Former Valve Employee: Steam was Killing PC Gaming, Epic Games is Saving It

Andrew M writes: "Former Valve employee Richard Geldreich has taken to Twitter in support of the Epic Games Store, going as far as to say it is saving PC gaming."

[Christopher]

If there's one thing Epic has done is to kick Steam into improving its own platform more. So many articles in the last few months about things Valve is doing to improve Steam. Opinion on whether Epic is good or bad aside, it's obviously something Steam is aware of and is combating by implementing things they could have done years ago.

[SuperSonic91]

100 % agree.
That how you turn negative into a positive. Bad to good.

[WombBat]

This guy is right. Ive been saying it for a while: price of games has been the same for 25 years, theres inflation, cost of development has risen exponentially from 10 people to 200 people, and steam taking 30% is just not sustainable. There is a reason microtransactions are always tacked on. Steam's greedy 30% cut as the middle man must go.

[fiveby9]

Where was this problem 2 years ago? Valve has not been killing PC gaming, they provide a robust platform for both sellers and buyers. Valve helped provide stability in the PC marketplace. EIPC seeks to just replace Steam with EGS. Don't kid yourself they are doing this for gamer's best interest. Valve can do better for sure. But EPIC paying to wall off content goes against the open platform of the PC. I'm all for storefronts offering better deals for their suppliers (e.g. publishers) but paying to limit consumer choice is wrong. Imagine the outcry from EPIC if VALVE was paying to keep games off EGS. They'd be crying afoul too. When EPIC stops walling off content by bribing publishers with Fortnite money then I'll consider their store. But till then, no way.

[Seraphim]

@Wombat

The price of games has, for the most part, remained the same yes but sales have also gotten better over the years. Even between PS2/XB/GC era and now software sales are dramatically better. Something to consider. Also the cost of development can vary dramatically as well. It depends on what they're making, what the expected sales are, etc.

[UltraNova]

Will Lord Gabe order something Half Life now? That is the question!

[Dragonscale]

@ultra, really hope so but I wouldn't hold my breath.

[WombBat]

@seraphim

Do you honestly think that is a viable strategy? How risky is that? Only a few games year crack multi millions of sales a year, and sometimes they end up breaking even still. This is why the AA game has somewhat been eliminated in the modern era, and indie gaming is usually a fruitless venture. If there's an equation for how to ease the risk of game development and ease of forcing developers to work ridiculous hours because of budget constraints, then its taking the money back from the middle man(steam) and raising the price of games.

[DaDrunkenJester]

I love what Epic is doing with their larger cuts for devs. I don't like the gorilla warfare of buying up so many timed exclusives, but it's part of the business and I understand that. What I don't like is how piss poor their marketplace is and their lack of security. If they are going to really damage Steam they need to step up their storefront and features.

[porkChop]

You're absolutely right. The Epic Store is far from perfect and needs serious improvement. But it's clearly keeping Valve on their toes and pushing them to be better and do better. That's good for everyone.

[CaptainCook]

It's about time Steam has competition. Value should be creating more triple A games like Half life 3 instead of sitting back doing nothing.

[porkChop]

This is exactly what I've been trying to get across to people. Steam has been stagnant for so long. Every time a new store pops up they improve, but only a little bit. They largely haven't seen any real competition. This is what we've needed. Valve needed a kick in the pants to get back on track. This is good for all of us, whether we use the Epic Store or not. Competition pushes all companies to do better.

[TekoIie]

"This is exactly what I've been trying to get across to people. Steam has been stagnant for so long."

Really? Guess I just imagined Cloud saves, Steam Workshop, profile pages customisation, trading cards/badges, SteamOS and The Curator system. You have to be living under a rock if you believe Valve has been doing absolutely nothing to improve their client over the years.

Just scroll through this and you'll consistently see they've been updating Steam throughout it's lifetime all before Epic took their launcher seriously: https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/...

[opc]

there's also Steam Controller, Steam Input that allows customization of every controller imaginable, in-home streaming, streaming anywhere, family sharing, and next month Valve Index and Knuckles controllers.

They literally have more features than any other company out there, consoles included.

[jeki]

Have you even seen an unmoderated discussion forum and what it turns in to? It becomes unfixable. That's what Steam is now.

A recent fix comes to mind, the review bomb mechanism they put in place; the fact that they even need to implement something like that shows how systemic the problem really is.

All Valve Corporation can do now is add some features and tweak some others. Steam is beyond repair.

[dumahim]

It removes the rating, but the comments are still there to be read. They've got more work to be done there.

