610°

Pachter Factor Episode 106: Taxing Violent Games

Pachter explains why next-gen consoles will Have disk drives, talks Growing Xbox Play anywhere importance.

chrisx2192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

I trust PlayStation and Nintendo will have disk drives(or cartridge in ninty case). but we all know ms wants to go diskless and drm based, but they won't cos that'll be the final nail in the xboxs coffin.

affrogamer2192d ago

I like the option of being able to sell my games when I have no use for them anymore

optimus2192d ago

microsoft announced they are working on a way for consumers to sell back their digital drm, granted not for the same price you bought it for.

darthv722192d ago

@optimus, funny you get disagrees for saying something that many have been asking for and Steam and MS are working to make happen.

Smitty20202192d ago

What if they made a market online so u can sel ur game?

optimus2192d ago

@darth... That's because if that were to happen then it wouldn't fit their embedded hatred for everything Xbox. Not realizing that if Microsoft were to make that happen then sony would eventually do the same and then they would praise sony for "revolutionizing" It. 🙄

bloop2192d ago

Everyone seems to forget about internet access when the "all digital" topic comes up. Where I'm living I have access to 1,000mb fibre. If I drive 5 miles down the road there are places I can't get a 4g signal on my phone. A friend of mine bought TW3 on the PS Store the same time as me. I was in the game literally 10 minutes after starting the download. It took him 3 days to be able to start the game as he only has access to wireless internet where he lives. Until the day we see at least 5g speeds EVERYWHERE, we'll still have physical drives. Console manufacturers would be cutting out a HUGE chunk of potential sales going all digital.

darthv722192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

@bloop... your example is a bit off. You mention you have access to fibre but yet you go down the street and can't get 4g signal. you know those are two different things right.... right? Most times if you have internet to your residence, it is direct wire to your home from the pole on the street (or under ground), not OTA like old school TV. The only time it is OTA is if you choose to go wireless, but if the service is offered... it is working.

As for the 'down the road'... that is the issue with cell towers. Blame the cell carriers for not having enough towers or towers with strong enough transmitters in your area. Besides, if you are going to download anything, chances are it is going to be at your home because of that fast connection.

As years have gone by, the inroads internet companies have been making in rural areas has increased. Sure it may not be 1000mb fiber but even if it is 1mb it is still better than the days of dial-up at 28.8k, 33k or 56k.

Dragonscale2192d ago

@optimus, think its one of ms' better ideas. Theres nothing worse than buying a digital title and finding you don't like it but are stuck with it 4ever which is very possible nowadays with the lack of demos available. A refund or money towards a different title would be great tbh. Hopefully it'll happen on PS4 as well.

bloop2192d ago

@darthv72: Yes, I fully understand those are two different things, and that's exactly my point!! Where I'm living I have fibre with speeds up to 1,000mb but my friend that lives less than 5 miles outside of town has no access to any type of cable broadband, only wireless and gets on average about 3mb. The infrastructure just isn't there, cable or wireless to cater for everyone and it will be a long time coming. Even in Ireland we've had great improvement with internet access through government schemes over the last few years but with that, cable is still really only available in built up areas and cellular has a long way to go in rural areas. I know plenty of people with consoles that can't get internet above 3-5mb speeds in their area. None of those people would be willing to buy a digital only console and have to wait 3 days for a game to download. I don't think we're anywhere near ready to go all digital.

Darrius Cole2191d ago

@optimus - It's not just about being able to sell back you digital rights. In order to truly own a game, you have to be able to give it away for free if you want. You have to be able to give it away to a perfect stranger and you have to be able to sell it for your own negotiated price. If that was possible for digital copies it would break the single game model and thus it will never happen.

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 2191d ago
bluefox7552192d ago

I know they WANT to do that, but I can't imagine they'd be stupid enough to literally repeat the original Xbox One's announcement E3, I don't think they're quite THAT out of touch, not yet at least.

InKnight7s2192d ago

Canaceling exclusives and still lying about cloud without any proof yet with just one game that didn't release since ever. I think they are this stupid.

Goldby2192d ago

They won't get rid of the disk because Bc is a huge part of their strategy.

TheCommentator2192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

Agreed. The ability to play movies is also a plus from a multimedia standpoint. I can't imagine any company ditching the physical drive any time soon, but perhaps an optional model may release without one at some point like "mid-gen".

