What Sony’s $8 Billion Lawsuit Might Mean For The Gaming Community

Sony getting slapped with a hefty $7.9 billion lawsuit is probably not the win the gaming community thinks it is.

[Kingrizzy90]

Half of the people will buy games from the ps store again anyway so they will get some of it back anyways

[derek]

Just because a court doesn't dismiss a case from the outset for having zero merit, doesn't mean there is a likelihood of ultimate success.

[Inverno]

IDK what to think of this. Thing is I've seen games on sale on PSN and Steam and they're almost always cheaper on Steam, but idk the pricing on Xbox. This is just to fill their own pockets with money so honestly I hope they lose cause they aren't siding with consumers, just money.

[BeHunted]

Where can I buy PlayStation Digital games? Only on PlayStation Store

Where can I buy Xbox and Steam digital games? Cdkeys, Game, Argos, Amazon etc...

There's your answer. If Sony is going to do digital only console they have a Monopoly on their 3rd party Digital games.

[anast]

Almost all gaming runs through Windows OS, who owns Windows?

[Inverno]

Except you CAN buy PSN games on CDKeys and G2A. Sure the selection isn't huge, but there's your other option. Also games are available on other platforms and you aren't forced to buy a PlayStation. A monopoly would mean there aren't alternatives, which there's 5 other platforms you can game on without ever needing a PlayStation device.

[BeHunted]

@Inverno

Sony to Stop Retailers Selling PS4 Game Codes on April 1st 2019

https://uk.pcmag.com/sony-p...

[Inverno]

Sure, but despite that I still see a few games on CD keys and G2A. Plus I don't think that proves a monopoly because there isn't much of an point in buying a card for a digital game. Since most likely GameStop would also be the ones deciding the prices and digital games at the time were often cheaper on sale and GS most likely wouldn't have lowered the prices.

[Extermin8or3_]

Except those typically never decrease in price. You go try and buy a digital code of agame that's on sale on Nintendo store or ms store and it'll still be full price. You can buy top up cards and ps plus subs on cards. Tell me can you buy apps, gsmes, music off apples store via codes? Or the oogle store via codes for individual items? No.

[DivineHand125]

@anast I am not sure what point you are trying to make. Are you saying every game and software that is released on Windows have to pay Microsoft a royalty fee?

@Inverno While it is possible to purchase PS5 digital games from 3rd party sources, it is not for the general population. Right now, Sony still has a monopoly on the distribution of PS plus subscriptions and digital games.

The majority of the ps5 games I see on G2A are not keys but accounts with the game license assigned to them. Once in a while you will find a CD key for a ps5 game on CDKeys and this is usually when Sony bundles a digital code with the PS5 and the person wants to sell the code. Again, this is not for the majority of persons to take advantage of but the few that comes across it.

[VariantAEC]

Can't you also buy digital codes for PSN games on Amazon?
I've never done it buy I'm fairly certain this was a thing late in PS3's life cycle or early in PS4's.

[VariantAEC]

Yeah, actually it is nice to know I'm not going crazy.
https://blog.playstation.co...

[FinalFantasyFanatic]

They're pretty comparable in my country, sometimes Sony is cheaper, sometimes Steam, I normally choose the Steam version these days.

[Battlestar23]

It means that MS will be allowed to put gamepass on psn which means more money for MS.

Sony will have to drop their 30% cut to hopefully 5 to 10% or even stop taking a cut on games sold on PSN which means more games being cheaper.

I fully expect that when Sony has to 'cut' their cut that most AAA games will drop back down to 50/60 dollars. Either way the Sony’s $8 Billion Lawsuit will only benefit gamers and teach Sony a lesson and stop them from being a Monopoly. So all gamers should want Sony to lose this case.

[shinoff2183]

Again I'm on the suits side aside from the 8 billion. But you put that 30 percent on Sony and memtion it like it is only Sony. Do you know how much steam, ms, Nintendo, charge ?

[Extermin8or3_]

You are a fucking moron. How much does MS charge? 30% steam? 30% Google and apple? 30%. Without that the business simply isn't viable. Gsmes pass doesn't make a profit and destroys the value if gsmes that's why MS is having to literally buy publishers to get their gsmes on there but longer term they either cut down the games they make, Nicole and dime everyone one with gaas microtransactions on every fucking game, or make less games. It's basic maths. So all a lawsuit like this going against Sony woukd do is destroy the games industry in the uk.