[rainslacker]

The rating thing shouldn't be required, but people think it's right to judge a game on stupid stuff about policies in gaming. It's one thing if it affects the game itself, but in this case it really doesn't affect the actual game. People need to find more productive ways to Express themselves, instead of taking it out on the product or the dev.

Having to remove the bad reviews just assumes all the bad reviews are bombs, as opposed to making it where the score is more reflective of actual usee experience.

[Parasyte]

It is another perfect example of competition being good for the industry

[Wolffenblitz]

Can't call it competition. Everyone keeps saying it, but it isnt.

[TekoIie]

Where were you when Tomb Raider was a timed exclusive?

[rainslacker]

@tek

This is more equivalent to gamestop or Amazon getting a game to sell exclusively. The end user isn't precluded from playing outside their refusal to shop at the store itself.

ROTTR actually restricted the game from the platform itself, and there were plenty of people that complained. Just like there are plenty of people complaining now

[TekoIie]

@rainslacker

But competition is always good so they had no reason to complain, right?

[JesusBuiltmyHotrod]

HUH? Steam was always improving constantly before epic came around?

[rainslacker]

No doubt. Steam has had a bunch of mini controversies, or problems that come up due to policy changes, and despite its popularity it has a lot of people who like using it, but find some things really annoying. It's not unlike blizzard, here you have big fans, but they always have something to complain about.

[Araragifeels]

That a damn lie. Steam helped PC gaming become what it is today. Epic Games is not saving PC gaming but just another competitor.

Epic Games who started PC gaming war because they buying out games and making it exclusive to their launcher. A launcher that is slacking many modern features that other competitor already have. Plus they stealing steam player data. Epic Games should start making games again.

Steam need to start lowering the percentage of how much they take from the developers because 30% is too much. It might not affect Steam right now but they need start thinking for the future. Also steam just start making games again too.

[killswitch80]

That 's a lie as well with stealing data. https://www.usgamer.net/art...

[KyRo]

Steam did help PC gaming, correct but they have done nothing worth noting for how many years now? They had become lazy from lack of competition. Epic might not have the feature set that steam has but lets not foget how barebones steam was when it first launched either.

Even if you dislike the way Epic games are going about things, if theres anything good to come out of it, it will be valve needing the massive boot up its arse its needed for so long now.

[Hungryalpaca]

The barebones launch isn’t an excuse. Steam/origin/Uplay has had these features for years. epic should have implemented them from the get go.

[Tankbusta40]

PC gaming was alive and well before Steam came along...it wouldn't have died if Steam never existed.

[Teflon02]

It really wasn't though. It was a messy market that most didn't want to touch because it was too much trouble. PC games barely could break even in the past. Steam gave a easily accessible platform on both ends. Buyers had a proper gaming hub, and didn't have to deal with as much technical problems as Steam keeps track and deals with the instillation stuff for the most part. While it being a platform for games, it allowed Devs to have games in a platform that was dedicated to gamers. So even people who haven't heard of your game, have a chance to see it etc. PC gaming couldn't have died because outside of MMO's PC gaming never lived until Steam

[HaVoK308]

Both can be true.

[Nerdmaster]

People say 30% is too much. But when you're buying a physical version, what percentage of the that money goes to the publisher? There's the cost for the disk, the package, transport, store's profit... Would the cost be that different from Steam getting 30%?

[dumahim]

It's old data, but it appears the retailer took 25% or $15 of the $60 price tag. The publisher wound up with about $27. Steam is taking a bigger cut that a physical retailer. Sure it can be said the publisher is getting a bigger cut now thanks to Steam's system, but I think there's an argument to be made as to how much the digital middleman should get. I do think 30% is too steep.
https://kotaku.com/what-you...

[rainslacker]

General retail market is between $15-20, for a $60 game. It will vary based on number of copies purchased, as well as if they're buying it direct(big stores with buying power) or getting it through a distributor.

The difference for publishers is that those sales are done, and they get alm their money up front, as returns aren't usually a thing if the store over orders.

Stores have significantly more overhead unless they're online only, and it's why gamestop has tried to sell everything under the sun in addition to regular gaming. The largest gaming store in the world, who sells the most game software, can't manage to keep its doors open by selling just new games, along with more traditional things.

The monthly operating costs if steam are probably equivalent to 3-4 retail gamestop stores. Other costs are involved, but certainly not to the tune of 30% of a a few billion dollars a year. Especially since steam doesn't do anything particularly special to sell or promote those games with additional payments provided by the publisher, whereas a retail store will typically advertise more for longer. About the only thing steam has is the new releases page as a listing. But those highlighted titles are usually played for. Even apple and Google do those kinds of promotions for free

[rainslacker]

And MS had made PC usage what it is today. Doesn't mean they have a perfect system, despite improvements over the years. I hear plenty of people who like steam that still have problems with it.