JackBNimble2192d ago

Wouldn't digital work with BC say for next gen if they think a little bit ahead?

Goldby2192d ago

Yeah but it would be preventing people who still own the discs, or buy them used from being able to play them only way around that would be to have Blu ray disks mandatory for any new win 10 pc and add them to your library via a system check on the Xbox marketplace. Only issue with that, hassle and dome people don't have Blu ray readers in their pc

nitus102192d ago

One of the main reasons for having an inbuilt hard disk drive (HDD) and even the option of playing of a portable HDD via the PS4's USB is the fact that the read performance of an HDD is about 90 to 100MB/sec which allows for faster load times.

The current Bluray read performance is about 27MB/sec which depending on the game can result in longer (by a factor of approximately four) loading times hence the reason for using an HDD. Of course, if you have a solid-state disk (SSD) read performance will be in the order of 500MB/sec plus which is a five-fold increase over an HDD. Obviously to get this performance improvement your console should have at lease a SATA3 bus (up to 600MB/sec) compared to a SATA2 bus (standard in XB1 and PS4 up to 300MB/sec). Unfortunately, SSD's are more expensive than an equivalent HDD although over time the SSD will eventually win out.

It is possible to stream games but you would need a high-performance network and unlimited downloads (cost does factor in here) and for the majority of people worldwide that is not a viable or cost-effective option.

So for the foreseeable future consoles will have either an HDD or SSD to store games on.

BTW. In regard to a portable (ie. Nintendo Switch or Sony Vita) a cartridge is the best solution, however, a cartridge or SD card has about the same performance as an HDD but cost wise an HDD can store considerably more for the price. https://havecamerawilltrave...

RosweeSon2191d ago

For this gen, nothing to say they’ll continue that next Gen certainly not from day 1

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 2191d ago
kevnb2192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

I’m not sure what you mean by drm based, all consoles are drm based. Are you talking about having to always be online or something specific?

Iceball20002192d ago

I think your right. MS is the only one I can see going with maybe two SKUs at launch. One with a Disk Drive and one without at a cheaper price and probably a free digital game for good measure.

2192d ago
2192d ago
wheresmymonkey2192d ago

The PC and mobile markets says hi. Remember them, the much larger sectors. With far more players than consoles.

Every console manufacturer wants to go download only. Its only a matter of time. It really is in their best interests to. With no discs their profit margins will skyrocket.

And every console is already packed full of drm if you would be able to play copied games on them.and run unsigned code.

nitus102191d ago (Edited 2191d ago )

Most games are still run off a hard or solid state disk drive for performance purposes and that includes both consoles, mobile and PCs.

It must be noted that in the case of consoles and PC's to a limited extent that some gamers do prefer physical media to digital download although I do think that over time (approx five to fifteen years) games will be digital download only and physical media will be a thing of the past.

Yes, it is possible to stream games (eg PSNow) but you really do need to have a decent network connection and an unlimited or very large data cap. Most people worldwide don't have that.

Pretty well all games have some sort of DRM associated with them be they for console, mobile or even PC. DRM is a mechanism to thwart piracy but no matter how tight the DRM, pirates will eventually find a way around it and this is very much the case for PCs.

One major issue with PC gaming compared to console gaming is cheating and this can spoil any players online experience. In addition, allowing unsigned code to run on your machine is taking a huge chance of installing malware.

Cobra9512191d ago

The console market isn't either one of those. I have far more control over what I install on PC, how I maintain it, and how I safeguard it. I don't need optical discs to have effectively full ownership of my PC environment and software. That wouldn't fly with closed systems like consoles. I would not accept it.

PUBG2192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

Microsoft has turned into one of the most customer friendly video game companies in the business next to Steam, so I think you're way off the mark.

Just look at digital game gifting, digital game refunds, backward compatibility that let's you use your old Xbox 360 and original Xbox game discs, the play anywhere program which gives you both the console and PC versions of a game for the price of one game, cross platform play, Game Pass for a very low price, including Microsoft exclusive games on day one for their service, and a very generous Games with Gold program, which gives gamers both Xbox One and xbox 360 games for free.

n1kki62192d ago

You realize a disc is DRM correct? Having the disc in your system is the license check. All of the game data lives on the machine after the initial install. I can't remember the last time I put a disc or cartridge into any of my consoles. Actually I can, to play backwards compatible 360 games, otherwise I am digital only.

