Destiny 2: PS4 Pro "Couldn't Run" Game at 60fps

"Our game's this rich physics simulation. It wouldn't run - not enough horsepower there yet."

[slate91]

This is ridiculous. DON'T MAKE IT 4K THEN! This is not on the PS Pro. This is an awful development decision in my opinion.

[Gazondaily]

Yeah give me FPS over 4k

[naruga]

who the F..K! cares if the game literally runs or not 4K on PS4pro?? ...i say None except some people who already try to overtonely promote a next gen console AKA Scorpio...

[Gazondaily]

....okay...

So yeah FPS over 4k...

[uptownsoul]

As much as people want FPS over 4K (which I agree with)...BOTH Sony & Microsoft have policies that neither Pro nor Scorpio can run games at higher frame rates than the other sku's within the same family of consoles. And I'm not sure vanilla PS4 or vanilla XB1 can run Destiny 2 at 60fps regardless of any compromises Bungie could make.

[Obscure_Observer]

@uptownsoul

"BOTH Sony & Microsoft have policies that neither Pro nor Scorpio can run games at higher frame rates than the other sku's within the same family of consoles"

The policies you mentioned only applies to MP modes in first party tittles from both Sony and Microsoft.

[uptownsoul]

@Obscure_Observer - "The policies you mentioned only applies to MP modes in first party tittles from both Sony and Microsoft."

The policies do not only apply to first party titles, the policy applies to MP modes of ALL titles. Microsoft wants all XB1s (vanilla, S & Scorpio owners) to play MP modes together on BOTH 1st party titles & 3rd party multplats. Sony has the same policy for their PS4 line of hardware

[uptownsoul]

@Obscure_Observer

I stand corrected...Xbox does NOT mandate frame rates between consoles even on MP

Mike Ybarra just confirmed it https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...

[Obscure_Observer]

@uptownsoul

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

I understand your point though. I don´t think MS would allow third party devs to give an edge to Scorpio owners over the Xbox One owners.

If the Scorpio turn out to be able to run Destiny at 60fps, they might just choose to use dynamic resolution for the Xbox One version to maintain locked 60fps just like Gears of War, Halo 5 and BF1. ;)

[freshslicepizza]

@uptownsoul
"I stand corrected...Xbox does NOT mandate frame rates between consoles even on MP

Mike Ybarra just confirmed it https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...

That is quite interesting, although Scorpio doesn't really have a next gen CPU either it is still more powerful than the PS4 Pro so we will have to wait and see. The most disturbing reason if it didn't offer 60fps on Scorpio would be Sony forcing parity as part of their agreement with Activision/Bungie. Either way it looks like the PC version is the one to get because I can tell right away the difference in response times, it just makes the experience so much more enjoyable to me.

[Ju]

Do you guys care to read? It's CPU bound, no matter what resolution, it wouldn't be possible to hit 60fps.

[PistolsAtDawn]

@UptownSoul That isn't true in the case of MS. https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...
https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...

Then combine that with the fact that MS also allows XB1 to Play Gears of War 4 to play with PC, which can run a much higher FPS

Edit: Ok, I see you got this...NM

[joab777]

@uptownsoul you are right, so why lie about it!

[Forn]

Bungie and Activision are such trash. Resogun has far more physics calculations and runs @ 60fps without a hiccup, lmao. I hope Destiny 2 flops HARD.

[Babadook7]

This was obvious I would say. Scorpio is the same. To double the framerate would require either a different engine or a cpu with 2.5x the cpu power of base hardware. 4k is fairly easy to implement on the other hand.

[NecoTehSergal]

I'd argue more people have 60-120hz/FPS-capable monitors than there are fucking customers with 4K TV's -_-

[NohansenBoy]

As a PC gamer I be all like; FPS > game quality settings > Resolution. I'll do whatever it takes to get 120FPS.

[Sevir]

The game is also A PS4 GAME... ITS ENGINE IS BASED ON BASE PS4... if it's 60 on PS4 Pro then it would need to be 60 GPS on PS4.... Which would mean concession and cut corners on physics, lighting, graphics AI, textures, character models and and the size of the worlds, weapons gear etc....

Also, pushing for 60 GPS on PS4 Pro makes for an unbalanced multi-player gaming experience for base PS4 since they share the same servers. Destiny at its core is 30fps, run perfectly fine, and it's shooting and polished game play mechanics is pristine... They game runs without a hitch. So complaining about 60 fps is stupid...

The Scorpio version will also be 30fps for the very same reason... It's based off the 30 fps version of XBO... Sharing the same multi-player servers making it 60 fps on Scorpio breaks the game experience on core XBO and XBO S which the game was made to support at base levels...

It's like you've all forgotten... The Scorpio and Pro are not next generation Hardware, they are iterative enhanced refreshes of the SAME DAMN FAMILY of consoles!!!

You want a 60 fps Destiny 2 experience? Go play on your PC...

Developers will always choose what is best balance for sake of performance.

Get the hell over yourselves with this elitist BS... Game development isn't easy and these developers do so much into making a damn good polished multi-player experience that's 100% solid and consistent across every platform they've released this game on in the past.

Leave your friends list and console of choice behind and go choose a PC if you really seem 60 fps a deal breaker... You now have that option.

[MadMax]

No way. 4k over fps any day! 30fps is fine for me. Just because you and many others haven't upgraded to a 4k tv, doesn't mean us 4k adopters should have to suffer. Make it an option then and choose from fps or 4k. Then everyone can be happy.

[fr0sty]

It isn't a dial they turn to turn up FPS or turn down resolution to give or take room for physics simulation. It doesn't always scale so linearly. It may turn out that even without 4K it couldn't run at 60fps.

[FinalFantasyFanatic]

I would have preferred 60fps, then the pro/Scorpio can use their extra processing power for higher res (I'd accept even 1440p)

[DigitalRaptor]

@ Septic

Both Sony and Microsoft are prioritising resolution over frame rates, if their marketing is anything to go by. And I cannot imagine that third-party publishers are going to want to upset the status quo when it comes to multiplayer, or the several million people who already own the original console.
-----

@ moldybread

"The most disturbing reason if it didn't offer 60fps on Scorpio would be Sony forcing parity as part of their agreement with Activision/Bungie"

Look at him setting up his narrative already.

[boomtube1987]

I dont give a toss about campaign. Make it 720p, 1080p 1400p 30fps but the real issue here is the 4 VS 4 player on player is running 30fps. For F××× sake. People always wonder why CoD continues to sell....simple 60fps.

Year's ago i didnt know much about these frame rate but i always felt that playing COD felt ultra smooth and fast and when moved to another FPS shooter it felt slow and not so smooth. I learned it was the higher frame rate that was why COD felt this way. Higher frame rate in competitive MP should always take priority at any cost. Its the big reason i couldnt enjoy FPS.

[Erik7357]

I think they would of if they could.

[Obscure_Observer]

Totally agree. Sony has been their prime partners from the very beggining, no reason to lie about it.

[rocketpanda]

Sure, Activison and Bungie would never lie.

[dirkdady]

Am I the only that is okay with 30fps? I didn't mind it on destiny.

[ABizzel1]

Doubt it.

IF the base PS4 and XBO couldn't do 60fps, there's no reason they would even try with the Pro or Scorpio because it would cause a fps rift between the consoles, with Pro players having 2x the fps as base model players. That would suck for a game that's heavily focused on an online world when it comes to consistent performance. For Pro players it would be great, but they would have an advantage in all aspects, which defeats the point of console consistency.

PS4 Pro and Scorpio will simply be resolution boosting machines, with at times better textures and anti aliasing. I'll save my $400 - $600, on the PS5 and XB4.

[Ju]

They said it pretty clear in the article. Their problem is, its CPU bound. Not enough faster from PS4 o Pro to make this 60fps to begin with.

[UnHoly_One]

I'm with you DirkDady

Destiny 1 ran at 30 fps at it was one of the best feeling shooters I've ever played. I mean it just played and felt perfect. Why change that?

Also, Erik7357 -- "Would have", not "would of"

That's the second time is as many articles I've seen somebody do that. Infuriating. lol

[bluefox755]

This comment shows zero understanding of how game development works. They designed the game with a graphical focus, not a performance focus. We see other games at 60fps, so obviously any of the consoles are "capable" of 60fps. This game is not 60fps because it was a design decision. What he really means is, "we couldn't run it at 60fps on the Pro because we optimized the game to run at 30fps on consoles". He cited the CPU as the issue, which means it'll be the same deal on the Scorpio as well.

[Obscure_Observer]

Hmm...

According some users from N4G, Scorpio wouldn´t be able to run Destiny 2 at 60fps either since it has the same Jaguar processor as the PS4 Pro slightly overclocked :/

[Ceaser9857361]

Bungie will stick to 30fps with Scorpio too.. such lazy devs...

[GearSkiN]

"according some users from n4g" lmao

[mmj]

I can't believe that you have so many downvotes Obscure_Observer, what you post is fact based on logical reasoning. To anyone that understands hardware this post having so many downvotes is like a "The Earth is round not flat" post being heavily downvoted.

Scorpio has the same Jaguar CPU that is only 150Mhz faster, it will have same major CPU bottleneck. It's a 4K Xbox One NOT a next gen console.