The killing of gaming being discussed here is about the cut that valve takes. Its unreasonable. Even retail outlets are lucky to get that nig of a cut, and that's if they buy in bulk. Yet the cost to run a retail outlet are significantly higher.

No one is dismissing the things valve does right, or taking credit away from what they've done for PC gaming, just saying that they havent improved in some areas that are better for the developers or publishers.

Epic isn't saving PC gaming, but their game engine significantly lowered the cost of development for longer than steam had been around, and is the model used by all other SDK based game engines nowadays. Both companies have done good. Both companies have done bad. They can both improve.

[slavish0]

Steam needs to compete. They need to get out their high castle and do something. I don't understand why people arent mad at their lack of action

[Baza]

A little competition comes to town and Steam is folding up like banquet chairs. Valve even admitted Steam alone isn’t sustainable anymore to keep Valve afloat. You guys should be happy cause now we get HF3 we been waiting over 10 years for.

[Wolffenblitz]

It's not competition if you buy away the other runners.

[neoandrew]

Well no, in business view, it is competition.

[neoandrew]

Epic store tries to compete with steam.

[SegaGamer]

What lack of action? I keep seeing this crap and I have not seen a single person give good examples.

Honestly, I think the people that say this don't even use Steam or play games very often on pc.

[SegaGamer]

And just like the other day, I ask the question, and nobody can answer. It just sums N4G up really, most people on here just make stuff up to suit their agenda.

[Shikoku]

People believe it's the fact Steam charges too much is why Epic is getting exclusives and they want to see them lower their take from 30%.

[slate91]

Monopolies are never good. Hopefully Epic can improve to rival steam. Outside of all the hacking/chinese theories out there.

[Elwenil]

You need to look up the definition of "monopoly".

[Baza]

What’s your point?

[jeki]

It's a monopoly for PC games, for the most part.

[Elwenil]

You people are hilarious. Either you are completely ignorant of the meaning of "monopoly" and are just running wild with a buzzword you heard somewhere or you haven't bought a PC game in your life. You can buy PC games anywhere. There is no one retailer for PC games in any region, so there is no monopoly. There are hundreds of places to buy PC games, even before Epic ever thought of putting up their incredibly basic version of a web store. You can buy at GoG, GamersGate, Steam, various publisher's stores, GameStop, Amazon, hell you can even buy PC games at BestBuy and Walmart. So how is Steam a monopoly again? Just because one store is popular with buyers doesn't mean it's a monopoly. The very fact that people are free to choose the store they like best, in this case usually Steam, means there is no monopoly. You people with your disagrees and asinine comments are like a circus run by monkeys. The very idea of calling Steam's presence in the obviously huge PC gaming market a monopoly is ludicrous.

[WelkinCole]

@Elwenil Agree but you didn't need to be so harsh man

[jeki]

@Elwenil

There aren't hundreds of places to buy PC games, there are a handful, so you are mistaken right there. Saying people are hilarious and their opinions are ludicrous indicates that you're a troll, or at least talk like one.

[Elwenil]

@jeki,

So you are saying that around the world there are only "a handful" of places to buy PC games? Be serious. An no, I am not a troll. A troll would say things to get a rise out of people for kicks. I am saying factual things to correct either your ignorance or to at least draw attention to the fact that you are ignoring facts because they don't fit your chosen narrative. And yes, it is hilarious that people go so far out of their way to ignore the obvious just so they can bitch and moan about something they obviously do not know anything about. It's every bit as funny as those "flat earth" lunatics. If anything, anyone with common sense would think that you are a troll since you are purposefully denying facts in evidence to everyone in order to push your argument which is completely invalidated by said facts. Again, look up the definition and explain to everyone how Steam still fits your narrative that they are engaged in a monopoly.

[jeki]

@Elwenil

"Be serious...your ignorance...ignoring facts because they don't fit your chosen narrative...lunatics...anyone with common sense"

i am the troll...I am purposefully denying facts...and on and on.

I'm not interested in debating you. Bye.

[Elwenil]

@jeki,

You aren't interested in debating it because you have no ground to stand on.

[dumahim]

Look up the definition of an effective monopoly. Sure that's even probably a bit of a stretch, but the quick search I did I could see that Steam had 75% of the market back in 2013. I think it's safe to assume that number hasn't gone down from that in the last 5 years.

[rainslacker]

It's an oligopoly. Except that steam controls almost the entire market, as opposed to having a few companies which control it. However with uplay and origin, and maybe GOG, it could be that by definition.