Cobra9512191d ago

Sure, self-contained, unobtrusive DRM. It works on any compatible console, with or without internet, with or without an account. Your game is as portable as the disc is. All you need to do is insert it, and play--the way it has been forever on consoles, with no added shenanigans.

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 2191d ago
ccgr2192d ago

We use our as blu-ray players too

Gardenia2192d ago

Yes no need to explain at all. It's so obvious that disc aren't going anywhere for a long time

Kribwalker2191d ago

Or our Ultra HD Bluray players too

KaiPow2192d ago

He's spot on about the retailer bit. Companies like GameStop dedicate 1/3 of the store to your console and if it's all digital, what's the point of displaying cases?

Neonridr2192d ago

if it's all digital then what's the point of companies like GameStop?

optimus2192d ago

...hence why they closed a lot of their stores and have changed their business to include collectables and clothing.

Neonridr2192d ago

@optimus - I guess accessories too. But that would be a very sad store :P

optimus2192d ago

Where have you been? GameStop has been and still is a sad store. Most of their collectables are overpriced. Most of the time, you know more about the games than the employees.

Nyxus2192d ago

There's also a group of people who just want to own games physically, and that means there's demand for physical games, at least as an option.

wheresmymonkey2192d ago

True, but if it's cheaper for them to not include a disc drive in their console, will make them more cash by not having to worry about the supply chain that surrounds physical media, destroy the used market, or allow them to.control it, and they know that most gamers will still buy the console regardless. Why would they not axe it?

WolvesDude2191d ago

Err.. Once I've had enough of a game for whatever reason, why can't I sell it? I can for a movie, a car, a house.
I for one won't be buying any next gen console if I can't do this.

mcstorm2191d ago

That true but all 3 will see the difference between digital and phicsal sales. I have bought 2 games from a shop this gen on my Xbox one the rest have been digital. The switch have been all phiscal though

Duke192192d ago

I still really wish the Pro had included an 4K Bluray player. Really hoping the next gen does

shiva12192d ago

They couldnt fit one into this gen and we are talking about next gen...hmmm

darthv722192d ago

but... Sony has statistics that tell them people arent buying movies... they are more interested in streaming. At least that was their reasoning for not having one in the Pro.

Aurenar2192d ago

I prefer streaming to be honest.

Duke192192d ago

Streaming 4k quality still doesn't hold a candle to bluray

jokerisalive2192d ago

I prefer having both streaming AND a dedicated UHD drive like the competition. Streaming quality is never as good as an actual uhd bluray disc. There are lots of people who buy discs and have a library of films they own physically.

The 10th Rider2192d ago

@Duke19,

Yeah, I'd take a Blu-ray disc over a 4K stream. On top of dealing with compression, you've gotta have some really solid internet with no data cap for 4K streaming to be worth it. Comcast is the only option where I live and they just rolled out data caps to my state.

nitus102191d ago

@The 10th Rider

It looks like the removal of net neutrality is starting to rear its ugly head in your area.

WolvesDude2191d ago

I prefer having the choice.

The 10th Rider2191d ago

@nitus10,

It has nothing to do with net neutrality . . . Comcast started rolling out data caps to most states in 2016.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 2191d ago
2192d ago
jokerisalive2192d ago (Edited 2192d ago )

it should and the Pro should have had one too. it would not have cost Sony much and would have been nice to have a 4k drive in a machine that can output games at 4k. I get its a games machine but the fact the competition includes it in both low and high end versions of their systems should be enough to make them include it as well for the high end Pro.

OpenGL2192d ago

I think the PS5 will support UHD Blu-ray because they're going to need higher capacity discs, 50GB will no longer cut it. They didn't feel like including UHD purely for movie playback was worth the cost as games would still always have to be on regular 25-50GB Blu-rays to maintain compatibility with all PS4s.

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60°

FanimeCon 2024 | Persona / Shin Megami Tensei Cosplay Gathering

The Persona / Shin Megami Tensei cosplay gathering allowed fans of the acclaimed JRPG series to meet up during FanimeCon 2024.