[gold_drake]

ehm, what?

that has nothing to donwith xbox being on psn, which will never happen.

why would it ?

[Plague-Doctor27]

Every digital storefront except Epic charges a 30% cut. Putting your game in a storefront allows that company to advertise it, create a seperate game page, gives you access to a payment system, customer support, file storage, basically free marketing (game recommendations etc). Many storefronts have community pages and screenshots, gameplay videos, forums, reviews, etc. You get trophy/achievement/badge support, remote play integration, cross-save integration, etc. These storefronts are able to reduce costs by doing these tasks at scale. Imagine having to do all those things to sell your game digitally as a small indie dev. Physical stores also take cuts for taking up shelf space, free advertising, etc.

We can argue about the exact % cut but 30% is an industry standard and not a number Sony in particular pulled out of their ass. Devs are getting a lot more benefit from paying that to be on a storefront than you may think. And dev teams are businesses too at the end of the day. If the 30% is dropped to 20%, devs would happily pocket that extra 10%. Why would they pass it on to you?

If the government cut your taxes by 5%, would you ask your boss for a 5% paycut, to be the nice guy? Would you say you don't need the extra 5%? Why would a business act any differently?

[QuantumMechanic]

There are some poor comparisons made between this and the Epic v. Apple case. This suit appears to focus on consumer-facing pricing. I don't see any reason why a platform's ecosystem can't be closed. You can choose to buy and play 3rd-party titles on other platforms; therein lies the market element of competition.

[Babadook7]

No. You’re referring to how the claimant framed their case. We don’t know the money behind this or the true intentions. Here’s the quote.

“The claim asserts that Sony’s stringent terms and conditions imposed on game developers and publishers, along with a hefty 30% commission on each purchase, have led to excessive prices for consumers.“

The 30% hasn’t changed. It’s about exactly the same thing as the epic case. Trying to force competition to PSN store and App Store and reducing their (and everyone else’s) 30% fee.

[QuantumMechanic]

Epic's claim had nothing to do with market competition. They simply wanted to circumvent the 30% publishing royalty for their own benefit. It is laughable if you think they would pass that savings to the customer.

Videogame console and computer platforms together form a market. Games are not utilities (e.g. phones) or a basic need. No court is going to meddle in the royalty structure of an entertainment industry.

[Babadook7]

“They simply wanted to circumvent the 30% publishing royalty for their own benefit.“

I know that’s what I’m saying.

The 30% cut hasn’t changed in the digital store business for decades. So how is it suddenly anti consumer? It’s greed publishers if anything. It’s quite possible a publisher is funding this lawsuit. As for competition yes that’s how they force the cut to go down. Apple must allow 3rd party app stores now as well.

[343_Guilty_Spark]

Jin_Sakai will pay for Sony’s crimes

[Pocahontas]

Zero it mean zero

[TheCaptainKuchiki]

Didn't Epic lose against Apple for the very same thing?

[Babadook7]

Somehow I heard Epic eventually won that perhaps in one region.

[TheCaptainKuchiki]

Nah they lost in every country they sued Apple in. The only thing left is the case against Google.
They did make Apple lower their cut to 15% for devs making less than $1M but Apple did that of their own will, no one forced them.

[Babadook7]

This is perfect (ahem) timing for MS. They buy the biggest multiplat title "COD", and then " benefit" with this challenge to long established market conditions (not established by Sony) by removing and pocketing the 30% PS Store policy.

[Ironmike]

We should hope they win not defend this practice Hooe xbox is next their store is shocking as well

[Petebloodyonion]

There are 2 problems that Sony will need to address in regards to this lawsuit.

1) Sony forcing consumers to buy digitally from the PSN store only meaning that there's no competition to force the price down. The best example is on Black Friday when several stores offer different deals for different PlayStation games. If you want a digital game there's only 1 store with what they are promoting.
Solution forcing Sony to resell some digital code to other stores (Gamestop, CD keys, Walmart, Amazon, etc).
Just remember some Internet companies are forced to allow small players to use their infrastructure for the sake of having competition.