Considering that smaller competitors do have a hard time breaking in, as seems epic is if you go by opinions online, I think the original poster is pretty close to accurate, even if he wasn't aware of the distinction....which you could have informed him on instead of dismissing his intent.

Steams "monopoly" isn't unlike MS with windows, and how they had almost total control of the PC market, and almost all the word processing market. Other markets couldn't get in. Until the mobile devices became popular, and suddenly ms was losing lots of market share. First they tried to jump in that market, then they tried to mimic it, then they just finally improved their products.

Steam has always been better than ms, by a wide margin. But even steam fans have plenty to gripe about going by steam forums. People like the service, but steam isn't always quick to address concerns of the customers or developers, and often tend to bounce around from one policy to another, sometimes without notice or reason. They're reactionary to things which affect their business, but not to the consumers or devs themselves.

[fiveby9]

I am not blindly loyal to Steam. I was initially glad to see EPIC enter the market. However, since that announcement, EPIC has really destroyed any goodwill. They seek to limit consumer choice by paying to keep their product off another storefront. I'd no more support Valve doing that. It tells me EPIC can't really compete based on features at this time. Had EPIC provided a good deal for devs and passed on savings to customers it would be fair. But instead, they pay publishers to not sell elsewhere. That's not exactly a free and fair market. Steam could do better, sure. But EPIC is creating a terrible precedent in the PC market. For the time being, I chose not to support EPIC as it will only make the problem worse.

[slate91]

Thats a good stance. I also don't think this route epic has chosen with buying exclusives is sustainable. So it will catch up to them in the end if they don't build a good platform.

[rainslacker]

I think the issue with epic right now, it's that just having the lower cut wouldn't be enough of an incentive to get publishers to keep content on their store only. As an option, sure, but steam has too much market share to ignore, and it's unlikely the loss in sales from the smaller customer base would be made up with the smaller cut.

So, for the time being, this is the best way epic has to compete and get the customer base to actually compete.

It isn't good for those that want the features that come along with steam, but hopefully epic can improve that, and do so quickly. I have a feeling though that if epic launch almost all the important features, if not some better ones, people would still find something to be negative about. Epic has gotten more criticism the past couple years due to fortnite's popularity, which is baffling considering that epic has generally never been against the consumer, and tends to make popular and well made products.

[Hungryalpaca]

Steam isn’t a monopoly. There’s a ton of online stores to suit your needs. Don’t want DRM? go to GOG. You have Uplay, Origin, humble, etc

Steam just happens to be the most refined service available.

A monopoly is basically when there isn’t another option. PC has tons of options.

[killswitch80]

Epic is bringing AAA publishers back to publishing to dedicated store fronts on pc or keeping them from leaving and creating their own Store front Launchers. I know people dont want to believe it but every large publisher was slowly leaving Steam.

[Teflon02]

You realize that epics not stopping them from doing that right. If a dev is big enough and wanted to, they will. Example, Overwatch is a case where being on a dedicated launcher was always going to be a win, steam nor epic can benefit the game enough to make it better for the devs to be on those launchers. It's about the games they bring to the table. That's why Ubi games still show up on steam in alot of cases. They couldn't carry it, but made the games rely on them so they can transition once people had Uplay accounts. They even do it on consoles. Origin makes sense with the amount EA owns, and wasn't going to be stopped because Epic takes smaller percentages etc. I find it funny that people even defend epic. the same people who think they should be allowed to have Fortnite on Android but don't want to share the profits so force you to allow permission to third party stuff so you can play. So they're telling you take the chance and compromise your phone instead of sharing the profit with the platform holder. Yet they share with everyone else lol. Epics just scum

[Uglyday]

Ya major ones like Bethesda that just crawled back to Steam with its tail between its legs.

[Hungryalpaca]

That doesn’t even solve the issue. You’re still forced to download the Publishers launcher anyway. All epic did was add one more place to add your credit card.

[otakuapologist]

More evil companies competing to service customers, results in good things for customers. Lower prices, better service. Free market magic in effect.

[DarkZane]

Epic Game Store will only stay relevant until Steam decide to drop the share it takes to have games on its platforms. If Steam decides to drop their share from 30% to 12%, Epic Game Store will definitely just die since no one will want to go exclusive with them anymore.

[jeki]

I wouldn't be so sure about that.

[Hungryalpaca]

They wouldn’t be able to compete with steam at that point. They’d have to completely improve the service to match steam or have more incentives. Which they currently do not.

[rainslacker]

Doubt it would die. Epic is picking up market share, and even with a lower cut, it's mostly like being paid to not do much. Developing features and maintaining servers costs money, but it's a drop in the bucket in the potential revenue out there.