[Ashunderfire86]

#ImGumbyDammit

It is not going to be enough, maybe they will unlock the framerate and go 1440p checkerboard upscale to 4K on this game. Even GPU heavy Titan pascal X struggles to hit 60fps on some of the most demanding games without the help of cpu like i5 or i7. You need something like an i5 or i7 cpu on consoles to run Destiny 2 60fps, but the resolutions is going to be an upscaler than true 4K gaming.

[pinkcrocodile75]

@Obscure_Observer

It's not often I get to whitness an utter schooling from one user to another but @ImGumbyDammit has just given you one hell of an education.

@ImGumbyDammit, well done.

[bluefox755]

That's a pretty rational conclusion.

[Braveheart_NZ]

http://www.tweaktown.com/ne...
And according to facts The Scorpio's processor is highly modified, so much so, that Microsoft don't refer to it as a Jaguar core anymore, and any current and future DX12 PC game will run easily on Scorpio since DX12 is taken away from the internal modified processor of Scorpio and is baked directly into the GPU's command processor to significantly reduce instruction sets meaning the communication from the game to the GPU is super efficient. Sony do not have that on there console. It is like Apples to Oranges here sorry and the two consoles can not be compared. I am assuming that Destiny 2 will be a DX12 game so it could easily run 60fps at 4k on Project Scorpio. If it doesn't, it isn't because it cant because it is capable enough. It will be a parity issue with Sony having marketing rights and not wanting another console to have the better version, that, or laziness on Bungees part who can't be bothered..

[DigitalRaptor]

@ ImGumbyDammit

Your entire comment is overstated. It has already been confirmed that this DX12 command processor was already in the original XB1, and all of that particular stuff presented to Digital Foundry was fluff PR that they later clarified is just a slightly more evolved version of that for Scorpio. https://twitter.com/digital...

[Obscure_Observer]

@pinkcrocodile75

"It's not often I get to whitness an utter schooling from one user to another but @ImGumbyDammit has just given you one hell of an education."

Have you ever heard of something called sarcasm?

[Xx_Pistol_xX]

I could be wrong but I don't think anyone is going to pay 400 dollars for 30 FPS.

[mmj]

4K television owners will and that's who it's aimed at.

[boomtube1987]

So Destiny with 4 vs 4 MP crucible has better physics than BF1 running higher than 1080p resolution and in 60fps with 64 players online in large maps with tons of destruction. ahahahahahahhahahah! Destiny proves my point of lazy devs, keeps on copy and pasting and calling there work state of the art. Destiny 2 isn't even in my list of top 7 games with great graphics and physics. It doesn't even look better than COD. How the hell in 2017 we have a MP game with 4 vs 4 in 30fps. I don't think the problem with AAA is the cost of game itself rather paying the cost of developers. Who sit there copy and pasting for the most part. Pure lazy madness. Destiny 2 proves it.

[TankCrossing]

Key difference being Battlefield games are server hosted, and the server takes care of the important (shared) physics calculations.

Bungie say they don't need servers, despite offering this glaring evidence to the contrary...

[freshslicepizza]

It's not about lazy devs because they have already proven they are doing it on the PC. This is all about Sony and their parity clause for any competitive online game where it has to be at parity with the regular PS4. Battlefield does give a bit of an advantage to Pro users because they get better draw distance but the game is not locked to 30fps on the regular PS4.

I would like to see Microsoft continue to show they are much more open than Sony and allow the developer to offer the choice. With Bungie announcing native 4K on the PS4 Pro to me that shows Sony is already trying to prepare itself and I bet they have asked Bungie to try and make the game not inferior to Scorpio version. If they take it one step further and ask them to also limit it to 30fps on Scorpio as some sort of parity agreement then that is something that needs serious backlash.

[butchertroll]

@moldybread

Quote :
This is all about Sony and their parity clause for any competitive online game where it has to be at parity with the regular PS4
.....

Deal has nothing to do with parity. Your post is bullshit. Got a problem with your pathetic life??? If parity exists, why Sony didn't forbid MS to sent devs to Bungie to push first Destiny to 1080p?

[vega275]

@ butchertroll

I know you really want defend sony and the ps4 pro. Sony doesn't own bungie. Which is why they can't "forbid" MS or anyone from working with bungie.

All sony has is a marketing deal. Which sony want to gamers to buy the game on ps4 or ps4 pro. But they don't want the differences between ps4 pro and scorpio to be too big.

[extermin8or]

Wait is it really @tankcrossing so you mean battlefield is actually already doing the cloud computing made out to be new and unique to crackdown (if it ever releases)

[Princess_Pilfer]

Physics. So CPU bound task. Same reason fallout 4 runs like garbage on consoles. Chances are, they could run it at 720p and it still wouldn't hit 60FPS.

[boomtube1987]

@Princess_Pilfer and yet DICE are able to run Battlefield 1 on PS Pro well above 1080p and at 60fps with its heavy physics, large maps and player count with far better graphics than fallout 4 and Destiny 2 combined. It must be that DICE have devs who actually work rather than do allot of copy and paste.

[Ju]

They could probably offload more to GPU compute to limit that bottleneck, but as in the here and now, their engine requires more CPU grunt. So that's that. It's not like one can rewrite that in a day or so. I agree, though, that I don't feel Bungie has THE engine tech (or engineering capability) to do that. Well, maybe if they'd switch to Frostbite some day...

[Princess_Pilfer]

It's almost like Destiny is an MMO with way more to keep track of than random Battlefield maps, and that has an impact on CPU usage and performance. Funny that.

[AnubisG]

I agree with this. Don't get me wrong, I love 4K myself but I much rather have 60fps instead.

[_-EDMIX-_]

I mean I don't think this situation is an either or

I think it actually just makes sense for them to have an option that's just 60 frames 1080P and 4K option at 30 frames...

I'm not even entirely sure why they're selecting one over the other when they could just have both , there has been a couple of games that have multiple options for that.

[Obscure_Observer]

The PS4 version is the reason. If the PS4 version can´t hit 60fps, Bungie will not give PS4 Pro owners an edge over PS4 owners on MP.

[_-EDMIX-_]

That doesn't matter it's still saying that they're choosing to not make it run something that they know they could make it run.

That still means is developer dependent

[joab777]

It can. As it won't be 4k on the X1 and PS4. There should be an option to run at 1080/60. The issue is two-fold. They don't want it to be 30 on one and 60 on another during trials etc. And, Sony doesn't want Destiny to sell Scorpios, so probably demanded that consoles remain 30 fps.

I love Sony and I know I will play on the Pro because of friends and exclusivity, but they put out a lot of money, and already have to compete with PC. It cannot become the 3rd best option.

[Obscure_Observer]

Sony doesn´t have THAT kind of money to prevent Bungie from deliver the superior console version on Scorpio. MS will never accept a PS4Pro´s checkerboard version instead of a native one on the Scorpio.

[mmj]

Knockknock let me explain, the Destiny developer says that PS4 Pro with a 2.15Ghz AMD Jaguar processor is prevented by the CPU from reaching beyond 30fps, the Xbox Scorpio has a 2.3Ghz AMD Jaguar processor which is roughly 7% faster. A 7% faster processor won't give you 100% increase in frame-rate no matter how much Xbox users wish it to be the case.

[rainslacker]

Does it even matter? The original was only 30fps wasn't it? If people were OK with that, is lack of 60fps a problem now?

Anyhow, the options are nice, but it's this issue with people complaining that 60fps gives an advantage over those who play at 30fps, when I think it doesn't really even matter in the end. A good player or a bad player is good or bad regardless of the frame rate or resolution. Same thing that the Xbox One elite controller won't make you a good or better player.

@Obscure

I'm pretty sure since Sony has the marketing rights to the game, so they certainly can dictate what will finally be delivered on the Scorpio. If you think Sony won't flex that agreement to get parity, your kidding yourself. While they may not be able to influence the devs, that money can certainly be used to influence activation.

It does suck for Scorpio owners, but from reading the article, it appears the issue is the CPU bound nature of the game which wouldn't be able to handle the physics on any of the systems, since they're all pretty much the same across the board. Scorpio's CPU isn't so much more powerful that it would likely matter unless they were right on the edge of power with PS4P.

[Obscure_Observer]

@rainslacker

"Does it even matter? The original was only 30fps wasn't it? If people were OK with that, is lack of 60fps a problem now?"

Yeah it is! Case you don´t remember, Destiny is an OLD GEN game, a PS3/360 game developed on "Tiger" an OLD GEN heavily modified engine used on Halo games. The very same engine they are using now for Destiny 2 30fps for a game which features less player count than its predecessor on multiplayer modes running on a much more powerful hardware than PS3/360 is just unacceptable.

"Anyhow, the options are nice, but it's this issue with people complaining that 60fps gives an advantage over those who play at 30fps, when I think it doesn't really even matter in the end. A good player or a bad player is good or bad regardless of the frame rate or resolution."

Imo that was a pretty naive statement and i´m positive you´re not familiar with the competitive multiplayer environment. Just saying
http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

"I'm pretty sure since Sony has the marketing rights to the game, so they certainly can dictate what will finally be delivered on the Scorpio. If you think Sony won't flex that agreement to get parity, your kidding yourself."

Wrong! YOU´re kidding yourself! If you think there will be parity between the Pro and Scorpio versions of games which Sony has the marketing rights like Battlefront 2, Red Dead Redemption 2, CoD and Destiny 2 because of money-hatting or install base, you´re really setting yourself up for huge disappointment! Devs will never limit the potential of their multiplatform games for the sake of the less powerful platform. Never!

