, Xbox Game Studios and Sega are world famous because they helped shape the industry by releasing some of the most defining video games of all time. Though sometimes even these great gaming houses stumble and put out a stinker."

Read Full Story >>
link-cable.com
Gamerking821412d ago (Edited 1412d ago )

Splatterhouse remake . Loved the og’s at the arcade growing up . Hell the best thing about the remake was the og,s were included . And left alive by Square . That game had so much potential , but the gameplay was worse horrendous .

Game-ur1412d ago

once Great studios getting destroyed is actually common. happened with ND and Last of Us2, Bioware and Mass Effect Andromeda/Anthem, Bungle and Destiny .

BeRich2331412d ago

Fuse should have been on that list (Insomniac Games)

Yui_Suzumiya1412d ago

Splatterhouse remake kicked ass

merryja1412d ago

I personally don't like these games.

East76lands1412d ago

I'm pretty much certain that any Sonic game that comes out will be terrible, I've not enjoyed one since the original side-scrolling days of the MegaDrive.

HarryMasonHerpderp1412d ago

Then you might like a recent sonic "sonic mania".

jaymacx1412d ago

For this Topic it says Good Studios that make bad games. Sonic Team hasn't been good in years.

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300°

5 Disappointing Games and the Great Studios That Should Remake Them

A reimagining of 5 disappointing video games and the masterpieces they could have been underneath other studios.

Read Full Story >>
findyourinnergeek.ca
FallenAngel19841889d ago

How often do disappointing games get remakes

darthv721889d ago (Edited 1889d ago )

well... if disappointing movies can get remakes then why not games? some of these have really good premise but somewhat disappointing execution. In the right hands they could be great.

I quite enjoyed lair (after the patch), too human and the order 1886. I'd even add in quantum break and recore as disappointing but with a good premise.

gangsta_red1889d ago

"well... if disappointing movies can get remakes then why not games?"

But how many disappointing movies actually get those? I'm still waiting for a remake of Howard the Duck.

darthv721889d ago

^nothing disappointing about howard the duck. It is cheesy 80's goodness.

gangsta_red1889d ago

When you're right, you're right.

rainslacker1888d ago

@Gangsta

Wasn't there a rumor that they were looking at making another Howard the Duck? He had a cameo in GoTG2.

Love that movie for how bad it was. That and Garbage Pail Kids.

DrumBeat1888d ago

The Order was a fresh experience. Not the most compelling game, but I didn't want to put it down, and platted it. Good for what it was.

Quantum was something different as well, but a little less fun to actually play, imo. The 'acting' was done in a cheese factory too. Completed one path and never returned to it.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1888d ago
pietro12121889d ago (Edited 1889d ago )

FFXIV was already remade, and it's probably the beat thing Square has put out in years.

notachance1889d ago

yes, I was giving an example of disappointing games remade to be a great game

thorstein1889d ago

Every time sites need clicks. Just look at the obligatory: i wAnT cLIcKs tEh OrDer 1886 pIcTUrE.

JonathanHarris1888d ago

It's really not super often, but it does happen!

Mostly we see cult favorites come back around but in the recent case of Shaq-Fu we really saw a truly awful game see new life (not great life but at least new).

It's something I'd love to see a lot more of.

Thanks for reading my article!

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 1888d ago
1889d ago Replies(4)
NarutoFox1889d ago

Too Human yeah I remember that game smh😂

Inzo1889d ago

The Order has its faults yes but it had a fantastic atmosphere and some great gameplay. A game with enormous potential and far from disappointing. I say give Ready at Dawn another crack at it because I think they created an diamond with some rough edges that just needs some tlc.

Dreamcatcher451889d ago

Problem was the repetitive boss fights. I liked the gunplay, cover system and somewhat the story.

hulk_bash19871889d ago (Edited 1889d ago )

It did have fantastic atmosphere, I'll give you that. But gameplay pretty much played out like short gunfire segments interlaced with walking/sneaking + QTE events. Gameplay was the weakest point of The Order because RAD prioritized world building and graphical detail. Ut was disappointing because it didnt live up to the massive potential it haf. If they were given another shot at a sequel, I hope they can learn from their mistakes.

notachance1889d ago

gameplay was meh but the world had potential, in my ideal world it'd have Mass Effect kind of gameplay

Prubar1889d ago

I waited till The Order was discounted and went in with certain expectations and wasn’t disappointed. Just like Quantum Break. Great concept just needed a little extra meat on the bones.

rainslacker1888d ago

I had high hopes before it released. They were curbed some by the early previews, and while I found faults with the game, and it was obviously released unfinished, I still enjoyed it. The lore, acting, graphics, and world itself were excellent.

JonathanHarris1888d ago

I agree that it had some awesome atmosphere and the gameplay wasn't awful, but that potential is exactly why I put it on this list. I actually loved playing the game (same as some of the other games I put on this list such as Army of Two) But I would just love to see what could happen if it fulfilled some of that potential, ya know? Could have had the next incredible Sony franchise to rival God of War.