And if it does die, then what? Steam just raises its cut again, claiming they can't operate in steam alone. A company which brings in billions in revenue, which they take a large cut, and has relatively low operating costs. They're already saying that steam can't sustain valve alone, despite their cut being more than most developers make off a game, with a yearly budget which is probably nowhere close to a AAA games budget.

Epic almost has to stick around at this point, because I'd they can't make something happen, then who can? Even MS with their windows store integrated into the most well known and used OS in the world can't compete with Steam or break their virtual monopoly.

I just want them all to be better. Nothing wrong with competition. Epic just rushed their store to the market after fortnite's success. Epic seems to have done that because of the 30% cut of steam, and Sweeny tends to be the kind of person to speak out or act on things he feel isn't right in the industry. However, he's never really viewed exclusivity as a inherently bad thing in the past, so we are where we're at now.

[BanginTunes777]

Nothing wrong with competition but Epic isn't doing the kind of competition that benefits the consumer. Buying exclusives at the last minute isn't the same as funding or creating exclusive games, so they're only paying to force people into using their store. Would much rather Epic incentivise people to use their store through actually having a hand in the development of games they could sell as exclusives, or maybe if their lower cut on game sales could be a way for cheaper prices on games or something.

Right now consumers aren't benefiting. Hopefully Valve will improve Steam or Epic will use the money to fund some cool games - I'd like EGS to be a good thing in the long-run, but this tactic of buying stuff right at the end has no advantages for consumers, and if it's successful then imagine if EA or Ubisoft decide to do the same with their launchers.

[rainslacker]

Pretty sure fortnite is exclusive to their store. Epic isnt a publisher. They didn't have that infrastructure in place to have exclusives for it, and I think them moving it to a more open market was a decision made, and then implemented rather quickly.

Valve doesn't spend as much on exclusives anymore either.

[BanginTunes777]

I'm not saying Epic don't have exclusives they created/funded, I'm saying them buying games that would've come out regardless isn't a tactic that benefits consumers - while actually leading to the creation of new games will.

Epic published Fortnite, they have the capability to become a publisher of games now, and while Valve barely release games of their own now (which I am hoping EGS will push them to do), they don't spend money to prevent other platforms receiving games. I'd rather no exclusives at all instead instead of forced exclusives with no consumer benefit

[Mainman187]

#truth

[Orionsangel]

I agree. Steam needed a shake up. A wake up call. They've had it too easy for too long. Competition is a good thing. It makes companies work harder and improve their product.

[Hungryalpaca]

It’s not competition when they buy their way up. They’re not competing. They’re paying 2 win. I thought gamers hated pay 2 win?

[Orionsangel]

Sometimes you gotta play dirty with a GIANT if you wanna win.

[CurbStompin]

Salty ex-employee chimes in negatively on former employer. And this makes news?....

[leahcim]

choices are always for our better good

[KwietStorm_BLM]

Epic has a lot of work to do themselves for their storefront and feature set. Their biggest calling card right now is bigger cuts for studios, and therefore attracting exclusive game releases. Steam wasn't killing anything, and Epic isn't saving it. It's just competition. It's what Valve needed, and what Epic needs themselves.

[BondJames]

Former

[tochi]

Kind of sad to see how manipulative people are.

You endorse EPIC store, then soon will live in world of pre-2000 PC gaming.

Strength of PC gaming is 'community', and Valve is first company invested on PC gaming community to establish uniqueness of the store as a gaming platform. Their decision to bring PC gaming community to front seat of marketing changed PC game forever. Today, every console platform holders are following the same strategy, but strength and depth of their community is nowhere near PC's begin with.

I want you to think carefully about this fact before posting brainless "competition is good" response. How could the 'competition' to remove the community from PC gaming be any good for us?

What EPIC is doing is devouring the most important treasure to temporary fill own stomach.
You are not store, you are not imaginary 'developer', you are customer and part of PC gaming community.
Think carefully, how EPIC's anti-competitive practice can be any good for us.

[ShadowWolf712]

Well, they've been able to sell games at a discount since the devs pass some of their savings on to us, the consumer, for one.

For another... I play games, not "communities" bro. I can still talk to my friends no matter what storefront I'm on.

Your argument is as silly as saying Sega was evil for trying to compete with Nintendo because "Muh Console Community!"

[ShadowWolf712]

Metro, for one. Sold for $10 less because of the money the dev and publisher saved. World War Z was up on there for $5 off for similar reasons.

As for the claim that you can't buy a game anywhere else: https://www.dualshockers.co...

[agent4532]

I have no problem with competition but Epic is making sure they are the only storefront to have games like Metro Exodus. I cannot buy Metro Exodus on Amazon, GOG, or any storefront other than Epic store. Valve never had exclusives to begin with.