[CrimsonPheonix]

4k requires GPU power which the ps4 Pro has, 60 frames requires CPU power which is bottlenecked on the Pro

[Bennibop]

And bottlenecks on Scorpio also

[Knockknock]

@bennibop, What would these scorpio bottlenecks be, since you know everything about scorpio specs.

[Ju]

Marginally cpu higher clock.

To push this to higher framerate, the CPU would need to offload tasks. Scorpio will have an advantage, but the core problem remains: The engine needs to be redesigned; if this is even possible. Some general purpose tasks just can't run on the GPU (efficiently enough).

[cellfluid]

These devs are full of bs excuses. Why don't they just give the user options on fates and resolution for campaigns and make two fps lobbies when online.. Make a lobbies that's 30fps @ what ever suitable resolution if the user chooses that option to play the game @ that rate. And make a lobby that's 60fps @ whatever suitable resolution for users t@ chose t@ option PROBLEMS SOLVED.. Now the user based isn't SPLIT UP the players are just given the OPTIONS to PLAY HOW THEY WANT!!! Enough with the excuses... Lazy devs

[Knockknock]

It most likely won't be native 4k anyway, most likely 1800p sold as 4k by fony.

[Ceaser9857361]

"It most likely won't be native 4k anyway, most likely 1800p sold as 4k by fony."
awww!!! if 720p didnt bother you on xbox one... This shouldn't bother you either... Had you been more knowledgeable Sony always marketed as dynamic 4k, checkerboard tech... Sony never said NATIVE 4K ... so move along salty Xbox fangirl

[Ceaser9857361]

This bullshit.. Bungie is a lazy dev... they could have easily made Destiny 2 run at 60fps but they wont .. They have always maintained 30fps even when they made Halo... Disgusting and most will blame the console for this... and the "60fps not possible due to cpu constrain" is pure Bullshit ... There are no huge crowd environment, The physx takes place on screen, They no destruction physics nor environmental physics. Bungie Need to man up and stop all this stupid excuses ..

also why is nobody pointing out the PVP count low then its predecessor?? Ridiculous.. First time i guess a game where they are lowering the PVP count low instead of raising it...

[starchild]

You don't know how their engine works nor what it's doing from a technical point of view. That's like looking at a person's phenotypic characteristics and thinking that you know exactly what their DNA is. Which is wrong, wrong, wrong.

It's irrelevant to point to some other game and say "that looks better" or "that has better physics and runs at a higher framerate". That's simply your subjective impression and doesn't actually tell you what each game's technical demands are.

Consider the fact that MOST games on the PS4 Pro do not have a 60fps mode. If it was so easy we would see most games running at 60fps on the Pro. But it's not that easy. Many games are CPU bound whether you think they should be or not.

[Ceaser9857361]

starchild

It was a KNOWN FACT that the PRO cant do 4k 60fps but a 1080p 60fps or 1440 60fps is possible on the Pro but Bungie went with 4K 30FPS on the pro.. Lets not defend the devs here

and i bet my ass when the Scorpio version will be 30fps locked most will blame the Pro for it and NOT the dev...

[Knockknock]

Who said I owned an xbox. I couldn't care less about resolution I leave that for fony fan girls like you and their salty tears for the inferior pro. And why sell a game claiming to be 4k when its not.

[Ceaser9857361]

knock knock

"Who said I owned an xbox. I couldn't care less about resolution I leave that for fony fan girls like you and their salty tears for the inferior pro. And why sell a game claiming to be 4k when its not."

omg!! Really?? So people like you dont game but wants to be salty lil girl when it comes to Sony.. GTFO here with your bs assumption with claiming "to be 4k" When sony didnt even say it so... People like you will spread lies since you have less knowledge or has to much time to waste in being salty... You certainly need HELP!

[Knockknock]

I am a gamer and have been for over 30 years. I don't care about resolution, I would prefer to play an amazing game at 900p than a dog turd at 1080. If pro games aren't claimed to be 4k why are they sold as that. I learnt more about games while you was still sucking on your mums nipple.

[Ceaser9857361]

" I learnt more about games while you was still sucking on your mums nipple."
KNOCK KNOCK

lmao! Whats your age again? or are you a 40 years old big fat baby who cries to his mama aloud.... You Sir, have zero knowledge ..
"If pro games aren't claimed to be 4k why are they sold as that."
Pro games aren't claimed to be 4k never did they.. God!! are you that illiterate or you trolling here on purpose... Get back to you basement UNCLE .. Oh! and if 900p doesn't bother you and you care jack about resolution they why are you whining about Sony did this and that... You're nothing but an irritating adult who needs to get a life... such a dick!

[Knockknock]

OMG You just went full retard, was you not told to never go full retard.

[Ceaser9857361]

LMAO!!

kNOCK KNOCK

i am absolutely fine but looks like you got butthurt for nothing but then i cant blame a troll can i.... Anyways i'm out from this thread since i dont wanna be drag down to your level of stupidity... Good luck and ya! see a Psychiatrist, you need help ...

[Knockknock]

Looks like you went past full retard. Think you need to be placed in special class with the blunt scissors and round paper. Your so easy to wind up.

[vulsker]

My point exactly. Or why not give people the option like they are supposed to. So I'll take a wild guess and say that those with non-4k screens and a pro get no benefits then?

I would definitely take FPS over 4k.

[ABizzel1]

Has nothing to do with the Pro running 60fps, it has everything to do that this game has to be the same 30 FPS across all consoles because the Pro and Scorpio player still have to play with original PS4 and XBO players, which also means Destiny is not cross platform with PC.

The base consoles are locked at 30fps, which means the Pro consoles have to be locked as well for consistency since the entire game is build around online. They aimed for parity (which I get), at the sake of better performance for those who are willing to spend more. Ultimately this is why I didn't upgrade to the PS4 Pro and likely won't upgrade to Scorpio. The base consoles will always hold them back, until the development mindset changes in a couple of years where they need more power and PS5 / XB4 are being discussed.

[Chriscrinkle18]

Mike Ybarra stated that it's up to the developers and they wouldn't enforce any parity between Xbox One and Scorpio.

[ShadowWolf712]

I love how literally no one pays attention to the "why".

They went for 4K because the GPU DOES have extra power. The CPU being a Jag is the issue because of the effects and physics.

[Cobra951]

I eventually saw this writing on the wall, with much chagrin. The consoles went after 4K at any cost, with 30 fps as the continued acceptable target. That's when I lost interest in both the Pro and the Scorpio. Why buy a system designed for a resolution I can't display, and which I have no interest in paying to display? If they at least provided the option to work at 60 fps at a lower resolution, I might have stayed onboard. That may be the case with some individual titles, but the overall philosophy is 4K first, frame rate second. That is simply not acceptable.

[Rhythmattic]

For MP, i agree... and that it seems, is the conundrum....

[butchertroll]

It's the CPU, man. Jaguar CPU is crap

[Corpser]

Developer said the game is CPU bound, reducing resolution to 1080p it still won't run at 60fps on pro

[timotim]

I'm pretty sure it wont be running at native 4k anyway, but could you imagine the uproar if Bungie made the game native 1440 or even 1080p on Pro just to hit 60FPS, then MS announces "True 4K" for Scorpio at E3??? Heads would roll! Sony is in a bit of a jam with Pro...they have to keep the terminology relatively the same between Pro and Scorpio, this means checkerboarding to 4K, just so they don't put themselves at a disadvantage, yet not having enough in the tank to reach higher performance.

[Bruh]

How does that work in Destiny? lol you would literally have 2x advantage over base owners, they clearly did it for parity reasons

[Soc5]

Yeah but then how are they gonna sell all those 4k tvs? That's the real reason,
most people don't realize that one of the biggest reasons they are pushing 4k so hard is the tv industry,

[fenome]

So what was the excuse last time? Sounds like they want to keep it capped for no reason. Hopefully it'll run at 60 for the diehard hopefuls, not even joking.

[Kenshin_BATT0USAI]

It's a cpu limitation. They could do for 4k30fps. but 1080p60fps would still be too much cpu strain. Besides that it would give a raw advantage to the Pro users in competitive modes.

[lelo2play]

So the PS4 Pro couldn't make Destiny 2 run at 60fps due to CPU constraints. It will be curious to see if Scorpio can run the game at 4K/60fps.

PS4 Pro has a decent GPU but the CPU is crap. No wonder there are rumours about Sony launching the PS5 in 2018.

[Neonridr]

which would be suicide if it did come next year. Imagine all the Pro users who just shelled out $400+ for this mid gen upgrade only to be shafted a year later.

[slate91]

Would hurt the gaming market if they released ANOTHER console so soon. I hope ms/sony both wait until 2020

[mogwaii]

Sony dont care how much money you poured into their products, the more the better, you can bet gamers would still buy PS5 regardless.

[Kingthrash360]

Bit then again.....people would still buy a ps4 as well. Let say the scorpio can run D2 at 4k 60....would it be enough to hilt base ps4 and pro sells? Are people willing to leave their friends for power?
I don't think so. Sony playstation 4 will sell ....period. it's exclusives aline will sell it. Smh they won't sell a ps5 next year....it's just a rumor.

[morganfell]

If the policy pertaining to compatibility between the PS4 and the PS4 Pro is extended to the PS5, far far less gamers will be upset than you think. People said the same thing about gamers that just purchased a PS4 having a fit over the Pro launch. Where is all that outrage so many claimed would occur?