2) Sony's price parity clause (basically the main issue with this lawsuit).
in short, Sony forces price parity meaning that if a publisher would sell the game cheaper on Xbox due to MS charging 12% they would be forced to sell at the same price on PSN despite Sony's 30% cut.
So the lawsuit targets 2 things: 1) There's 0 incentive for MS and Nintendo to lower their cut and create pressure on Sony
2) the fact that a publisher will never reduce the price despite lower costs because of Sony's policy. The best example would be how come digital now costs the same as physical when before digital (especially PC) game was often 10$ cheaper.
Solution making illegal price parity just like having industry fixing price is illegal (gaz, foods, etc)

[DivineHand125]

The persons who disagreed with your comment without providing evidence to prove otherwise are not Playstation customers but persons who like the idea of Playstation winning and doing no wrong.

[Fluke_Skywalker]

A lot of people don't know how businesses work clearly. It's not a win if Sony lose for anyone except the claimant. If producing and selling video games stops being profitable for Sony then they'll just stop selling them and making them. Then no one wins, except other gaming platforms, not the consumer. Games are luxury items not a necessity. You have options to just not buy them if you don't like the price. This case a absolutely nonsense.

[DivineHand125]

If Sony is making most of their revenue from 3rd party game referrals and subscription fees, what incentive would they have to continue making 1st party games?

Look at what happened with Valve, with the huge success of steam, we don't see allot of games being published by them and fans are asking for sequels to several of their games.

If publishers don't have to pay that 30% then I can only speculate that they would be less likely to add microtransactions to their games.

[VariantAEC]

"If publishers don't have to pay that 30% then I can only speculate that they would be less likely to add microtransactions to their games."

Why are there microtransactions in FH5 and Halo Infinite then? There are also macrotransations in MSFS2020 and tiny numbers of nanotransactions in FM23 at present. These should not exist according to you because MS takes home 100% revenue on the games they make, but that's not happening. The same is true on Nintendo Network and PSN with respect to 1st party games. There are microtransactions on Nintendo and PS 1st party games.

[DivineHand125]

Valve is the prime example of how a 30% referral fee can negatively impact their overall game output. Most of us can agree that charging 30% on all 3rd party transactions made in the PS Store is excessive. Sony is currently in a dominant position in the high-end console gaming market by a mile.

If the majority of their revenue starts coming from PS store transactions and subscriptions while the competitor continues to be ignored by the public, they will have less incentives to release 1st party games to keep you interested. This year the only major 1st party game I can think of that was released was Spiderman 2. Apart from the last of us part 2 remastered and Hell Divers 2 that is set to release in January and February, we are not sure of any Sony published releases for 2024.

Maybe I am looking too much into the numbers but there is precedent on where a successful company with a digital store front could end up going.

[QuantumMechanic]

You can't police how any company chooses to spend its own money when the market is rich with product from other companies. Acquisitions are an exception because they may constrain the market of the product.

[DivineHand125]

I speak from my point of view as a gamer and not the sole benefit of a company. My opinion is that if those fees were not so high and if Sony didn't lock their subscription and digital titles to the PS store, they could still make enough money to be profitable, games could be cheaper and developers could earn more from each sale they make without having to look to microtransactions to bolster revenue.

[shinoff2183]

Divine those developers using micro transactions aren't gonna stop if they are able to sell ps games digitally elsewhere. They are gonna do mt regardless. Again I don't agree with sony only selling digital games on their store.

[mastershredder]

Exputer is essentially the Sun or National Inquirer or gaming news. Getting gamers all in a frenzy over something they clearly have not got a grasp on and run with it right into a wall. F-ing hilarious. Don't fret kids, it's not this sensational, really. Yawn.

[aaronaton]

Why are American's and their corporations deadset on ruining gaming.

[kindi_boy]

Tell me you are a Sony mouthpiece without telling me you are a Sony mouthpiece.

[dmonee]

This seems very complicated and I don’t think Sony is going to lose this case. They may have to alter the way they do business online.

[shinoff2183]

Dmonee That would be the best outcome. Alter without a money loss. The 8 billion just doesn't make sense to me at all.

[dmonee]

The oxycontin company Perdue isn’t getting hit that hard and they are responsible for a drug, epidemic of death and destruction. I honestly don’t understand the laws, and how they could be on the hook for 8 billion, how I was affected and how to get on the lawsuit lol. Im a PS plus subscriber and want justice

[VariantAEC]

"This seems very complicated and I don’t think Sony is going to lose this case. They may have to alter the way they do business online."
If PS win nothing likely would change. And why should it?
If PS lose they would probably be compelled to alter the way they run their digital stores.