Thanks for reading my article!

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1888d ago
TheEnigma3131889d ago

The order should have had a sequel. The first one wasn't bad just needed a few tweaks.

robtion1888d ago

I would love a sequel to The Order. It is still a great game.

Lair had a great concept and could be amazing with the current technology available. A Lair-like ps5 game could be incredible.

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700°

15 Worst PlayStation Exclusive Games of All Time

PlayStation’s strong and impressive lineup of exclusives is probably the biggest edge it has over its direct competition in the market- a fact that has been true for as long as anyone can remember.

Read Full Story >>
gamingbolt.com
TheEnigma3132176d ago

Ridge racer for PSP was actually good and shouldn't be on this list. I think I'm the only one that enjoyed Haze.

Mr Pumblechook2176d ago

When GamingBolt have to dig up PS1 & PS2 games you know Sony is doing something right.

PygmelionHunter2176d ago

The list is about the worst Playstation exclusives games OF ALL TIME...

Why wouldn’t they include PS1 and PS2 games?

Prince_TFK2176d ago

That’s right, only PS4 games should be on the list of the worst Sony exclusive games of all time. /s

Dragonscale2176d ago

As much as I like PlayStation, there are plenty of stinkers just like on all platforms tbh.

hulk_bash19872176d ago (Edited 2176d ago )

Haha you completely missed or are willfully ignorant of the intent of this article. It clearly says worst PS Exclusive Games of All Time.

2175d ago
UltraNova2175d ago

A Haze 2 or reboot would be nice!

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 2175d ago
NonShinyGoose2176d ago

RR on Vita made the list, not the PSP version. RR on Vita was severely lacking content.

Knushwood Butt2176d ago

They tried something new and it failed.

The initial price point was low but a large amount of content was locked behing DLC

These days you often pay full price up front and get the same concept.

Darkwatchman2176d ago (Edited 2176d ago )

Didn’t the list just have ridge racer on Vita? Because the Vita ridge racer was a dumpster fire at $40 with next to no cars or tracks. It was such an incomplete experience. As the article states, it felt more like a full priced demo than an actual game. Psp ridge racer had so much more to it.

SierraGuy2175d ago (Edited 2175d ago )

All early ridge racers had next to no cars...game was great because of its graphics, controls, fun factor. Nothing could touch it on PS1.

mrdeli2176d ago

When this piece of flotsam indicated that "Being a clone of GTA shouldn't be that hard" I just closed the window.

2176d ago Replies(4)
Liqu1d2176d ago

The most disappointing game I have ever played.

madforaday2176d ago

Socom 4, I guess you could say that was an AWFUL/TERRIBLE Socom game. BUT it was an okay game if it didn't have the word Socom in the title.

Gardenia2176d ago

To save you from clicking those annoying slides:

HAZE (PS3)
LAIR (PS3)
KNACK (PS4)
RIDGE RACER (PS VITA)
TWISTED METAL III (PS1)
LAST REBELLION (PS3)
BRAVO TEAM (PS4)
BASEMENT CRAWL (PS4)
MORTAL KOMBAT: SPECIAL FORCES (PS1)
GANGS OF LONDON (PSP)
LITTLE DEVIANTS (PS VITA)
PLAYSTATION MOVE APE ESCAPE (PS3)
APE ESCAPE ACADEMY (PSP)
KUNG FU RIDER (PS3)
EYETOY: OPERATION SPY (PS2)

solideagle2176d ago

thank you for the list. I believe he should listed PSVR titles as VR....

yeahright22176d ago

I love when people do this to sites that try to artificially up their clicks by forcing one click per entry. But I will say maybe let's leave off the first entry so they get the one click. Both so N4g gets whatever they're due for pushing traffic to their site and to send a message to the site that you only get one click.

Gaming_1st2176d ago

Well everybody should have gamingbolt blocked anyways.

Dragonscale2176d ago

Don't need to. I avoid it like the plague regardless lol.

Hardiman2176d ago

When certain sites have articles on here I just look at the comments.

FinalFantasyFanatic2175d ago

Sites are lucky if I click once or twice, half a dozen or more clicks is more effort than I'm willing for a list that may or may not suck.

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Gaming_1st2176d ago

I feel Knack or Ridge Racer shouldn't be on there.

Dragonscale2176d ago (Edited 2176d ago )

Maybe not knack but it's understandable, its not the best game tbh. Dunno bout ridge racer.

SierraGuy2175d ago

Ridge racer should never be on a worst list. FU gaming bolt crap.

Stogz2176d ago

Cant argue with Bravo Team, that game really did suck.

GBG_Jason2176d ago

Bless. I stopped after 1 because of it.

KwietStorm_BLM2176d ago

Have to say that is a pretty crappy list. I remember being so pissed with Twisted Metal 3 after TM2.

OffRoadKing2175d ago (Edited 2175d ago )

You're doing Gods work. Many blessings upon the house of Gardenia.

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