[Corpser]

Suicide? What are ps4 gamers going to do really?

[Ju]

Not really. If they can make the Pro cheap enough and a PS5 $399 (again), I wouldn't mind. I probably wouldn't upgrade right away, but maybe will get it eventually. Some PS4 owners who think the step to Pro could however be convinced (before those get lost to Scorpio). I don't think it will have a huge impact. It really depends if Sony can lower the Slim price even further or replaces the entry level with the Pro. I fully assume, the next Playstation will also play PS4 games. No matter how it'll be called.

[timotim]

@Kingtrash

Why is it that the vast majority of your comments comes from a perspective of sales??? Lets say they are able to get Scorpio running at 4K/60...what does sales have to do with that at all. Should I feel bad about my 4K/60FPS Scorpio experience just because Sony continues to sell PS4s??? Would a 4K/60 D2 not benefit Scorpio users and make it the best console version? Your perspective that these negatives are ok because sales will continue just reinforces that you are a fanboy more than a gamer. We can play sales figures dude, but we can play 4K/60FPS games and have a huge smile on our face while doing so...your smile comes from the fact that Sony continues to lead in sales...how lame haha.

[Erik7357]

I think it will be a little longer. Still have not seen last of us 2 man!

[uptownsoul]

Scorpio CAN'T run the game at 4K/60fps...Phil Spencer already said that all XB1 sku's had to run games at the same frame rate (same goes for PS4 sku's too). And we all know neither vanilla consoles will run the game at 60fps

[Obscure_Observer]

@uptownsoul

Again. Only on MP/Competitive modes.

[snoopgg]

Yeah obscure, on mp where the majority will be playing destiny 2.

[rpgenius420]

Never said that. Can you get the quote? Lol on PC the fps are no where near the same dependijng on your rig. There's no advantages there. People make shit up it's hilarious.

[Z501]

He said 'No one left behind' right?

[Kribwalker]

I know you posted this higher up but here's the quote that says the exact opposite
https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...

And why would it be any different then PC? People pay more money and get better pcs that run games at 60 vs 30. That really only seems right

[mwjw696]

No phil never said that. And they have updated if you look above. No parity anymore. WOHO!

[zerocarnage]

Phil ain't said anything and bungie ain't saying a thing on destiny scorpio till e3.

[Braveheart_NZ]

He might have said that ages ago but since then they have changed there minds which they are entitled to do. MS is not mandating any framerate or fidelity requirements on Scorpio including in MP Gaming . Developers will decide what frame rates to allow for there own games. That was from Mike Ybarra himself over on his twitter page yesterday. Do your homework! Go to Twitter and read what he says for yourself.

[Braveheart_NZ]

Wrong! He did say that a year ago but they obviously changed there minds. Mike Ybarra yesterday posted a tweet on Twitter saying Developers are free to choose how they use the power of Project Scorpio for games. We have no requirements limiting framerate or fidelity.

[Obscure_Observer]

@lelo2play

I think the Scorpio will not run this game at 4K 60fps either based on the PC version. Bare in mind that a powerful PC powered by a GTX 1080Ti only achieve 4K 60fps on MEDIUM settings for this game. Once you set for HIGH, the frame drops below 60fps.

If the Scorpio manages to run this game at 4K 60fps, then i´ll finally understand why Digital Foundry used the word "unprecedented" to describe the Scorpio specs.

[Ceaser9857361]

PS5 wont launch before 2020... This are all childish excuses... That CPU Constrain is straight up lie... Destiny 2 has no proper destruction physics or environmental physics.. Also its funny how people overlooked that Bungie decrease the PVP count... It was 12 to 16 in Destiny 1 and now its 4x4 here on Destiny 2... Lazy devs that's all..
They spoke about "improvements" lol! they could have easily updated it on destiny 1 or could have given it as an expansion pack... Cash grab that's all.

[Allsystemgamer]

The Xbox CPU is also crap

[rainslacker]

I wouldn't say crap, but close to the same as the PS4P. Slightly better, but nothing that would make the difference here.

Hard to say in this case since I haven't seen the physics in the game, but it's possible that they just don't have a very good physics engine in place, and making it CPU bound nowadays is kind of backwards, and tends to indicate that they were pushing for graphics over performance. Either that, or PC is their main focus, and they just don't care to adapt their code to console more....which would be quite the job really.

[bluefox755]

The CPU on Scorpio is ALSO crap, lol. It's the same Jaguar cores...slightly overclocked. Scorpio doesn't stand a chance in hell at running the game at 60fps.

[rainslacker]

The Scorpio's CPU is only slightly better than the PS4P. Even with any customization, it's still going to run into the same issue.

The CPU's are the way they are to keep costs down, and for games that are CPU bound, we see this problem. This is why both console makers heavily emphasize the use of GPU compute to get better results, because the CPU's in these systems aren't mean to take heavy loads.

After the Scorpio's spec reveal, this is the biggest criticism that was stated against the console. While a valid criticism to some degree, it also disregards that games on the system aren't supposed to be programmed like this.

Since I haven't seen the physics involved in D2, I can't say if they could have done it through GPU compute, and maybe toned down the resolution to achieve 60fps, but for now, I'll take the developer at their word. But I will reitterate that this will be the same on the Scorpio.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Lol

[Next_gen_2015]

There is literally zero reason to own a pro.

[Traingamez]

Agreed bought both the xbone-s and the ps4 pro and returned them ... On my 4K Samsung HDR display I didn't notice much of a difference at all and got my money back I already have the vanilla version so there was no reason to upgrade that goes for Xbox and PS4 they both need to launch a new console

[Ju]

Why not? It's only $100 more. Really depends your budget. Pro is the better machine, regardless. I think its well worth those extra $100

[Uken12]

Companies need to invest in games and not mid gen upgrades that are limited. PS4 is powerful enough, no reason to make the PS4 Pro except for the VR move. They should just invest into more games.

Same goes for MS, actually MS has really duffed it (Sony not so bad). Xbox One Game..... And now Scorpio with no games. Sweet.

[Saigon]

@Traingamez

You are either lying or do not know how to setup your rig. It took me a while, but I was able to setup everything. Had to place everything in the right HDMI ports, etc. and then setup the system to apply the HDR functionality under the right video options and the PS4 Pro runs everything itself from there. Your comments will misguide people and it seems like your doing it on purpose. Either way, if you look at @uptownsoul comment through this thread he is correct, it has nothing to do with what you claim.

[MadMax]

There's plenty of reason. I own both standard and a pro. The difference on a game like horizon, injustice 2 or mass effect is well worth the extra $100 for a pro!

[rainslacker]

Why? because D2 doesn't run at 60fps?

While I feel that it's not really necessary to own one over the stock PS4, it's a nice console and does improve the games that take advantage of it, so if one has the money(only $100 more than the stock PS4), then might as well get it.

[ILive]

People on this site aren't too funny! You guys crack me up.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

😂😂😂

[Neonridr]

Can PS4 Pro users choose a 1080p/60fps option instead then? I don't want to be handcuffed at 30fps if I can take a lower resolution with a higher framerate.

[Erik7357]

Nope. Pc it is

[Neonridr]

damn, that's silly. Might have to look at the PC version.

[DragonDDark]

I might just get it for pc. 60fps > all

[darksky]

Who's to say it will be hugely successful on PC though. It's multiplayer game so relies totally on player base and usually the PC playbase is much smaller than PS4.

[Princess_Pilfer]

Physics. So, it's almost certainly CPU bound, not GPU bound. Resolution is probably not a factor here.

Not that your point in general is invalid, 1080p/60 with higher settings > 4k/30 with lower settings. It's just graphics performance is probably not the issue here.

[Bigpappy]

Well you know Horizon runs at 30 fps too right? That games is Sony's 1st party and not at native 4K.

[Ju]

^^ Give it a rest. HZD is the benchmark for sustained 4K@30 at that fidelity. Show me one game that looks better in 4K, CB or not, and actually has that consistent frame rate.

[rainslacker]

Physics doesn't have to be CPU bound. In fact, the majority of the processes meant for GPU compute are actually physics calculations, because the GPU's are designed to process that kind of math with much better efficiency than even the fastest CPU that exists.

[_-EDMIX-_]

Agreed

[CrimsonPheonix]

This is why I skipped on the pro.

[Corpser]

No they said th game is CPU bound , reducing resolution won't help frame rate

[FPS_D3TH]

No and thankfully not. Rather not have a few gamers get dumb advantages over base consoles.

[Neonridr]

so then Sony is flat out lying about the Pro then. They were saying there were going to be Pro enhancements for people without 4K TV's. That is quickly turning out to be untrue as less and less games are giving us options.

In my case I have a 4K TV so it's not a big deal, but just something to notice I guess for those who haven't made the splurge.

[corroios]

Jag cpu are crap no matter howmuck overclock.

[zivtheawesome]

just because of the misleading headline. they already confirmed that ALL consoles will target 30fps before people scream that scoprio would do 60. they claim it is due to cpu constraints that makes zero sense to me when games like battlefield target 60fps and look better.

[Eliseo676]

They actually said they wouldn't talk about Scorpio yet. They didn't implied Scorpio was included on their statement, they did give a separate statement on it.

Or you know, you could keep believing it's a misleading headline, never bothered you guys before.