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8bitdigi.com
470°

Days Gone Director Says Bend's Project Costs Over $250M; Says PS Co-CEO Doesn't Want 2 Zombies Games

Days Gone director claims Sony has already poured in at least a $250M in Bend's project; says Days Gone sold more than Death Stranding.

shinoff21831d 8h ago

Well that sucks. Seems they want more online trash. I'd rather of had the sequel if it was single player

MrNinosan18h ago

What online trash games did PS Studios release last 10 years?

Notellin16h ago

The past has nothing to do with the future. This is such a terrible argument. Everyone knows about their current live service push.

_SilverHawk_14h ago

It's so tragic what happened to days gone. It is such an amazing game but bandwagoners trashed it and it underperformed in it's launch year. Days gone is the best open world zombie game released in the past five years. I was recently playing it on pc and I'm still amazed by it.

Games are very expensive to make and it seems like it's normal for a AAA game to cost over a quarter billion to make so if a quality game like days gone greatly underperforms then people shouldn't be upset when they see a lot of GAAS. I still remember a lot of bandwagoners calling days gone trash but years later it's now amazing when it's considered a failure by sony.

If a game isn't the best thing seen since hats with pockets then a lot of gamers who haven't played it automatically calls it rubbish and whoever made it should be incarcerated

Cacabunga13h ago(Edited 13h ago)

Co CEO prefers gamers to boycott.. so be it. I’ll never buy a gaas.
Just imagine buying a game you cannot replay in some years.. this shit must stop.

Days Gone did zombies in a very original way. The story was also so engaging. You actually only meet Zombie hordes later in the game. There are many more enemy groups to deal with.

MrNinosan12h ago

@Notelin
I am one of the few who bought Days Gone on release day and loved it completely.
However, "more online trash" is phrased like Sony has put out alot of trash online games.
We got what, 2 games? Helldivers 2 and GT7, 2 of the most sold Playstation games where both is loved by millions.

You, me and especially shinoff has no idea if Fairgames, Marathon and Concord will be trash.

Just because we (as in you and me) don't love or support online games, doesn't mean millions of other do.

And we don't know what Bend Studio is working with? We don't know if they're forced to make a online game or another amazing single player experience.

The only thing we do know is that it's not Days Gone, sadly due to poor sales the first 6 months.

shinoff218310h ago(Edited 9h ago)

More online trash wasmt meant how insee it comes across. I should've worded it different I was meaning the focus they currently have on it.

Anything online is online trash to me. How long did naughty dog spend on that dumba last of us multiplayer, how about Concord, or even the other couple we hear about. I fk with Sony because rpgs and their 1st party single player games. Been like that for years. I hate seeing them waste time, money, and talent on trash. I understand bot every game is gonna be for me but this focus they've seem to had on multiplayer is extremely disheartening. Even at the state of play the only things I was really feeling were Astrobot and silent hill 2 and I'm content with that, not everything is for me. It's just the online focus I hate. Ms bought up 3 to 4 wrpgs developers, Sony just ignores rpgs 1st party wise.

And a days gone 2 would've been much better then whatever online sht bend is working on. I do know sometimes I get very idk emotional. I do need to work on toning that down a bit lol

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 10h ago
-Foxtrot1d 8h ago

It would be a shame if it was true that Hermen never gave the franchise a chance simply because he didn't like it and they already had a "Zombie" game with TLOU.

NaughtyDog are most likely moving onto a new IP next so it would have been the perfect time to do it.

ThinkThink1d ago

Here's where xbox steps in and releases state of decay 3 day and date on ps5.

shinoff21839h ago

I mean it's not out of the realm of possibility at this point.

Grilla17h ago

Days gone 2 was canceled before Herman was in charge. That happened like 4 years ago.

vfl52316h ago

4 years ago he was head of Playstation Studios. He would've probably had a hand in the cancelation.

Notellin16h ago

Man two seconds of research could have saved you from this comment. Amazing work Grilla you fit in with the uniformed N4G community who speaks before verifying anything that they say.

Redemption-6414h ago

Maybe encourage people to buy the game at full price and not when it's heavily discounted or go on plus. If this game had sold well when it was full priced a sequel would have been in the works. They made a single-player game that most people didn't support until they dropped the price.