[Teflon02]

That's my issue. Steam exclusives are just the devs decisions. 90% of the games were on Origin, GoG, Amazon, UPlay etc. Hell, some where on steam but ran through the devs specific stuff like FFXIV etc.

[Hungryalpaca]

Epic is Pay 2 Win

[Casepb]

Saving isn't the word I would use for Epic. I would probably use the word dividing.

[Bluemaster77]

As a fundamental competition is good. It just sucks the way Epic is going about it by buying exclusives. I understand it, and it's not a long term strategy.

[DillyDilly]

Are any Epic Store Exclusives successes yet ?

[SegaGamer]

Not sure, they won't give numbers. They are just twisting things to make it seem good, like with Metro Exodus. There were articles going around saying it outsold the first two games in it's first week, but they failed to mention that the first two Metro games had very little marketing, most people had never heard of the games before they were released. Metro Exodus had a lot of marketing though and already built up a loyal fanbase from the first two games.

Metro Exodus was always going to outsell the first two games in its first week. It was inevitable no matter what store it was sold on.

[ShadowWolf712]

Metro.

[TheGamez100]

Steam is the savior. Its the reason why I avoid wanting to pirate. And so many niche and indies alike can exist because of it. Idk why so many of these devs and publishers corporate and whatnot are defending epic so much lol. I do understand however that valve has been....lacking for years now. Hope they just get off their asses and do something.

[Skuletor]

Too bad the Epic Store is still half baked, if they had given themselves more time to add features before launching it would have left a more favorable impression.

[jeki]

The thing I find so alarming is the level of hatred and vitriol this has caused.

7-11 doesn't sell the microbrew beer I like and the specialty beer shop doesn't sell Budweiser. I don't scream my head off in anger about it, I shop at both stores.

This whole thing is making gamers look like the angry, entitled, whining, basement dwellers people say they are. Sorry but it's true.

[mastershredder]

I'm not a big fan of the Steam platform and although I have it, no one at Valve/Steam is twisting my arm to do my gaming on it. I have other avenues to do that, it just happens this is one of the more popular consumer methods. I can't say they are killing PC gaming, not at all, but their model is stale and if they can't do something about it, there is going to be a new dog/s.

[Blu3_Berry]

Doesn't Playstation, Xbox and Nintendo also takes 30% cut from games? If so, then why is it that Valve are deemed the bad ones here when everyone is doing the same cut? Hell, consoles have just as much of a problem as PC gaming/Valve does. Steam/Valve and consoles have 30% cut. PC gaming has piracy and consoles have used games. Both of these forms are things that developers can not make a profit on at all. Why is nobody making a change in this?

[Skuletor]

Consoles have piracy too, I know jailbroken ps4s can have pirated games on them now

[FGHFGHFGH]

It's the industry standard. Microsoft, google, and apple also take 30% from games sold on their store. But somehow valve is "killing pc gaming" LOL.

[CrimsonWing69]

ok not trying to be sarcastic but how is Epic Games Store saving gaming from Steam?

[thexmanone]

Read the article

[Imortus_san]

"Steam was Killing PC Gaming" - yes, Steam killed PC gaming when games stopped coming out on retail, when games started to be only a empty box with a download code, when you had to be always online making any Gaming PC without internet a turd, you could not borrow any PC games unless your friend gave you it's account, and so on.

Steam improved, yes it did, but collecting games on PC is a joke, second hand market is a joke, on consoles I buy games all the time far cheaper then on PSN or Xbox Live, not to mention that XBox One games could be bought in Argentina, Turkey and other country's real cheap, a digital new released game for 16€ something that Steam could never come close.

So yes, PC gaming as been dead for a long time now, for those that truly like gaming on it's true form, physical media, manual, special editions, gaming offline, borrow the game without any limits, etc...

[Shinkus]

An employee said something bad about a former employer!? WHAT!!!!

[WelkinCole]

I just like that EPIC is slowly becoming a credible competitor to Steam and will force Valve to be better. Thats it.

Make no mistake though if EPIC was getting the gravy like Valve they would do exactly the same thing as Valve is doing now. Its just business.

[SegaGamer]

"Steam was killing PC gaming"

What a crock.

If it wasn't for Steam, I probably wouldn't be gaming on pc now. Tons of my favourite games weren't coming to pc, now they are. Bloody hell, look at all of the big name JRPG's that come to pc these days. It was unheard of to see a game like Dragon Quest on pc, now we have 3 of them.

Nobody can tell me that Steam hasn't given confidence to publishers to sell their titles on pc. The pc market is no longer just about your FPS and RTS games, it's grown into much more than that now.