[zivtheawesome]

yea but they did say that ALL console versions will target 30fps. they just didn't explain how D2 benefits from scorpio. also they claim that the problem is the cpu and the scorpio's cpu is about 10% faster than the pro's so it would be stupid if one could run 60 and the other won't. especially in 4k resolutions.

[thekhurg]

All consoles includes the scorpio machine. They aren't specifically talking about that platform, but they lump summed the entire collection of consoles when they said "all consoles".

[Eliseo676]

@thekhurg

http://n4g.com/news/2059318...

Sure... I mean, let's use the literal phrase meaning, and entirely disregard the developers. Such "misleading" headlines.

[Princess_Pilfer]

It makes 0 sense you because you have no idea how games work. In general, the CPU has very little to do with how the game looks, that's the GPU, the CPU is doing all of the math to make the game work. Physics engines are a *huge* drain on CPU resources, and the Jaguar is a piece of crap, so the game can't run said physics engine and also run the game at 60 fps.

It could be that their physics engine needs to be optomized, or it could be that's it's just doing way more things than battlefield, but how either game looks is not really relevant to this issue.

[Ju]

Physics can run on the GPU, though. I think this is more a (SW) design issue then a real technical problem. Not that all physics can run on the GPU, but offloading most could certainly improve the framerate.

[rainslacker]

Physics are generally meant to be GPU bound. The number one kind of calculation that gets sent to the GPU is physics calculations. The whole point of GPU compute is to process the more intensive physics calcalations be done much faster on a processor that is actually meant to handle computations like that, as opposed to the CPU, which isn't set up to process those kinds of calculations as well.

The CPU can keep track of variables, run game loops, etc, but complex math should always be sent to the GPU nowadays if those calculations are tied to game performance. The only reason not to is to prioritize the visuals of the game.

This is how these systems are designed to be used. CPU is weak because it doesn't need to be powerful when developers make their games the way that Sony and MS designed their systems to run them. It makes sense to do this, and it doesn't hinder PC development, because PC's are capable of GPU compute as well.

[Princess_Pilfer]

The only types of physics I've ever dealt with that tank framerates are CPU bound or directly tied to complex rendering (ie fancy lighting.) Also, if it was a problem of GPU power, there is no reason they wouldn't have said so.

How would you know they aren't offloading everything they can offload? The Jaguar is terrible, and is terrible by standards set before the current consoles released. The original PS4 is about the same as a GTX 950, which is capable of hitting and mostly maintaining 60fps with tweaks to the biggest resource hogs, and easily maintains 30FPS (results vary between ~38 and 47 average and 32 minimum) and yet the console version runs at 30FPS, and *still* has performance problems. Now, why do you think that is? There is no forced parity as the framerate, motion blur and resolution on PC are all better, so that leaves an underpowered CPU that can't keep up or developers committed to giving the console players of their uber precise action game the worst experience possible by making them play the flip book version.

That's not the only example of a game a 950 can typically maintain 60fps in btw, it's just what I'm playing through so it came to mind first.

[Princess_Pilfer]

Oops. Game I'm talking about is Dark Souls 3. Don't know how I forgot to mention that.

[deadfrag]

1080p@60fps pls.Screw 4k.

[TheGamez100]

Why devs always prioritize resolution and not even give us the option for higher framerates is beyond me. Forget 4k most ppl dont even own a 4k tv, sadly they think pro owners only want higher resolutions. I would even take 900p@60fps.

[OMGitzThatGuy]

Because Sony cheaped out on the CPU, same as the Scorpio. It is easier to lower res but lowering res doesnt = to higher framerates unless the GPU is the bottleneck. Which by Bungie's remarks about physics, it is the CPU. 30fps to 60fps requires double the about of GPU and CPU while doubling the res would only require double the GPU power.

[TheColbertinator]

Go for the PC version. Easy. Dont waste time on the Sony consoles.

[thekhurg]

Destiny 2 on PS4 has more content. In a game where people are always content starved, I'll take the platform with the most to do.

[Maxor]

LOL more content. The only thing the PS4 have is 30 FPS and timed exclusives. The timed exclusives will go away in a month or two but the 30 garbage stays forever. I'm sorry but 60 FPS is never, ever the wrong choice. 60 FPS wins all day everyday.

[TankCrossing]

Unfortunately if Destiny 1 is any indication, the timed exclusive content is held for a year, with further content blocked in every expansion as well.

It is a shitty deal.

[thekhurg]

@maxor

You might be new to Destiny - but the extra content is long term. Not a month or two long. Destiny extra content goes from core game to 1st expansion, then new extra content from from expansion to 2nd, etc...

[Maxor]

Except this time its different. Destiny 2 is exclusive to Bnet on the PC, it's from Activision's own billion dollars hit maker Blizzard. They will not need to surrender 70% of the profits to Sony or Microsoft to pay the console tax, all sales made are 100% profits so Sony's deal will not apply on the PC.

[thekhurg]

@maxor

Yeah. It will.

The announcement trailer clearly states "exclusive content until at least fall 2018".

[Bolts]

Preach it. 60 FPS is life. When I switched from Nioh 60 FPS to Nioh 30 FPS I almost barfed. Destiny 2 deserves 60 FPS, it also deserves better tick rate and dedicated servers but Bungie and Activision couldn't give a F about what gamers deserve.

[generic-user-name]

Nah, I'll go for the one with more content. 30fps certainly wasn't my issue with destiny 1.

[Next_gen_2015]

@generic-user-name

LOL your "extra content" is timed. It will eventually release on xbox and PC

[generic-user-name]

@next gen

Sure it's timed, but by the time you get it, we'll have new exclusive content for year 2. 60fps isn't worth all that waiting imo, that's why I also won't be waiting for the PC version of RDR2.

[AmUnRa]

Yeah, no..my pc is not able to run this game at 1080P at 60 fps. So 4k is a big nono for me. Infact i think most PC gamers can not do that with theyr PC's.
So i'am not wasting time on PC's. I play this game on my PS4 pro, thank you, but it is a big nono for my PC's, and many others. 😉

[thekhurg]

Everyone on video game websites has 8k capable machines pushing 200+ fps. Didn't you know that?

[starchild]

I'm sorry, but if your PC is weaker than your PS4 Pro you're probably not that serious about PC gaming anyway and you were probably always going to play this on your console because that is where you play most games. There's nothing wrong with that, but your comment seems like a pointless attempt to downplay the PC somehow.

[rocketpanda]

You mean on consoles. As in plural, Sony and MS or do you have a specific chip on your shoulder towards Sony only.

[Bolts]

I have over 1200 hours in Destiny, and nothing can ever make me choose 30 FPS over 60 FPS. I would hate to leave the exclusives and friends behind but I refuse to suffer anymore of this 30 FPS bullshit. This is infuriating because The Surge in 60 FPS on the Pro feels soooo smooth. Just when I thought the dream is within reach Bungie happened.

Time to dust up that Battlenet launcher.

[mogwaii]

I was gonna say at least its got a 4k option but damn i would take 60fps over 4k anyday, it would've been sony pushing for 4k over fps no doubt, why not give the option at least?! FFS!
If scorpio ends up having this option or better still 4k AND 60fps then i know where im going.
Sony you better make the "PS5" powerful enough to pull both off!

[Yohshida]

Bullsht, you guys are just lazy as fck. Dont Support this, vote with your wallet.

[CrimsonPheonix]

Vote with your wallet and don't buy a pro.

[Patriot4Life]

Lol.

But you are ok with 1 year content and expansion PS exclusive.

[rainslacker]

Maybe some people don't have a problem with 30fps? I don't think that was a major criticism with the original, and for the most part, I don't think most people care either way. There is a vocal group that says they care, and likely do, but they certainly don't represent the general consumer.

[Bolts]

My love hate relationship with this game continues.

[Tzuno]

Ps4Pro should have been a 2k console, that old cpu inside is dragging down the console.

[PFFT]

It always has. The CPU has always been known to Bottleneck the Console since day one.

[Saijahn]

Of course they won't comment on Scorpio, 1. It's not out yet and 2. It would look bad as they're partners with Sony.
If Scorpio runs it at 4K 60fps, the question would come, why be partnered up with an inferior console anymore?

When Scorpio does launch, it's going to be an interesting time indeed.

[Cryptcuzz]

I keep seeing people make this assumption, but everyone needs to to remember the Scorpio is just an iterative version of the Xbox One. Just like the Pro is to the PS4. They will play the same games and and at their core, the very same consoles.

Did you really expect Scorpio players will play the game at 60 fps and Xbox one players play the games in 30 fps??? Or do you expect there to be two separate servers and such for both the Scorpio and the Xbox one players? Think about it, they are both the same consoles at heart, so the games and multiplayer has to be able to be able to run on the same pipelines, the same infrastructure, the same lobby's, etc.

Which one is it? Cause either one will be a bad thing. Cross gen multiplier games with those playing in 30 fps and 60 fps isn't going to happen straight up. It simply won't be synced up and will create more problems for everyone.

Two separate servers and such won't happen either, since Bungie/Activision isn't going to have dedicated servers, let alone other servers to host social portions of the game for one sku of their game.

All this wouldn't matter if it was a single player, no online aspects to the game, but I bet it's the same reason why the Pro was capped at 30 fps too. It's easier for them to do that than figure out how they can resolve why Pro and later on Scorpio players are running at higher fps, compared to the OG players running at half the fps in the same multiplayer lobbies!