Cacabunga13h ago

The guy’s just a moron.. he should have stayed within game development. His choices will have a terrible impact on the brand in the long run.

tay87013h ago(Edited 3h ago)

Dude is pretty pathetic. Sounds like a guy who's girl left him for someone better. Always talking about days gone sequel that never was, even though he is no longer at bend and hasnt been for a while. I for one am not upset about the lack of a sequel. It is one of the worst 1st party games in recent memory. Completely jank, played like an xbox game. The only redeeming quality was the hordes.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 3h ago
excaliburps18h ago

Yep. Kind of weird since it wasn't a sales flop, no?

I know we have to take what Ross says with a grain of salt since we're hearing just one side of the story, but even so, the game wasn't bad at all. Heck, it's my brother's favorite last-gen game from what I recall.

The amount of zombies on screen, imagine that with the PS5 and SSD? That would be insanely fun!

Grilla17h ago

Most copies were sold on sale. Not enough ppl bought it at full price. I paid 20$ for it 6 -7 months after release.

Notellin16h ago(Edited 15h ago)

Yeah we should never believe the creators side until we hear the corporate/big business side as history has shown we should always believe billion dollar corporations.

What a bootlicker statement.

derek11h ago

@Notellin, of course you'll believe an embittered ex-employee with an axe to grind because it's evil Sony he's complaining about. You guys act like days gone was this huge success and somehow Sony hates easy money a sequel would have generated. The game was mid and so was the response to it. They're still supporting the developer who is making a new ip that could be great.

shinoff21839h ago

Days gone was fantastic. I bought day one but didn't get around to it for months. When I finally did I was pissed at myself for waiting so long lol

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 9h ago
P_Bomb18h ago

Well I don’t want 10 live service games, but they have no problem doing that lol. Ugh.

CrimsonWing6917h ago(Edited 17h ago)

Oh great so we only get what the big wigs want… y’know, the people that really have their fingers on the pulse of what their consumers want. Faaaaantastic!

rippermcrip14h ago

Well consider they know the sales... they do know what the consumer wants.

It sold shit.

-Foxtrot9h ago(Edited 9h ago)

But if it’s true what this guy says it sold better than Death Stranding

Yet that got a sequel and Kojima aside out of them both DS didn’t really NEED a sequel compared to Days Gone which ended on such a cliff hanger twist.

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120°

Can FSR 3 frame generation deliver the 120fps dream on PS5 and Xbox?

Frame generation technology has arrived on consoles, amplifying frame-rates and potentially transforming experiences.

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eurogamer.net
purple1011d 11h ago

adds between 8.3-15.3 milliseconds of latency on the game they tested, - no thanks

darksky17h ago

Base latency is 130.8ms and frame gen takes that up to 139.1ms. A 7% increase in latency is hardly a deal breaker.

Zenzuu17h ago

That's hardly a deal breaker and not really noticeable. Even the folks at Digital Foundry said so as well.

darthv721d 11h ago

Impressive results... sadly I don't have a 120hz display. I was thinking this technique could increase fps on any game that supports it regardless of the display.

purple1011d 11h ago (Edited 1d 11h ago )

I have a vrr telly in the lounge,

On another point, what if it were the other way around where the developer aims for higher fps, then used something like pssr to make the resolution higher, that might be better?

Any which way, PS5 pro sure looks interesting now, being they have already doubled frame rate, with JUST just this fsr3.0

sagapo16h ago

It’s up to dev’s to implement FSR 3 support tho but most probably will I guess (hope).

Eonjay2h ago

Yes it would increase the framerate but it would add more noticeable latency. The impact of latency goes down the more natural frames produced. So a monitor that can push bast 60 will naturally allow the game to operate much smoother. Add VRR to this and now you have a much more enjoyable experience.

BlackDoomAx18h ago

Can it deliver the 60fps dream?

purple1018h ago(Edited 8h ago)

no, it delivers approx 80fps.

which is why I say why not target 60fps with this new tech and use the upscaling pssr, (Sonys version of Nvidia's DLSS, that seems so popular in the pc realm)

then we have best of both, better believe ps5pro will be doing all the above.

andy8517h ago

Now I've extensively tried it I'm not too fussed about 120 fps. Give me a locked 60 and more details and I'm more than happy

anast12h ago(Edited 12h ago)

120 is a bit slow. My eyes can't look at anything less than 260fps.

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