[TheHan]

I say embrace it a little competition doesn’t hurt

[xVOLTx]

If Fortnite was not successful we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

[zelent]

This is EXACTLY why I support Epic. Valve has gotten lazy and complacent. People need to calm down about the Epic Store, and just enjoy all the benefits that come with direct competition between two huge entities.

[opc]

How have they gotten lazy? I'm genuinely curious.

In the past few years they have built up their platform so much that it offers more features than Playstation, Xbox, or Nintendo, and yet people say they've been lazy.

[Enigma_2099]

Epic just needs to improve customer experience. NOW, not later.

[Majinzo]

Competition is always good.

[neomahi]

A Twitter post is what we're supposed to go off of? What a waste of time. Care to explain why? This is a credible as little green men in flying saucers.

[Tross]

I think Steam is a great service, but I'm all for competition as when any company holds a veritable monopoly on anything, they have more control over a particular corner of the market than they should have, and with that comes complacency and less motivation to do more than just coast as much as possible. I mean, there are other storefronts such as GoG, but they're not nearly as huge.

That said, Epic is not the competitor I would have hoped for. I just don't like the anti-consumer way they conduct their business, particularly the shady underhanded way they secure their platform exclusives. I suppose it's good that a competitor is spurring Steam to step up its game. I just won't be a part of supporting that competitor and will just let other people handle that.

[Emme]

With all the activities, interactions etc, Steam is way beyond just a sales platform. But in the end only the games and their popularity count, and if Epic buys them away we gave an xbox/Ps situation. Lets see how that goes on PC :)

[RizBiz]

The only thing they've done so far is split the PC userbase even further, buy exclusivity (which was supposed to be M$'s crummy superpower), and steal Steam user's data.

[Father__Merrin]

I hope epic wins more exclusives. I also hope epic secures permanent exclusives, judging from the EGS road map its going to be pretty feature rish after 12 months

[Traingamez]

M night shamalan plot twist!!!

Epic and steam are owned by the same people

Hahahaha

Hey it’s possible
Works well for governments
Left wing
Right wing
Same lost, sick and confused bird

[gamer7804]

having some competition in the end will be good for consumers, xbox sony and nintendo have each been making each other better, as you see whenever one gets on top they become complacent and the other one leapfrogs them in one area or another.

[opc]

Valve directly competes with the three console makers. As does Epic. I stopped buying consoles in 2012, when I realized Steam had more features than Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo.

[gamer7804]

Well yes and no, consoles are significantly cheaper cost of entry and require less time. I built pcs for gaming and design for about 20 years, after having kids I switched to consoles for the gaming part due to time constraints and spending more of my money on kids and video. That said recently they have been competing a little bit more than in the past so I have to partly agree.

[opc]

cost of entry is cheaper, but they all compete against each other.

[Sirk7x]

Competition is good. People are used to, and want to continue using Steam however, so timed exclusives are definitely irritating consumers. On the other hand, Steam should re-evaluate how they're dealing with publishers who seem far to eager to get away from their platform. Epic also needs to improve their services. Whether or not they can do so without taking a larger cut from devs/publishers (to recoup costs, which may lead to the exact place Steam is at), begs to be seen.

[JesusBuiltmyHotrod]

BWHAHAHAHA, sounds like a disgruntled ex employee. If that is the case everyone is killing gaming except Epic. Bunch of BS.

[JesusBuiltmyHotrod]

LMAO at the folks who think it money "Trickles Down" that never works. You guys are falling for Epics PR.

[rlow1]

It's not that having a different option out their is bad......but when your paying for exclusives......this starts a new paradigm. If steam starts paying for new content....then it's going to get really nasty......for us gamers.

[HighPlayer28]

Epic can really do damage to steam if they create better features for their store and make their store more secure for customers. They have devs on their side already all they need to do is improve their store launcher.

[opc]

Instead of spending money on games that will only be exclusive for a year. I'd rather see articles about Epic poaching top talent from all over the industry to pay them more to create tons of features that will add long term value and actual competition.

[skyrimer]

It's going to be funny when Fortnite dies, Epic store dies since without the Fortnite money there's no way they can keep paying such a big cut and purchasing exclusives, people lose their games and then we see everyone saying that they saw it coming together with massive legal actions against Epic,I'll sit and watch right here.

It's funny hearing that steam is killing PC, EVERY SINGLE DAY I discover new games published on Steam that are surprisingly good, but somehow Steam is killing them lol, and since I'm 40, I can perfectly remember when publishers were the only way to develop pc games, and now a kid can publish a game and sell it worldwide, yet somehow Steam is the mother of all pc evil, come on.