With an online multiplayer game, where server upticks, latency, and the whole territory, a game with a huge difference in fps from one player to the next isn't going to work. Especially when the majority players will be the ones running in the lower fps (OG PS4 and OG Xbox One)

[slavish0]

Pc play 30fps and 60fps and 120fps people together all the time. Xbox brand mimic's pc more then console

[PFFT]

Yes im more than sure both the XB1 and Scorpio players can play together despite the Frame disparity. It wont be a problem at all.

[freshslicepizza]

Forza Horizon 3 allows crossplay with the PC and it is a Windows/Xbox game published by Microsoft run through Xbox Live. On the PC you can have an unlocked frame rate going well beyond 60fps if your hardware is sufficient and on theXbox One it is locked at 30fps, so it isn't far fetched to think Scorpio could not also pull this off.

[phantomxll]

You're so wrong it's not even funny

[Stapleface]

If you listen to the Fireteam chat on IGN where this quote was pulled from, a dev next to Luke Smith tells why this is the case. The Pro wouldn't be doing 60fps @1080p either. Something about the physics, and the cpu can't keep up with the calculations..

[Patriot4Life]

I still don't understand how Destiny 2 is more demanding physics wise that Battlefield 1.

[--bienio--]

Hahaha btw?? Hahaha

[CP_Company]

lazy as feck those developers.2013 graphics can not run in 60fps,give me a brake. but what to expect from activision,nothing new here. DLC called Destiny 2 and players going to pay full price :)

[Prince_TFK]

I would love to see you lead a Dev team to develop a 2017 fps game that run at 4k60fps on ps4 pro.

[rocketpanda]

Silly follow up. What a terrible movie, would like to see you make a better one! What a terrible album., would like you to see you produced a better one. Same logic to gaming.

Yes, I bet most of us would be bad at leading any dev team, it doesn't mean you have to shut up and not be critical of any medium. You honestly think some systems can't even do 1080/60? Doom done it on a regular PS4. Nioh devs gave users options to run at high frames with lower effects or lower frames with more effects.

Yes, it is lazy on their part to not at least offer those who have s Pro performance with frames or some options.

"Rich physics" gtfo! Unless I am playing physics simulator 2017 then I call BS.

[Prince_TFK]

Rocketpanda

They clearly stated that the GPU in the ps4 is fine, it is the CPU that is the cause of the problem. So clearly the problem isn't arised from thin air. Even if it does, and even if Bungie or Activision are "lazy", I would love to see you list a few games of this caliber from other devs that play at 4k60fps.

I do agree with you that we have the rights to demand more, to certain resonable and logical degree however.

[CP_Company]

where i am writing that i want 4k 60fps? maybe next time wrote,that i would love to see you lead a dev team to develop a 2017 fps games in 16k144fps? why to be so shy?
and again,this is not 2017 game,it is the same 2013 game,you need to check your eyes,and your brain,because you are delusional about all my comment :)

and agains,you comment rocketpanda comment,and you like playing broken phone,are you retarded on purpose? or are you for real?

[Perjoss]

It would be fantastic if the game ran at 60 but having said that I never felt that playing it at 30 ruined the experience for me at all, it was still really, really good fun.

[bellyboy]

What a joke, negative reactions before its even out because they are making the wrong choice with 4K. idiots. 30fps for a fps just doesnt look or feel right. Game will most likely bomb.

[snoopgg]

The first one didn't bomb and it was 30 fps wasn't it?

[hulk_bash1987]

I literally have no issues playing at 30fps and ive been playing since day one. Most people complaining are doing so because of the controversy, they don't even care about the game. Would i like them have an option for a 1080p/60fps mode? Of course i would, but its not a make or break for me. As long as it runs a consistent 30fps like the first game, I'll be happy.

[Wallstreet37]

Lol at the ppl denying and saying that the jaguar cpus aren't bottlenecks, yes Scorpio included lol We tried to tell you :)

Also these comments were talking in general about all the consoles, not specifically pro.

[phantomxll]

You should do some research on the Scorpio CPU... It's much more than a Jaguar

[butchertroll]

Don't listen phantom. That guy thinks that only Scorpio has a custom Jaguar CPU.

[sadsatan]

can't wait to read the comments section when scorpio runs destiny 2 at 30fps lol

[Patriot4Life]

That would be messed up...as lazy as Bungie are I hope they don't downgrade the Scorpio version just because they have a deal with Sony.

[DrJones]

Jaguar

[Good-Smurf]

I can really see the next gen console going to need a lot power just to make please these developers who couldn't sort out their priority well so we ended up with yet another unoptimized engine running unoptimized.
If your game can't hit 60 then go somewhere else that it can reach 60. ;reduce the resolution duh.

[Vasto]

1080p / 60fps should have been the main focus.

[zb1ftw777]

1080 60fps or gtfo

4k 30fps is shit.

[Dalailana]

Time to get a switch it can actually run games at 60fps while being the size of your palm.

[WeAreLegion]

The Switch couldn't run this at 10 fps.

[zb1ftw777]

I agree.

But then again, the Switch has decent games. Not more fps level up loot rinse grind repeat for 60 months garbage like this.

[hulk_bash1987]

Switch has what? Zelda and Mario cart 8, both of which can be played on the WiiU. Try again troll.

[joab777]

Guarantee this is BS. The reason neither Pro or Scorpio will run at 60 is because of mp. That AND, as a Sony has exclusivity, they do no want Destiny to become the one game that sells Scorpios.

[WeAreLegion]

Totally agree. There has to be frame rate parity for multiplayer.

[NobleRed]

Every COD game runs with no problems with 60 fps in 8vs 8 and this game can't even run with 60 fps in an online 4vs 4 player match? Jeez these lazy devs.

[X-23]

You people are letting Bungie and Destiny 2 (a recycled mess I bet) dictate what your opinion is on console superiority, some people here are even suggesting Sony should release PS5 because of the Scorpio...Wow...just Wow...what Grade A Nonsense... the mentality that's emerged with this current gaming generation is just an all out mess.

I recall hearing that, what happened to be holding original Destiny back was the last gen support it had ... I get it, now current gen consoles are what's holding it back, sure. Okay.

[rainslacker]

My only issue with Destiny from the beginning was the rather extensive timed exclusive DLC deals that Sony has with the game. Sony must have paid a crap ton of money to get a one year deal like that, and I'd rather they have put that money somewhere else.

And I'm a Sony fan.

But, despite this, Sony is still delivering, so whatever. The business side of gaming is silly, but apparently effective, or else it wouldn't keep getting done.

[WeAreLegion]

I seriously doubt we'd see 60 for Pro or Scorpio, anyway. That would give those users a huge advantage in multiplayer.

[greywolf39]

such a stupid thing to say from bungie. How can CoD, BF... run in 60 but thisshit which has the same 2014 graphics cant?!?! Look at Horizon, Uncharted 4, BF1...

[NickAwesome]

Understandable considered how weak the cpu is, shame sony didn't add more juice to the ps4 and the ps4 pro

[ocelot07]

Even though I have a Pro and a 4K TV. I much rather have 900p 60FPS than 4K 30FPS. It's a £300 console I don't expect 4K 60FPS. If I PC with a GTX 1080 inside struggles at 4K 60 then I don't expect a £300 console to do the same. 30FPS during co-op I can live with. But is 60FPS PvP really that difficult? Even on the older PS4 and Xbox One's?

[Maxor]

Nobody is asking 4K 60 FPS. I think the established baseline on the Pro is 1080p 60 FPS and that was an expectation the machine couldn't meet. I think on the PC even the lowly RX 480 would be able to push Destiny 2 at 60 FPS with EASE.

[ocelot07]

The RX 480 is a beast of a card for 1080p. I had 2 of them but recently got a 1080 ti. For 1080p the 480 was great and yer will most likely achieve 1080p 60 for Destiny with ease. In fact will probably do 1440p at 60fps with a few changes to the graphics setting.

[Deep-throat]

A GTX1080 doesn't struggle to do 4K60, unless you want to play games at max settings. Consoles don't do that, it's a different story.

[Maxor]

God dammit. Thank god I have a gaming PC for this but I still would've preferred the Pro to be 60 FPS but the power just isn't there. What's interesting is how they didn't want to talk about the Scorpio's performance.

[xYLeinen]

You all got it wrong. The ps4 pro is developed specifically for 4K games and entertainment not mainly for 60 fps.

[corroios]

With zero evolution on graphics it should run at 60 frames on the base ps4. Sorry bungie but battlefield can just lower the rez

[maybelovehate]

Sadly this will mean they cap Scorpio too. With Sony having such a heavy deal with Activision there is no way Sony will let Scorpio have an advantage.

[PFFT]

Sony wont be able to do jack shit! They are partnered with Bungie and all they can do is get exclusive DLC. No more no Less.

[maybelovehate]

No, they are partnered with Activision. And they will not want to hurt that partnership. Watch.

[butchertroll]

Sorry, but marketing deal has nothing to do with Scorpios power. Anyway, CPU in Scorpio is Jaguar crap.

[phantomxll]

Actually the Scorpio CPU is custom built and works nothing like you're assuming. There won't he bottle necking. Just do a little research of your own.

[maybelovehate]

It is based on Jaguar, which is crap. But it also is a lot more powerful than what is in Pro.

[PFFT]

Yeah its crap. On that i highly agree. Its also the Standard PS4 and Pro's bane.

[butchertroll]

Quote :

But it also is a lot more powerful than what is in Pro.

.....

CPU in Scorpio isn't that much more powerful than CPU in Pro. Intel i3 or i5 are more powerful. You need really a hefty CPU in Scorpio to push same game to 60fps if it's 30 fps on Pro.

[maybelovehate]

It is a custom chip so it is hard to say just how much better it is. As for the speeds, it is 8 cores at 2.3 vs 8 cores at 2.1, so you are looking at 1.6 overall GHZ advantage. Which is quite a bit. Plus you are looking at a 108GB/s bandwidth difference when you are talking about the CPU and GPU working in tandem.

[butchertroll]

Quote :

As for the speeds, it is 8 cores at 2.3 vs 8 cores at 2.1, so you are looking at 1.6 overall GHZ advantage. Which is quite a bit.

.....

WOW, just WOW! Your calculation is a goddamn wrong, man. In any single way. Scorpios CPU has 9,5% more speed clock than Pros CPU, not 70+%.
I mean, jeez, man!

[maybelovehate]

It isn't a single core.. do the math. .2 * 8. And I never said it was 70% faster. Ps4 has 8 cores as well, obviously. It is 1.6ghz faster. Overall, not per core

[butchertroll]

Quote :

It isn't a single core.. do the math. .2 * 8. And I never said it was 70% faster. Ps4 has 8 cores as well, obviously. It is 1.6ghz faster. Overall, not per core

......
But you said that. You said that Scorpio has 1.6 GHz (70+% ) more clock speed! It is so obvious. You can't add 1.6 GHz just like that. Your calculation is so wrong, man. Jeez. Then every game should fly at 100 fps on Scorpio. You should go back to reality!
Tech sites, which are more informed about tech site DOESN'T CALCULATE like you did, man!

Xbox One CPU speed increased by 9.375 per cent
http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

Not 1,2 Ghz ( according to your math, LOL! ), but 150 Mhz

[maybelovehate]

You do realize you just posted an article from 2013 about the Xbox One right. Good lord. This site needs to offer some tutors for the specials.

So the actual speed difference in MHZ would be around 200 if your brain can't do the math between the two. PER CORE and we are talking about 8 cores.

[butchertroll]

Lol! So what if the article is from 2013. I showed you an EXAMPLE how they calculated clock speed. You can't calculate overall clock speed. That's wrong and nonexistent, man.

XBONEs CPU has 150 Mhz clock speed more than PS4s CPU which is 9.3% and NOT like your calculation which is 70+%. LOL. Same is applied to Scorpios CPU.

[rocketpanda]

If DOOM managed to run smoothly at 1080/60 on a regular PS4 and look fairly well too then I can't see how it isn't possible on a Pro at 1080 at least.

The excuse of "rich physics" is a nonsense hype term publishers throw out there. Optimise your damn game. 30fps on fps games too janky.

[Ceaser9857361]

Next Activision will come up with "offer will be like this "Import your Destiny 1 guardian to Destiny 2 with all the levels and weapons for $$$$$ " :D :D

[Guyfamily999]

It won't be able to run at 60fps on Scorpio either. It's a CPU bottleneck and the Scorpio has one as well. The Game can't not hit 60 because of the resolution, it couldn't hit 60 on any console because it's limited by the CPU. An example is FF15, it can run at 1800p 30fps but at 1080p it only hits 45 fps on average. Destiny has a lot of AI and some physics going on. So yeah not Bungie's fault, these imporved consoles were meant to mostly run games at the same framerate at higher resolutions.

[phantomxll]

Have you read anything about the Scorpio's CPU on your own or are you just repeating what you've heard from others here that are afraid of the Scorpio. There are tons of articles about bottlenecking not being an issue based on the custom Jag CPU. It's not just a regular Jaguar CPU. 60fps won't be a problem.

[butchertroll]

Quote :

Actually the Scorpio CPU is custom built and works nothing like you're assuming. There won't he bottle necking. Just do a little research of your own.

PS4/PS4 Pro, Xbone also have custom Jaguar. Do some research of your own, dude! Scorpio also use Jaguar tech, IT'S A JAGUAR!

For this example :

"Chip manufacturer AMD benefitted the most from these upgrades. Xbox One has a custom 1.75GHz AMD 8-core CPU, a last-minute upgrade over its original 1.6GHz processor.

The PS4 CPU remained clocked at 1.6GHz and contains a similar custom AMD 8-core CPU with x86 based architecture."

http://www.techradar.com/ne...

Again, PS4/PS4Pro/Xbone also have a CUSTOM JAGUAR! And also it's a bottleneck in Scorpio too. 60fps will be a problem for some games on Scorpio. YOU SHOULD GO BACK TO REALITY.

[phantomxll]

BUTCHER TROLL did you bother to find out what's so custom about the Scorpio CPU and the benefits of it yet? Or are you just satisfied with numbers that don't tell the whole story?

[DeadSilence]

Scorpio CPU is the same as Ps4 Pro lol Microsoft lying to custom with that Evolved jaguar bs loool

[thexmanone]

Link please, or are you a upset fanboy trolling because Scorpio will out perform the Pro

[butchertroll]

Scorpio's CPU tech is the same as in Pro - IT'S JAGUAR!

[Haki1112]

Me and my 1080 will be happy to play this in 60+fps 😀

[iistuii]

Yep me too.

[masterfox]

yeah right whatever you say Bungie.

[filipakos]

Having 60 fps on ps4 pro and 30 fps on ps4/ps4 slim doesnt seem fair for PVP so it would be better if it was 30 fps on all versions even xbox and scorpio

[Hendog1981]

Is anyone surprised that the Pro can't do 60fps on a game like destiny. People weren't seriously thinking that it could were they?

[Patriot4Life]

Not surprise because its Bungie and they have always been lazy when developing games.

But I am surprise that its Destiny 2 sine Battfield 1 can do 60 fps.

[MetroidFREAK21]

While the PC version will run at an uncapped resolution and framerate. That is the version I am getting ;)

[mochachino]

In a FPS you'll want clarity in motion over image sharpness.

4k may look great, but 30 FPS is always very blurry 1080p @60 would be less sharp but much clearer.

[PistolsAtDawn]

#NoParity

[DafunkyRebel]

It not that it couldn't, more likely that bungie kept it at a certain frame rate so it's fair for all players of crucible, strikes and raids.

[senorfartcushion]

Can hear the graphics whores screaming as we read this

[pleasuretokill]

This is why being a PC gamer is so awesome. I pick how much I want to spend on my system, and then choose which settings I wish to play at. Pay more for the hardware? Of course. You always pay more for the best things in life.

[steveo123456]

So true my friend so true. Personally I'll probably give this a miss as they couldn't be arsed bringing the first one to pc. If it turns out to be amazing then you never know.

[MetroidFREAK21]

I never played the orignal, but I'm still getting it. Gonna get demolished online by better mouse and keyboard players, but it will be all in good fun :)

[Felsager]

Better smooth FPS than 4k.

Don't make it 4k. Simple.

[Storm Shadow NF]

I guess the game is so advanced it can't handle more than 4 vs 4 hahahah. Lazy MF's BF1 does 64, new COD has 32 and bungie forces 4 vs 4 on everyone !!! No offense the game looks like destiny 1. Nice job Instead of making it next gen they pull this shit. The old destiny ran on 360 for god's sake !!!!

[Felsager]

"the old destiny ran on a 360 ffs"

True. The game engine and the graphics looks awful. No improvement at all.

[F0XHOUND]

Hmm, well when the last of us 2 from naughty dog runs at 60fps, I guess the ps4 pro has more power then? Or, maybe the dev needs to optimise their engine better? Seems to me, this dev has made bad decisions in this regard vs more optimisation orientation devs. More power isn't always the answer, it just helps to have!

[GearSkiN]

what about Scorpio? now they gotta make it fair since pro couldn't?

[Corpser]

Time for ps5 already

[Stevonidas]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Gwiz]

It wouldn't need to be 4K lol.Just make it 1440p or something.Even though i have a decent PC i'm not going to support this game.That includes PS4 Pro,Xbox One S,PC you need to talk with your wallets people.

[steveo123456]

For years consoles have been​ inadvertently gimping pc games. Now consoles are gimping console games. Life's a bitch

[Gwiz]

lmao

[FPS_D3TH]

Are people actually surprised about this? We all know how fairly underpowered this mid gen upgrade is, it's only a console built for 4K. Destiny was never a 60fps game to begin with so we're people actually expecting a mid gen small upgrade to pump out pc level processing power. Your ps4pro is a 4K machine only, not a big console upgrade. Gamers and their expectations though...

[Dmagic]

you dont even make sense shut up.

[FPS_D3TH]

Solid rebuttal my dude

[chobit_A5HL3Y]

i'm more surprised that bungie literally changed NOTHING about the game lol it looks exactly the same as the first one except for a hud change, which could have been done with a hotfix. this sequel is just dlc being sold at full price, with features that should have been implemented in the first one. they're duping you into another 100+$ game for stuff that should have been updates and dlc lol people trash talk cod for being the same year after year; this game hasn't changed AT ALL since the first one... you wouldn't even know it's not dlc if they didn't tell you.

[QUIMICOMORTAL]

I bet that at 1080 it could! why did they decide not to take that route?

[fluxmulder]

Yep. Get it for PC, problem solved.

[mmj]

AMD Jaguar is a major bottleneck confirmed.