[Razzer]

"Steam was Killing PC Gaming, Epic Games is Saving It"

Double dose of hyperbole

[GravityMilk]

Google and Apple are killing the smartphone market by taking 30%? Sony and MS take 30% price of games and deliver also they are killing the console market? (30% is standard).Valve is killing pc gaming be taking 30% this is ridiculous.
most of the developers making smartphone games and they know the smartphone market is profitable for them so how pc not profitable like smartphones? (btw smartphone and pc have piracy so both of them is the same). epic games just paying the developer for exclusive to support their poor platform. but instead of making a good competition in the pc market they buy the dev instead of the customer. here is how:
1- epic games pay in front (exclusive deal) to the developer and publisher.
2- epic games have a poor refund policy (which is good for dev and bad for the customer.
3- epic games don't support user review (the real review) which the developer and the publisher don't like because they want to sell their bad product with a lot of bugs early and to avoid the customer rage. all we know, if the product is good there, is nothing to be afraid of they the review is going to be great but no they want to sell us anything with a high price.

if the developer and publisher cant make big games because it's more expensive for them so don't do big games and go make medium or small games instead they a lot of medium and small games way fun the big games.

the competition should be fighting for the customer, not for the developer or publisher they should win the customer,

we want competition in the gaming market but not this way. win us instead fighting us.

https://newzoo.com/insights...
https://www.polygon.com/201...

[FGHFGHFGH]

yes totally agree. I bet most of the people complaining about valve don't even game on pc

[SoulClaw]

Okay.....fuck steam from now on :)

[pleasuretokill]

Forced 3rd party exclusives. Sorry, I will never, ever support that. Epic, the only way you will EVER see another dollar of mine is when your game comes to Steam. Otherwise it's time to put on the eyepatch like the good ol days. The customer makes the rules, not the greedy company!

[DafunkyRebel]

Makes sense, Steam had a monopoly on PC games so they force game makers to pay hefty percentages of their profits to Steam hence more developers don’t bother releasing their games on PC or make good versions so you end up with shitty PC ports like Batman and Nier

[AizenSosuke]

Epic basically made Steam and Valve try again

[Cobra951]

"It was a 30% tax on an entire industry. It was unsustainable. You have no idea how profitable Steam was for Valve. It was a virtual printing press. It distorted the entire company."

That's the power of a monopoly. It can do whatever it wants, fix any fees or prices it wants. Profit comes at the undue expense of others. Capitalism even in its purest, most anti-socialist form requires competition in all markets, and must either regulate or break up monopolies where they prop up.

This is the first time in my fairly long life that I ever see a raging mob trying to preserve a monopoly. It's rather hilarious.

[TheHan]

I agree, nothing wrong with competition. Keeps things fresh and honest.

[opc]

for the umpteenth time, they are not a monopoly. They've just outsmarted dozens of other companies that sell digital games. You can' honestly call them a monopoly when they directly compete with Amazon, Microsoft, EA, Ubisoft, and soon Google and Apple. Many of the biggest games in the industry like Fifa, Madden, Red Dead, Overwatch, LoL, Apex, Fortnite, Destiny... aren't even available on Steam and still they are at the top.

Despite all of this they continue to grow because they've been adding features that other bigger companies continually ignore.

[UltimateOwnage]

“Former” Valve employee... I would expect an answer nothing short of favoring the competitor in that case. I prefer the Steam ecosystem. It’s where all of my friends are, my saves, my mods, my content. I didn’t like it when EA was pushing Origin with their software, and I don’t like Epic Store getting exclusives because devs want more of the cut despite many of us favoring all of our games staying on Steam . It holds back the PC by not having simultaneous releases on all major DRM storefronts, especially when Steam is so ubiquitous (and for good reason, it’s done a ton of things right). I hear his point but I don’t agree with it; Valve making a cut to support their platform and development of things like Vive that ultimately push the PC forward is beneficial to all of us. Racing to the bottom on cut for the devs won’t help Epic when their fortnight cash cow slows down. I also like how he uses past tense when speaking about Steam, like it’s all over for Steam now.

[Kamikaze135]

I guess this explains why they were in no rush to make games. They didn't need to, to stay afloat.

[opc]

They've also been busy making and updating steam work shop, game hubs, the steam controller, Vive, Valve index, Knuckles controllers, working on in-home streaming, streaming anywhere, big picture mode, cloud saves, SteamOS, family sharing, steam input that allows customization of all controllers...

It's shocking to me that people say Valve has been lazy. They offer more features than Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo. All three companies take a similar cut as Valve.

[Father__Merrin]

Steams cut needs to go. Gabe needs to quit the burgers ASAP I hope EGS kicks the anus of steam