PS4 Pro/Scorpio could have easily trebled or even quadrupled frame rates simply by upgrading the CPU to an equivalently clocked Ryzen processor, the fact that they stuck with Jaguar shows that they are both nothing but upgrades aimed at 4K users.

[joab777]

BS. Maybe not at 4k, but why not offer choice to run at 1080? Why? Because of mp! I don't know why the lies? Just say it isn't fair for those playing on PS4 and X1.

[ps5fanboy]

Still a shite game then in many ways.

[Dan_scruggs]

lol

[Razuel]

doubt that any aaa title will hit 60 fps and 4k with 4 teraflops.

[StormSailor]

I have a regular PS4, so it does not make much of a difference to me, but if I had a PS4 pro I would have conscience that it is only a medium PS4 upgrade costing the same price as the original PS4 of 2014 and not a new generation

[LastCenturyRob]

Thoroughly enjoy my X1 and tons of games on it...even the ones that display 720p... Anyone who thinks resolution makes or breaks a game really isn't much of a true gamer..... If it can't do 4k/60 have it do 1440p/60 or 1080p/60... It will still look amazing!

[Tedakin]

Most people don't have a 4k tv.... Go 2k and 60fps... :)

[Ashunderfire86]

Face it guys even the Xbox Scorpio version is only going to be 30fps, because its CPU is 2.3 compared to PS4 Pro's 2.1 which isn't enough. The numbers don't lie! No matter how you splice it. This is coming from a gamer that is always a console gamer first, and PC second. I got a monster PC too 4K capable and everything with a 4K TV. I am very selective when it comes to which 3rd party version I am going to get from either platform. I always look at the track record of the game developer, and base my platform decision on that fact. I didn't get Prey on PC, because the track record of Arkane Studios with the game Dishonored 2. I really didn't want to take a chance. I made that mistake with Batman Arkham Knight back when I had a 2 980ti support with i5 4690K all overclock! Batman Arkham Knight launch run like crap on the PC, while the PS4 version I later bought on sale ran pretty good, and look pretty close to the PC version. Now I am going to see how Bungie does Destiny 2 on PC, before I make my decision on what version to get. Too many good games coming out this year. Destiny 2 I am going to wait and see before I jump in. In the mean time I will be playing Uncharted: Lost Legacy.

[TheDivine]

Rather have a switch version. Don't even like Destiny and I would buy it on switch. Portable is better than 4k any day.

[jer1122]

It's funny that they can't get it to run at 60 frames a second I mean Battlefield running at 60 frames on the PS4 Pro and it's running at a 1600 P upscale resolution. And that game has way better graphics 64 players with destruction. maybe Bungie and Activision with all the money they should have upgrade their engine. I'm sorry about the PS4 Pro with the power at half should be able to run it at 1080p 60fps like a lot of other games. Honestly my take on this is that they don't want to have 60 FPS on the PS4 Pro or Scorpio because it could alienate people on Xbox and PS4 OG and they're just using this as an excuse

[Tussin187]

I'm starting to wonder what games people play because most games on consoles aren't 60fps and never have been.

Well you guys can continue to argue about framerate and I'll play the game at a solid 30 and call it a day. I was fine with the first game and I'll be fine with this one.

[spence52490]

I did not read the article but does the game at least run in 60 fps for 1080?

[NotanotherReboot]

Absolutely pathetic

[Bolts]

So the PS4 Pro is too weak to reach 60 FPS. Now the question is can the so called most powerful console ever can hit 60 FPS or not?

[dennigo]

gonna get some hate on this, i own both a ps4 pro and a capable game pc.
i prefer 60fps too, but when you're playing with a controller 30fps won't handicap you it won't be as visually appealing but with a controller it won't handicap your skill, now with mouse and keyboard that's a different thing

[3-4-5]

60 fps over 4k any day.

I'm cool with Destiny 2 at 30 fps as that is what I played it on before with my XB1 and it was fine like that.

I'm more interested in 4k once it doesn't tax the systems/cpu/gpu.

When running 4k becomes like running 900p.....then we can talk.

Either way this game looks good...more so a 1.5 than a full sequel, but it seems like they had more time to fully realize maybe what they wanted this game to be all along.

I still think we won't get a true fully awesome Destiny until Destiny 3 next gen.

[BuildTheWall]

Destiny 2 would be 4k @ 30fps on the PS4 Pro. Only 30fps @ 4k OMG the world is going to end!!!

[Hakoom]

hand it over to naughty dog and it wil run at 60fps

[steveo123456]

Yes, on ps5

[bluefox755]

In the interview, they cite the CPU has the reason. Using this logic, the Scorpio, which has a cpu only marginally better than the Pro, doesn't have a chance at running at 60fps either.

[Artemidorus]

Looks the same as the last one so sounds like the excuses are comming in earlier.

Make a 2K 60fps or will they make up more stories??

[Tankbusta40]

Bungie already making excuses, it probably just takes more work than they were willing to invest. These guys are notorious liars, I remember when the beta came out and David DJ or whatever claimed they had expedited levels, as everyone leveled so quickly. Game came out, the leveling was the same and people hit level cap in less than a day. Shady people.

[worldwidegaming]

Graphics graphics graphics. That's the war cry we cry out when we hit the drums.
There are limits and that's related to cash. Not everyone has a 1.5 version of a ps4 or xbox one.
Alienating the majority to please a minority of gamers who can afford the TV and Console would be
A mistake and They all know this.
Run those 60fps numbers with or without graphics.
People will complain that the game is not optimized or it was crappy programming
But we all know it's the console limits we are dealing with.

[DJ_Professor_K]

My have something to do with multi player that's my quick guess even playing filed but it still could be 60fps single or co op one thing for sure it stinks

[NohansenBoy]

That's... sad. Bad thing about console hardware is it becomes dated quite quickly. They didn't even change the CPU, just overclock it a little.

[InTheZoneAC]

I find it hard to believe a game running at 30fps on ps3 can't run at 60fps on ps4 pro

[ASBO-5]

Aaaaaaaaaaaand bulls**t. Naughty Dog & Gorilla could do it in their sleep, these talentless hack's just need to put in a little something called effort

[MagicBeanz]

Like always if you want no constraints play on PC.

[Kyizen]

This sucks especially since Destiny 1 ran at...oh wait 30 FPS

[Profchaos]

At the heart of the game it's a multuplayer game Sony is committed to ensuring fps remain the same across the PS4 family for multuplayer

[AuraAbjure]

What's important is the game looks good on paper like in magazines or screenshots on the web. That's why they're called picture games afterall.

[MadMax]

Awesome decision! 30fps is perfectly fine. As long as I'm getting the beauty of 4k on my Samsung 55in HDR display, I'm happy!

[Scatpants]

This is just news to bolster the release of the Scorpio version. I'm making a prediction right now that Destiny 2 has a marketing deal with Microsoft and will be one of the big 3rd party games in their E3 show.

[Thunder_G0d_Bane]

Loool well you're already wrong. It's already been revealed that Sony have the marketing deal with destiny 2 as continued from destiny 1. PS4 destiny 2 will get all exclusive content. Plus during the gameplay reveal only PS4 footage could be recorded an uploaded no pc footage allowed.

[Doopy]

PS4 Pro is a lot like a bag of poop minus the bag.

[HaVoK308]

Come E3 we find out it can run 60fps on Microsoft's Scorpio, what platform to purchase Destiny on will be an easy decision for me.

[SugarSoSweet]

PS4 is only 4.3 TFLOPS compared to the 6 TFLOPS of course it won't do 4K with 60 fps

[LordofYogurt]

It's happening again, just like the first damn game! Now every damn article is going to be about this steaming pile of mediocrity.

That's right, it's not a bad game...it's just...meh

The diehard fans really confuse the hell outta me. I don't know why this game is a thing. It's a true testament to the power of hype and marketing.

[Kakashi Hatake]

This notion that Scorpio is head and shoulders above the Pro is a joke. Whatever Scorpio runs at native 4k, the Pro will do at upscaled 1800p. People expecting a huge difference are setting themselves up for disappointment. Companies are not going to put a lot of resources into Scorpio versions. Scorpio is a sub product of the X1, not a standalone product. Most of MS sales will come from the regular Xbox One.

[Gemmol]

Stop being a hater like the others on here I'm a SwitchPS4 owner and even i respect what the Scorpio is doing......when ps4 pro was stronger than Xbox one S everyone who have Sony here got all crazy and happy about it.......Scorpio close to come out and every Sony fan making up whatever reason to not make it a big deal.........they have the strongest console plain and simple, games will look way better on it plain and simple, but at the end of the day graphics is not everything, this why ps2 did well when it was the weakest......this also why not worried about the Switch, at the end of this generation we will witness great games

[Braveheart_NZ]

Mike Ybarra posted yesterday on twitter that Developers are free to choose how they use the power of Project Scorpio for games. We have no requirements limiting framerate or fidelity.
https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...
When someone replied but there is a fps parity between Xbox One and Scorpio in multiplayer. Which means a 2013 console is holding a 2017 console back. He replied,
No, there isn't. This is up to the developer to choose, for their games, what they want to do. https://twitter.com/XboxQwi...

[teo72]

For those who do not know. It's the weak Jaguar CPU that's the problem. Both Ps4, ps4pro, Xbone, XBScorpio use this type of CPU... Let's hope next GEN uses RYZEN instead...

[GoldenElf]

Eh. Who cares.